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Dentists and covid



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01-12-2020 11:34
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
keepit wrote:
I wouldn't characterize them as "so effective" as you say. I'd say that they help but aren't foolproof.

They are completely ineffective. Masks do not stop a virus.
keepit wrote:
No one is saying "covering your face will be 100 effective". Where did you get that idea?

They are completely ineffective. Masks do not stop a virus.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
01-12-2020 11:38
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
keepit wrote:
Sorry, i don't know but common sense says the masks will catch some virions.

Masks are completely ineffective against viruses. They do not stop a virus at all.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
01-12-2020 11:43
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
HarveyH55 wrote:
How can masks be so effective, and yet so many places are considering basement-dwelling mandates, because of their high infection rates? President Trump held huge rallies, masks and social distancing optional. !0,000+ attendance, and there were some infections, but not thousands, as implied. Here in Florida, we've had quite a few large gatherings, masks and social distancing optional (not enforced), and we are still in our Phase 3 reopening, with no indication of going back to basement-dwelling. This virus doesn't seem to be so highly contagious, or spread so easily, that mask make such a huge difference. Even habitual mask wearers and basement-dwellers get infected. What's worse, is that it's a cold virus, and most of the people have no problem recovering, like an other cold or flu virus.


While it is a minor virus, it is not a cold virus. Those are from the rhinovirus series. Covid19 is from the SARS/Covid series. Flu is from the influenza series. SARS/Covid series viruses have often been called 'the flu' before by the CDC and others.

It's symptoms are very much like a common cold. It's infection vector is very similar as well.
Just as with the common cold, masks will stop it.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
Edited on 01-12-2020 11:44
01-12-2020 11:58
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(9089)
keepit wrote:
The point is they don't have controlling authority over people. They process information.

The AMA and the ADA have the power to shut down any doctor/dentist not OBEYING them. When they order unnecessary facemask mandates, We the People don't get medical/dental services unless we wear masks.

That's TOO much power over people.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
01-12-2020 17:16
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
IBdaMann wrote:
Explain how you believe masks with > 3 micron hole stop 120 nanometer viruses.

.

IF I were a Cultist, I would respond to your inquiry with: "but, but Brownian motion!!"...

It's insane the amount of times that Brownian motion gets brought up with regard to this, as if it somehow stops a smaller virus from going through the larger pores of a mask...
Edited on 01-12-2020 17:23
01-12-2020 17:20
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
keepit wrote:
Sorry, i don't know but common sense says the masks will catch some virions.

What good is "catching" SOME of the virus??
Edited on 01-12-2020 17:24
01-12-2020 17:31
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
IBdaMann wrote:
keepit wrote:
The point is they don't have controlling authority over people. They process information.

The AMA and the ADA have the power to shut down any doctor/dentist not OBEYING them. When they order unnecessary facemask mandates, We the People don't get medical/dental services unless we wear masks.

That's TOO much power over people.

.

Bingo!

In order to receive dental services at my dentist at the moment, I must follow this process:
[1] Put on a mask.
[2] Have my temperature taken.
[3] Fill out (and sign off on) a covid-related questionnaire sheet.
[4] Rinse out my mouth with hydrogen peroxide.
[5] Receive dental services.

Before the coronahoax, the process looked like this:
[1] Receive dental services.
01-12-2020 17:42
keepit
★★★★★
(2235)
The medical n95's have holes that are small enough to catch virions.
The industrial n95's have much larger holes only meant to catch industrial particles. They have 10 micron holes i think. The virions are contained in water droplets which get stopped by the medical n95's.

gfm,
I think only the state medical boards can take away a medical license. They aren't part of the ama, ada.

What good is catching some of the virus you ask. Do you have to ask? Good grief.
Edited on 01-12-2020 17:45
01-12-2020 17:56
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
keepit wrote:
The medical n95's have holes that are small enough to catch virions.
The industrial n95's have much larger holes only meant to catch industrial particles.

The masks are exactly the same, except for the biocide treatment and the packaging. Masks are completely useless against viruses. The medical N95 mask is good against some bacteria for a couple of hours at most.
keepit wrote:
They have 10 micron holes i think.

