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NET THERMAL RADIATION : You in a room as a reference.



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05-07-2020 23:24
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7455)
tmiddles wrote: If you mean that "light" refers to what human beings can see OK. A useless point to make though.

You are once again conflating units of measure, and that is a Category 3 violation of Local Ordinance § TMID

Technically, I'm not supposed to waste time explaining errors that you make more or less intentionally but I happen to be in a good mood.

Radiance is Power normalized over Area.
Light is a form of energy, specifically electromagnetic energy.

They're obviously not the same thing, yet you decided to waste everyone's time by trying to argue that they are, and then you lashed out with insults due to your frustration over being a total moron ... which you brought upon yourself with your solemn vows of ignorance and obedience to your slavemasters who will be doing your thinking for you from now on.

In summary, Category 3 violation.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 01:12
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
Radiance is Power normalized over Area.
Light is a form of energy, specifically electromagnetic energy.
They're obviously not the same thing,...


So just to confirm ITN is correct here:
Into the Night wrote:
Radiance is not light.

But wrong here?:
link
Into the Night wrote:
You can measure radiance by measuring light. Radiance is light.
link
Into the Night wrote:
Blackbody radiance is light emitted by vibrating molecules due to temperature.


Also you are saying "radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?
06-07-2020 01:43
duncan61
★★★☆☆
(570)
You have yet to respond to the example of this topic. How is it that a human body maintains body temperature if it is not absorbing radiance from it's cooler surroundings?
Edited on 05-07-2020 11:42

I thought we ate food and wore clothes
06-07-2020 01:48
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
duncan61 wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
You have yet to respond to the example of this topic. How is it that a human body maintains body temperature if it is not absorbing radiance from it's cooler surroundings?


I thought we ate food and wore clothes


Yes indeed. The available energy from food is calculated in the first post Duncan, about 1/7th what is needed. ITN/IBD believe you cannot reduce radiance AND that warmer objects can't absorb radiance from cooler ones. So clothes do nothing according to them aside from reducing conduction/convection.
06-07-2020 05:41
James___
★★★★★
(3161)
IBdaMann wrote:

For those of you who are new to this forum and for those who have forgotten, tgoebbles does not recognize a daytime side of the moon because it exceeds 240F (120C). This goes against his religious dogma that requires him to believe atmospheres make a planet's surface specifically warmer ... and that black people cannot be racist. The fact is that *no* daytime temperature anywhere on earth ever gets anywhere close to the oven temperatures on the daytime side of the moon which has no atmosphere. tgoebbles cannot reconcile this reality so he deludes himself into denying it.

There ... I have refreshed everyone's memory.


.



I actually did a post about that. I referred to it because a planet's surface composition affects both temperature and radiance. I think to say "Net Thermal Radiation" might be an over simplification. There's nothing that says why it matters.
If you were to consider the walls around you, their surfaces REFRACT light. That's almost too basic. Kind of why I don't get what this thread is about.
It's like when steel is heated and then it emits radiation. It's not a big deal. And what the video also suggests is that heat can come from the interior of a planet.

https://youtu.be/Wvm4hurlock

p.s., seems I broke my thumb when doing some wood working. Have to take it easy now and hope ya'all like the video.

Edited on 06-07-2020 05:43
06-07-2020 07:05
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7455)
tgoebbles wrote: So just to confirm ITN is correct here: ....
But wrong here?

No. I take it you will never grasp the concept of context.

Within the context of explaining the dynamics of thermal radiation, Into the Night was obviously accurately describing what was occurring.

Within the context of you conflating units of measure, e.g. work with normalized power, radiance with temperature, etc ... it is appropriate for others to point out your error as a courtesy to you to explain why your argument makes no sense.

Into the Night is correct. You still hose yourself by not grasping context.

tgoebbles wrote: Also you are saying "radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?


I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 08:50
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:...deleted IAW tmiddles ordinance #1...