3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.
keepit wrote:
The virions are contained in water droplets which get stopped by the medical n95's.

Viruses don't stay in water droplets. Masks are completely ineffective. You do not have to sneeze or cough to contract covid19. The virus is already in the air and on every surface.
keepit wrote:
gfm,
I think only the state medical boards can take away a medical license. They aren't part of the ama, ada.

Correct. Only the State can take away a medical license, and only through specific procedures written into law. Mask requirements are not law. They are edicts. They are unlawful. Governors do not have the authority to be kings.
keepit wrote:
What good is catching some of the virus you ask. Do you have to ask? Good grief.

Then you just denied your own argument. You are being irrational. You are now locked in paradox.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
01-12-2020 18:54
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
keepit wrote:
The medical n95's have holes that are small enough to catch virions.

No, they don't. Viruses still pass right through the pores.

keepit wrote:
The industrial n95's have much larger holes only meant to catch industrial particles.

No, they don't. Likewise, they don't stop viruses.

keepit wrote:
They have 10 micron holes i think.

No, they don't. See the N95 specs.

keepit wrote:
The virions are contained in water droplets which get stopped by the medical n95's.

Viruses are not solely contained inside of water droplets. Viruses are not necessarily bound, nor forever-bound, to water droplets. Water droplets evaporate. Viruses are already in the air and on surfaces.

If masks worked to stop viruses, then maskholes would not be getting sick. Maskholes ARE getting sick, however, so masks are obviously not working for that purpose. Have you ever seen how people dress up when exposing themselves to deadly diseases (such as ebola)? Let's just say that they are not simply wearing a cloth mask... or a paper mask... or even an N95 mask...

keepit wrote:
gfm,
I think only the state medical boards can take away a medical license. They aren't part of the ama, ada.

Correct, but not what was being discussed.

keepit wrote:
What good is catching some of the virus you ask. Do you have to ask? Good grief.

Yes. What good is being accomplished by a mask "catching" SOME viruses? (as you are claiming happens) ...

According to your reasoning, other viruses are still not being "caught" thus those "free" viruses are still causing infection in people all the same...

The spread of covid is not being stopped nor prevented in any way by simply wearing a mask, or staying six feet away from people, or putting plastic coverings over remote controls and credit card machines, or crippling the economy.

Feel free to become a guinea pig for one of these mRNA "vaccines"... I most certainly am not going to be one...
Edited on 01-12-2020 18:56
01-12-2020 22:49
HarveyH55Profile picture★★★★★
(3369)
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
How can masks be so effective, and yet so many places are considering basement-dwelling mandates, because of their high infection rates? President Trump held huge rallies, masks and social distancing optional. !0,000+ attendance, and there were some infections, but not thousands, as implied. Here in Florida, we've had quite a few large gatherings, masks and social distancing optional (not enforced), and we are still in our Phase 3 reopening, with no indication of going back to basement-dwelling. This virus doesn't seem to be so highly contagious, or spread so easily, that mask make such a huge difference. Even habitual mask wearers and basement-dwellers get infected. What's worse, is that it's a cold virus, and most of the people have no problem recovering, like an other cold or flu virus.


While it is a minor virus, it is not a cold virus. Those are from the rhinovirus series. Covid19 is from the SARS/Covid series. Flu is from the influenza series. SARS/Covid series viruses have often been called 'the flu' before by the CDC and others.

It's symptoms are very much like a common cold. It's infection vector is very similar as well.
Just as with the common cold, masks will stop it.


There are two coronaviruses in the group, we call the 'common cold'. I'm no microbiologist, and able to separate specific 'breeds'. Other than a fancy name assigned, it's still functions like any other cold virus. The naming, isn't that important, other than the 'fear factor' it adds. It really hasn't lived up to a scary epidemic either, about 3-4% of the population has tested positive. Little skeptical about the fatalities. Viruses don't generally kill their host, and it's only be a a fraction of 1%. Not exactly the fast spreading, deadly disease, it's being sold as, on TV.

Living in Florida during the pandemic has been interesting. Our governor is anti-mandate, let the people and businesses decide. There are some things, his hands are kind of tied on, if he wants in on federal assistance, which can use to help out those who wish to adhere to the CDC guidelines. Not to mention, some things like government run stuff, need to follow the guidelines. After the initial 30 days lockdown, we opened up the beaches. We were ridiculed and warned of huge spikes. Never happened. Beaches made good sense, and minimal risk. Hot, sunny, UVC rays, saltwater... All very hostile to viruses. We opened bars, which, you know aren't going to follow an guidelines too closely. Most, are doing okay, and seem to be about normal. Orange County (Orlando) is run by democrats, Jerry Demmings, and he has a compliance task force, and encourages people to tattle. His wife, is Rep. Val Demmings, elected 2018, and was part of the impeachment team. Mostly, even with our loose compliance, we aren't doing any worse than the Nazi states, better than many. The virus is going to spread, regardless of what we do. The vaccines aren't going to save us, although it's likely to be called a victory, around the end of next year. The numbers will drop off, mostly because fewer tests given. I figure on another 2-3 years of outbreaks, before it really calms down.
02-12-2020 19:14
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
How can masks be so effective, and yet so many places are considering basement-dwelling mandates, because of their high infection rates? President Trump held huge rallies, masks and social distancing optional. !0,000+ attendance, and there were some infections, but not thousands, as implied. Here in Florida, we've had quite a few large gatherings, masks and social distancing optional (not enforced), and we are still in our Phase 3 reopening, with no indication of going back to basement-dwelling. This virus doesn't seem to be so highly contagious, or spread so easily, that mask make such a huge difference. Even habitual mask wearers and basement-dwellers get infected. What's worse, is that it's a cold virus, and most of the people have no problem recovering, like an other cold or flu virus.


While it is a minor virus, it is not a cold virus. Those are from the rhinovirus series. Covid19 is from the SARS/Covid series. Flu is from the influenza series. SARS/Covid series viruses have often been called 'the flu' before by the CDC and others.

It's symptoms are very much like a common cold. It's infection vector is very similar as well.
Just as with the common cold, masks will stop it.


There are two coronaviruses in the group, we call the 'common cold'.

There are 19 known viruses in the SARS/Covid series. None of them are called the Common cold, except by you. They have been called a 'flu' before, with the notable exception of covid19.
HarveyH55 wrote:
I'm no microbiologist, and able to separate specific 'breeds'.

You don't need to be. They are, however, separate breeds, like cats and dogs. Sure, they both have four feet, and they both have fur, and they are both mammals, but they are separate breeds (if you can call a virus a 'breed' at all, since they are not living tissue).
HarveyH55 wrote:
Other than a fancy name assigned, it's still functions like any other cold virus.

No, it infects similar tissue, but it is still part of the respiratory tract. Like rhinoviruses, covid/SARS viruses are airborne, and are transmitted by air or by contact with a contaminated surface. UV light, and exposure to certain chemicals like bleach or hydrogen peroxide is pretty effective at destroying any of these viruses.
HarveyH55 wrote:
The naming, isn't that important, other than the 'fear factor' it adds.

Some varieties of the SARS/Covid or Influenza series viruses are actually dangerous. Covid19 isn't one of them.
HarveyH55 wrote:
It really hasn't lived up to a scary epidemic either, about 3-4% of the population has tested positive. Little skeptical about the fatalities.

I'm skeptical about the numbers testing positive. I think States are making up 'infections' and 'positive test cases' to scam money from the federal government. This in turn winds up as part of the CDC records.
HarveyH55 wrote:
Viruses don't generally kill their host, and it's only be a a fraction of 1%.

Covid19 doesn't kill directly. It has killed no one. The pneumonia it can induce is what kills. Pneumonia can be treated, if caught early enough.
HarveyH55 wrote:
Not exactly the fast spreading, deadly disease, it's being sold as, on TV.