Denial of science. RQAA.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
06-07-2020 18:22
James___
★★★★★
(3161)
duncan61 wrote:
You have yet to respond to the example of this topic. How is it that a human body maintains body temperature if it is not absorbing radiance from it's cooler surroundings?
Edited on 05-07-2020 11:42

I thought we ate food and wore clothes



Capillaries reduce blood flow through the outer layers of skin. This keeps more heat in the body.
06-07-2020 22:01
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
So you're saying ITN is correct in both the statements that radiance is and is not light. Whatever.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?

How was that not a yes or no question? I'm not arguing they are because that statement has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

So you're saying that:
radiance = work
and that
electromagnetic energy = power
?

An increase in temperature is not "work". "work" is displacement of an object and has nothing to do with what we are discussing.

"power" is the amount of energy transferred or converted per unit time and so EM is not power. The rate of conversion of EM to something else, like thermal energy would be power.

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN
06-07-2020 22:37
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1211)
tmiddles wrote:
So you're saying ITN is correct in both the statements that radiance is and is not light. Whatever.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?

How was that not a yes or no question? I'm not arguing they are because that statement has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

So you're saying that:
radiance = work
and that
electromagnetic energy = power
?

An increase in temperature is not "work". "work" is displacement of an object and has nothing to do with what we are discussing.

"power" is the amount of energy transferred or converted per unit time and so EM is not power. The rate of conversion of EM to something else, like thermal energy would be power.

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN


This post is an egregious violation of the Official tmiddles Preemption Ordinance. It is summarily dismissed.
Edited on 06-07-2020 22:39
06-07-2020 23:32
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7455)
gfm7175 wrote:This post is an egregious violation of the Official tmiddles Preemption Ordinance. It is summarily dismissed.

How right you are! It was far too egregious to be accidental; it had to be intentional.

It's a good thing for tmiddles that there are no monetary fines associated with this ordinance.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 23:37
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
How right you are!...
So you won't be responding IBD?
06-07-2020 23:48
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7455)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
How right you are!...
So you won't be responding IBD?


What a coincidence, I was just wondering if you were going to be answering any of the questions I posed to you without EVADING ... even if to admit that you never had any sort of answer.

1) What are the unambiguous definitions of Global Warming, Climate Change and Greenhouse Effect that neither violate nor deny physics? [Status: Unanswered]
2) Why should any rational adult believe in either Global Warming, Climate Change or Greenhouse Effect? [Status: Unanswered]
3) How can I unambiguously demonstrate to my children thermal energy flowing from cooler to warmer? [Status: Unanswered]
4) How can I know the temperature of a large, unspecified volume, e.g. Denver, to within, say, 10degF with only one temperature measurement, e.g. the Denver airport? [Status: Unanswered]
5) What are the unambiguous definitions of "race," "negro," "black people," "white people," "brown people," "white supremacy," "white nationalsim," "white nationalist," "white supremacist," "black supremacist" and "racist"? [Status: Unanswered]
6) Is there an official list of races? [Status: Unanswered]
- 6a) How do I determine my own race or that of my children? [Status: Unanswered]
7) Why should any rational adult believe that there is a problem of racism in the United States? [Status: Unanswered]
8) Why should law abiding citizens be rendered defenseless before rampant violent crime? [Status: Unanswered]
9) Where in the 1st Amendment is "hate" prohibited such that, if shown, a prosecutor can throw someone in jail for having had that emotion/thought? [Status: Unanswered]
10) Why do you claim that an atmosphere only makes a planet's or moon's solid surface hotter since you are fully aware that no place at the bottom of earth's atmosphere ever reaches anywhere close to the daytime temperatures of the moon's atmosphereless solid surface? [Status: Unanswered]
11) If we were to discover that Lisa Gherardini was actually a shitty person, would that justify Black Lives Matter storming the Louvre to destroy the Mona Lisa? [Status: Unanswered]
12) Why should we destroy artifacts and relics pertaining to history that we never want to forget or repeat? [Status: Unanswered]
13) The Aztecs committed genocide of many other tribes and practiced human sacrifice; should their artwork and artifacts be destroyed? [Status: Unanswered]
14) Why would you or anyone pretend to be a judge of what history is to be revised or destroyed? [Status: Unanswered]
15) In what substantive/meaningful way do the platforms of Black Lives Matter, ANTIFA, The National Organization of Women, the DNC, Communist Party USA and Socialist Party USA ... differ? [Status: Unanswered]