I wouldn't know. I don't watch TV. I haven't in decades. I don't bother. I do understand, however, that you actually mean the Fake News agencies, such as the Associated Press, CNN, and MSNBC.
HarveyH55 wrote:
Living in Florida during the pandemic has been interesting. Our governor is anti-mandate, let the people and businesses decide. There are some things, his hands are kind of tied on, if he wants in on federal assistance, which can use to help out those who wish to adhere to the CDC guidelines. Not to mention, some things like government run stuff, need to follow the guidelines. After the initial 30 days lockdown, we opened up the beaches. We were ridiculed and warned of huge spikes. Never happened. Beaches made good sense, and minimal risk. Hot, sunny, UVC rays, saltwater... All very hostile to viruses. We opened bars, which, you know aren't going to follow an guidelines too closely. Most, are doing okay, and seem to be about normal. Orange County (Orlando) is run by democrats, Jerry Demmings, and he has a compliance task force, and encourages people to tattle. His wife, is Rep. Val Demmings, elected 2018, and was part of the impeachment team. Mostly, even with our loose compliance, we aren't doing any worse than the Nazi states, better than many. The virus is going to spread, regardless of what we do. The vaccines aren't going to save us, although it's likely to be called a victory, around the end of next year. The numbers will drop off, mostly because fewer tests given. I figure on another 2-3 years of outbreaks, before it really calms down.

It's sure made a mess out of Disney World, and probably of Universal Studios Florida as well. My brother lives in Florida, in The Villages. He has seen no marked increase in deaths there, and neither have the clinics in The villages. They haven't been holding their nightly town square parties for awhile though. Kinda dull around The Villages right now.

At least Florida is leaving the decision up to it's people, and the government is stepping back from trying to control everyone.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
02-12-2020 19:48
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.



What is the exact spec for the N95 mask? I keep reading from everywhere that it is 0.3 microns. Still bigger than the coronavirus but the diference is not as dramatic as I initially though.
02-12-2020 20:14
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★★
(2109)
Xadoman wrote:
3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.



What is the exact spec for the N95 mask? I keep reading from everywhere that it is 0.3 microns. Still bigger than the coronavirus but the diference is not as dramatic as I initially though.


N95 is .3 microns.
Covid viron is 120 nanometers
....so 25 times smaller.

Imagine a 50 lane highway and a one lane roadblock in the center.

What I want to know is if one viron is enough to infect a person. Does viral load matter?


ANY mask is better than no mask, even if you have to resort to putting a tightly fit plastic bag over your head-COVIDEXPERTGFM

I don't have a GoFundMe, but I do have a PO Box (#666)-COVIDEXPERTGFM
Edited on 02-12-2020 21:00
02-12-2020 21:25
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
Xadoman wrote:
3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.


What is the exact spec for the N95 mask? I keep reading from everywhere that it is 0.3 microns. Still bigger than the coronavirus but the diference is not as dramatic as I initially though.

My understanding is that an N95 is rated for 95% of particles 0.3 micron and larger. That still won't stop viruses.

However, people typically aren't wearing N95s around. They are typically wearing around "paper masks" (usually blue in color), which are rated for 95% of particles 3.0 microns and larger. That won't stop viruses either. Neither will cloth masks, or bandannas, or neck gaiters, or anything else that you typically see people wearing around.

People also typically aren't wearing their masks in a way that are properly fitted. Wearing masks in such a manner renders their filtration specs null and void.
02-12-2020 21:45
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
N95 is .3 microns.
Covid viron is 120 nanometers
....so 25 times smaller.


The diameter of the covid virion is 0,125 microns. The diameter of the filter hole is 0,3/0,125=2,4 times bigger than the coronavirus.
The surface area of the filter hole is 5,76 times bigger than the coronavirus.
02-12-2020 22:18
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(9089)
gfm7175 wrote: However, people typically aren't wearing N95s around.

Correct. 99.9% of people are wearing the earloop facemasks which are rated based on filtration of 3μm particles. Unfortunately, moisture droplets of 5μm that the facemasks stop evaporate in one second leaving it COVID-19 contents floating freely in the air and passing freely through the mask. All other free-floating COVID-19 viruses simply pass through the facemasks like they aren't even there.

It is appropriate to discuss N95 facemasks only within the context of clinical settings where they are actually used.

gfm7175 wrote:They are typically wearing around "paper masks" (usually blue in color), which are rated for 95% of particles 3.0 microns and larger. That won't stop viruses either. Neither will cloth masks, or bandannas, or neck gaiters, or anything else that you typically see people wearing around.

Spot on. You've done your homework.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
03-12-2020 10:44
HarveyH55Profile picture★★★★★
(3369)
In a clinical setting, masks are replaced regularly. The same mask isn't used all day. They are only worn in the presence of patents at risk of infection. The use a different type of respirator, is it's the patient, who poses the risk of infecting the health care workers. The masks worn in hospitals and clinics, aren't one size fits all. If you ever noticed, most of the 'mask-wearers', have gaps on each side, some large enough to insert an index finger, (like my cloth masks) even the paper masks. The mandates are only that the face must be covered, not covered effectively.
03-12-2020 12:54
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
HarveyH55 wrote:
In a clinical setting, masks are replaced regularly. The same mask isn't used all day. They are only worn in the presence of patents at risk of infection. The use a different type of respirator, is it's the patient, who poses the risk of infecting the health care workers. The masks worn in hospitals and clinics, aren't one size fits all. If you ever noticed, most of the 'mask-wearers', have gaps on each side, some large enough to insert an index finger, (like my cloth masks) even the paper masks. The mandates are only that the face must be covered, not covered effectively.


I have a feeling that even in clinics the masks are hughly overrated. After the operation the patient gets a course of antibiotics anyway to minimize the risk on infection. I had a little chainsaw accident and I needed some some stiches on the leg. After everything was done the nurse wanted to prescribe me some oral antibiotics. I said that I do not want them and that the cut was not so bad and she became quite frightened about the idea that I would not take antibiotics. We had a quite long conversation about it, eventually I gave up and she prescribed the pills. I did not take them anyway because I had a feeling that the risk of an infection was low.
03-12-2020 17:07
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(9089)
Xadoman wrote:I did not take them anyway because I had a feeling that the risk of an infection was low.

You are wise to only take antibiotics when absolutely necessary. Taking them capriciously will serve to elevate the resistance of everything in your body to those antibiotics. You could very well generate your own need for antibiotics that no longer work.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
03-12-2020 20:23
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
Xadoman wrote:
3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.



What is the exact spec for the N95 mask? I keep reading from everywhere that it is 0.3 microns. Still bigger than the coronavirus but the diference is not as dramatic as I initially though.


3 microns, not 0.3.
The differences are great.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
03-12-2020 20:28
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
HarveyH55 wrote:
In a clinical setting, masks are replaced regularly. The same mask isn't used all day. They are only worn in the presence of patents at risk of infection. The use a different type of respirator, is it's the patient, who poses the risk of infecting the health care workers. The masks worn in hospitals and clinics, aren't one size fits all. If you ever noticed, most of the 'mask-wearers', have gaps on each side, some large enough to insert an index finger, (like my cloth masks) even the paper masks. The mandates are only that the face must be covered, not covered effectively.


A medical mask (which is an N95 mask treated with biocide and stored in sterile packaging. The resulting mask is good against some bacteria for an hour or two. After that, they are just like any other N95 mask. They won't stop bacteria anymore.

No N95 mask, industrial or medical, can stop a virus.

People are buying and using N095 industrial masks for long periods of time. They are buying cloth mask and wearing them all day. NONE of them are effective against viruses. Cloth masks are worse than N95 masks. Medical masks treatments wear out after an hour or two and are no better than any N95 industrial mask.

Masks can and do harbor bacteria.

Governor's issuing edicts to wear them is unconstitutional. These people are not kings. They do not have authority to just pass decree after decree.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
Edited on 03-12-2020 20:33
03-12-2020 22:54
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
3 microns, not 0.3.
The differences are great.


"COVID 19 virus particle size is 125 nanometers (0.125 microns); the range is 0.06 microns to .14 microns," the post said. "The N95 mask filters down to 0.3 microns.