... and I take it that you won't be reading my answer to your question, that you are just going to ask again as though I have never answered you.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 23:59
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:...I was just wondering if you were going to be answering any of the questions...
On this topic. So? This your way to duck out?
07-07-2020 00:27
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1211)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:...I was just wondering if you were going to be answering any of the questions...
On this topic. So? This your way to duck out?

Nope. The evasion is YOURS. You are refusing to answer the questions that will allow any sort of meaningful discussion with you to ensue...
07-07-2020 00:41
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
gfm7175 wrote:...questions that will allow any sort of meaningful discussion with you to ensue...
About Aztecs? What exactly is needed to continue this debate:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?


Hmmm?
07-07-2020 02:52
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote: ...deleted IAW tmiddles ordinance #1...


No argument presented. RQAA. Semantics fallacies. Denial of science.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 07-07-2020 02:52
07-07-2020 02:53
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
How right you are!...
So you won't be responding IBD?

RQAA.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
07-07-2020 02:55
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:...I was just wondering if you were going to be answering any of the questions...
On this topic. So? This your way to duck out?


Mantra 7...29. No argument presented. RQAA.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
07-07-2020 02:56
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:...questions that will allow any sort of meaningful discussion with you to ensue...
About Aztecs? What exactly is needed to continue this debate:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?


Hmmm?


Mantra 2...29...

No argument presented. RQAA.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
09-07-2020 01:15
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:...deleted IAW tmiddles ordinance #1...Mantras 6...10...20u...20g...20v...10b...


No argument presented. RQAA. Denial of science. Semantics fallacies.

Answer the questions put to you.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
09-07-2020 01:23
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBD if you aren't going to respond to the post below let me know and I'll stop asking.

tmiddles wrote:
So you're saying ITN is correct in both the statements that radiance is and is not light. Whatever.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?

How was that not a yes or no question? I'm not arguing they are because that statement has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

So you're saying that:
radiance = work
and that
electromagnetic energy = power
?

An increase in temperature is not "work". "work" is displacement of an object and has nothing to do with what we are discussing.

"power" is the amount of energy transferred or converted per unit time and so EM is not power. The rate of conversion of EM to something else, like thermal energy would be power.


"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN
09-07-2020 01:50
James___
★★★★★
(3161)
tmiddles wrote:
IBD if you aren't going to respond to the post below let me know and I'll stop asking.

tmiddles wrote:
So you're saying ITN is correct in both the statements that radiance is and is not light. Whatever.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Also you are saying
"radiance" is NOT electromagnetic energy?

I'm saying that work is not power. Are you arguing they are?

How was that not a yes or no question? I'm not arguing they are because that statement has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

So you're saying that:
radiance = work
and that
electromagnetic energy = power
?

An increase in temperature is not "work". "work" is displacement of an object and has nothing to do with what we are discussing.

"power" is the amount of energy transferred or converted per unit time and so EM is not power. The rate of conversion of EM to something else, like thermal energy would be power.


"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN



I'm missing your point. I've never really seen where electromagnetic energy is considered as power. Power often times is calculated as A = w/v or amps = watts divided by volts.
If an increase in temperature expands gases which moves something, then the increase in temperature is responsible for work being performed. It is moving some thing. The Atmos clock converts thermal energy into work. In this instance, a change in temperature is directly proportional to work being performed.
https://www.jaeger-lecoultre.com/us/en/watches/atmos.html

If you want to know, I am pursuing work which would have scientists reconsider why Venus is hot. The data that has been collected is in conflict with itself which is why I am interested.
09-07-2020 04:02
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13273)
tmiddles wrote:...deleted IAW tmiddles ordinance #1...Mantra 6...29...


No argument presented. RQAA.

Answer the questions put to you.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Page 8 of 8<<<678





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