The N95 is made by various manufacturers under different names, from MSA's "Affinity Foldable Respirator" to 3M's "Particulate Respirator." Look for "NIOSH N95" on the package; the "N95" is a government efficiency rating that means the mask blocks about 95 percent of particles that are 0.3 microns in size or larger.


So which is it?
Edited on 03-12-2020 22:57
04-12-2020 02:46
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
Xadoman wrote:
3 microns, not 0.3.
The differences are great.


"COVID 19 virus particle size is 125 nanometers (0.125 microns); the range is 0.06 microns to .14 microns," the post said. "The N95 mask filters down to 0.3 microns.


The N95 is made by various manufacturers under different names, from MSA's "Affinity Foldable Respirator" to 3M's "Particulate Respirator." Look for "NIOSH N95" on the package; the "N95" is a government efficiency rating that means the mask blocks about 95 percent of particles that are 0.3 microns in size or larger.


So which is it?


3 microns.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
04-12-2020 02:57
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★★
(2109)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Xadoman wrote:
3 micrrons, as specified in the N95 spec. These masks will stop 95% of particles 3 microns and larger.



What is the exact spec for the N95 mask? I keep reading from everywhere that it is 0.3 microns. Still bigger than the coronavirus but the diference is not as dramatic as I initially though.


N95 is .3 microns.
Covid viron is 120 nanometers
....so 25 times smaller.



Shit, I put .3 and fully intended 3. Sorry about confusing you Duncan.


ANY mask is better than no mask, even if you have to resort to putting a tightly fit plastic bag over your head-COVIDEXPERTGFM

I don't have a GoFundMe, but I do have a PO Box (#666)-COVIDEXPERTGFM
04-12-2020 19:22
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
Into the Night wrote:
Xadoman wrote:
3 microns, not 0.3.
The differences are great.


"COVID 19 virus particle size is 125 nanometers (0.125 microns); the range is 0.06 microns to .14 microns," the post said. "The N95 mask filters down to 0.3 microns.


The N95 is made by various manufacturers under different names, from MSA's "Affinity Foldable Respirator" to 3M's "Particulate Respirator." Look for "NIOSH N95" on the package; the "N95" is a government efficiency rating that means the mask blocks about 95 percent of particles that are 0.3 microns in size or larger.


So which is it?


3 microns.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7426537/

2.2.1. N95 respirator
These types are a type of FFR masks, are non-oil resistant, also known as electrets filters. The word N95 is obtained from the fact that these types of masks can at least filter 95% of aerosols around 0.3 μm [34].



Apparently those simplest masks which are used the most are not N95 masks. I do not know how they call them.
Edited on 04-12-2020 19:32
04-12-2020 20:26
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
Xadoman wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Xadoman wrote:
3 microns, not 0.3.
The differences are great.


"COVID 19 virus particle size is 125 nanometers (0.125 microns); the range is 0.06 microns to .14 microns," the post said. "The N95 mask filters down to 0.3 microns.


The N95 is made by various manufacturers under different names, from MSA's "Affinity Foldable Respirator" to 3M's "Particulate Respirator." Look for "NIOSH N95" on the package; the "N95" is a government efficiency rating that means the mask blocks about 95 percent of particles that are 0.3 microns in size or larger.


So which is it?


3 microns.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7426537/

2.2.1. N95 respirator
These types are a type of FFR masks, are non-oil resistant, also known as electrets filters. The word N95 is obtained from the fact that these types of masks can at least filter 95% of aerosols around 0.3 μm [34].



Apparently those simplest masks which are used the most are not N95 masks. I do not know how they call them.

This is wrong. The N95 spec is 3 microns an larger. False authority fallacy.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
04-12-2020 21:52
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
This is wrong. The N95 spec is 3 microns an larger. False authority fallacy.


https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/276353O/regulations-update-18-42-cfr-84.pdf

Filter Classification
This rule establishes three series of filters; N, R, and P. Each series has three levels of filter
efficiency; 95 %, 99%, and 99.97%. These are the minimum efficiencies to be demonstrated by
each filter. Hence, there are nine classes of filters altogether. Filters will be identified as:
* N95, R95, and P95: 95% filter efficiency level
* N99, R99, and P99: 99% filter efficiency level
* N100, R100, and P100: 99.97% filter efficiency level
The P100 filter will be color-coded magenta.
________________________________________________________________
Test Requirements
The new certification tests use the most penetrating aerosol size, 0.3 µm aerodynamic mass
median diameter, of either a mildly degrading particulate, sodium chloride (NaCl), or a highly
degrading oil, dioctylphthalate (DOP). The efficiency of the filter shall be monitored and recorded
throughout the test period. The N-series respirators will be tested to a maximum loading level of
200 mg NaCl per respirator. The minimum efficiency for the filters tested must be equal to or
greater than the filter efficiency criterion listed above for the filter class for which approval is
sought. For example, after being loaded with 200 mg of NaCl, an N95 particulate filter must
demonstrate filter efficiencies greater than or equal to 95%. Prior to filter efficiency testing of Nseries filters, the filters shall be taken out of their packaging and placed in an environment of 85 ±
5 % relative humidity at 38 ± 2.5°C for 25 ± 1 hours. These preconditioning requirements apply
only to N-series filters. This requirement is to address the effect of humidity on the filter's
efficiency because the sodium chloride aerosol is less severe than DOP in reducing filter efficiency.


N95 is clearly 0,3 microns. These simplest of the masks are therefore simply not N95 spec. I do not know how to call them but certainly they are not N95.
04-12-2020 22:10
HarveyH55Profile picture★★★★★
(3369)
It's still 95%, under ideal, laboratory conditions. Out in the field, even clinical/hospital conditions, they are going to fall short. Look up the recommendation for use... You'll find that most people don't come close to using them properly. You'll find that most people, won't even approach 50% protection, just for not following the instructions, and using them in less than ideal conditions. Then argue particle size, which doesn't matter so much, since you aren't even getting a coin-toss worth of protection, out of the best made mask on the planet. And that's assuming you are actually buying 3M made masks. N95 is a standard, not a brand.
04-12-2020 22:51
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(9089)
HarveyH55 wrote:It's still 95%, under ideal, laboratory conditions.

Sure, but since we are talking about 3 micron, i.e. an order of magnitude larger, and since the holes are a percentage larger than that, it clearly reveals the sheer ease with which a mere 0.12 micron virus will pass through an earloop mask.

The ratio is congruent to a 6' man trying to "squeeze" through a 150'-tall archway that is roughly 75' wide. It renders absurd the notion that earloop facemasks somehow "help" in this regard.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
04-12-2020 23:08
HarveyH55Profile picture★★★★★
(3369)
IBdaMann wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:It's still 95%, under ideal, laboratory conditions.

Sure, but since we are talking about 3 micron, i.e. an order of magnitude larger, and since the holes are a percentage larger than that, it clearly reveals the sheer ease with which a mere 0.12 micron virus will pass through an earloop mask.

The ratio is congruent to a 6' man trying to "squeeze" through a 150'-tall archway that is roughly 75' wide. It renders absurd the notion that earloop facemasks somehow "help" in this regard.

.


I was just pointing out that the 95% is the best you can hope for, in the perfect use case, which is never attainable to begin with.
04-12-2020 23:15
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
04-12-2020 23:20
Xadoman
★★★☆☆
(435)
The ratio is congruent to a 6' man trying to "squeeze" through a 150'-tall archway that is roughly 75' wide. It renders absurd the notion that earloop facemasks somehow "help" in this regard.

.
What about the gaps that are between the mask and face due to bad sealing. How would that compare( for example lets say jumping into the Grand Canyon or smth)
Edited on 04-12-2020 23:25
05-12-2020 00:38
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
IBdaMann wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:It's still 95%, under ideal, laboratory conditions.

Sure, but since we are talking about 3 micron, i.e. an order of magnitude larger, and since the holes are a percentage larger than that, it clearly reveals the sheer ease with which a mere 0.12 micron virus will pass through an earloop mask.

The ratio is congruent to a 6' man trying to "squeeze" through a 150'-tall archway that is roughly 75' wide. It renders absurd the notion that earloop facemasks somehow "help" in this regard.

.

BUT, but... but BROWNIAN MOTION!!!!!! raahhhhhhh!!!!!!!
30-03-2021 21:46
SaraTBahn
☆☆☆☆☆
(2)
I agree. Now, the most important thing is to wear masks. It is extremely difficult for dentists, as they have a risk of contracting covid. I am happy that despite the difficult situation in the country, they still help people. Recently, I had serious problems with my teeth (my inflamed was gum). I couldn't eat properly, and so I asked for help from https://jeffreygrossdds.com/. I was afraid that the specialists might refuse to help me because now the situation in the world is quite tense. to my surprise I managed to make an appointment with them. I am grateful to those doctors who, despite the pandemic, help people.
30-03-2021 22:51
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★★
(2052)
SaraTBahn wrote:
I agree. Now, the most important thing is to wear masks. It is extremely difficult for dentists, as they have a risk of contracting covid. I am happy that despite the difficult situation in the country, they still help people. Recently, I had serious problems with my teeth (my inflamed was gum). I couldn't eat properly, and so I asked for help from https://jeffreygrossdds.com/. I was afraid that the specialists might refuse to help me because now the situation in the world is quite tense. to my surprise I managed to make an appointment with them. I am grateful to those doctors who, despite the pandemic, help people.

Why?? Masks do not stop viruses.
31-03-2021 01:50
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(9089)
SaraTBahn wrote:I agree.

No, you completely disagree. You obviously haven't been paying attention to the thread or simply didn't bother reading it.

There never was any pandemic. All the hype is/was a hoax in a concerted power-grab move by world governments to instill fear and panic in the people so as to make them more easily manipulated.


SaraTBahn wrote: Now, the most important thing is to wear masks.

You suck at biology. Ask me how I know.

SaraTBahn wrote:It is extremely difficult for dentists, as they have a risk of contracting covid.

We never worried during any other flu season.

SaraTBahn wrote: I am happy that despite the difficult situation in the country, they still help people.

You think that the DNC stealing an election might cause dentists to not help people?

SaraTBahn wrote: I am grateful to those doctors who, despite the pandemic, help people.

I think we are all grateful for having a system whereby one simply makes an appointment to visit a doctor. Were you this gushing three years ago? ... the year before that?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
31-03-2021 04:44
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★★
(2109)
SaraTBahn wrote:
. I am grateful to those doctors who, despite the pandemic, help people.


Are you equally grateful to your plumber, your postal worker, your Uber driver, Door dasher, your auto mechanic, your waiter/waitress, your flight attendant, your Amazon driver/warehouse worker, your Walmart employees, your grocery stocker, or your personal assistant that wipes your sniffles? They all have a few things in common with your dentist.

1. They all provide a service to you at your cost.

2. They all help you make your life experience better.

3. They all have the same risk of getting covid.

Taking nothing away from your dental provider....why is he/she a cut above the rest?


ANY mask is better than no mask, even if you have to resort to putting a tightly fit plastic bag over your head-COVIDEXPERTGFM

I don't have a GoFundMe, but I do have a PO Box (#666)-COVIDEXPERTGFM
Edited on 31-03-2021 04:45
31-03-2021 06:16
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(15508)
SaraTBahn wrote:
I agree. Now, the most important thing is to wear masks.

Masks do not stop a virus.
SaraTBahn wrote:
It is extremely difficult for dentists, as they have a risk of contracting covid.

Everyone has risk of contracting covid. Even those that have had it before or been vaccinated. The difference is how your body responds to it.

Covid19 is the mildest virus so far discovered of the Covid/SARS series. There is no need to wear masks, live in fear, or shut down the economy over it.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit

nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan
31-03-2021 09:09
duncan61
★★★★☆
(1124)
I am going to disagree ITN as new cases have recently been diagnosed in Queensland and now it has spread to NSW again.It would seem the only way to stop the rapid spread is to isolate and take precautions.Is wearing a mask all that bad and being aware of distancing.The west aus gov have locked our border again.When everyone has been immunised will this flu go away or are we stuck with it for ever.I would prefer to be eaten by a giant space goat than die of a virulent disease caught from a dirty telephone
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