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Measurement vs. scientific principles


Measurement vs. scientific principles10-02-2020 02:48
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
Which one should be trusted more? Measurements can clearly be inadequate and scientific principles can be misinterpreted, not to mention the fact that they change from decade to decade.
10-02-2020 04:15
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote: Which one should be trusted more? Measurements can clearly be inadequate and scientific principles can be misinterpreted, not to mention the fact that they change from decade to decade.

Nope.

All measurements have error; this is identified in all valid datasets.

Science is not subjective and is completely unambiguous. There is no issue of misinterpretation.



.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
10-02-2020 05:01
James___
★★★★★
(2249)
keepit wrote:
Which one should be trusted more? Measurements can clearly be inadequate and scientific principles can be misinterpreted, not to mention the fact that they change from decade to decade.



I think how data is interpreted is the primary issue. That's why the debate exists. Definitions of empirical and peer review have also been changed.
10-02-2020 08:25
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
IBDM,
I can't think of anything that is completely unambiguous. Not relativity, not plate tectonics, not quantum theory, not climate science, etc. Well, maybe some basic math is but math is just a description, it doesn't explain mechanisms usually.
10-02-2020 17:24
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote:
IBDM,I can't think of anything that is completely unambiguous.

This is quite the testament to your cognitive shortcomings. Let me help you. Here's an example.

"You are reading this statement right now."

keepit wrote: Not relativity,
Yes, Relativity is unambiguous.

keepit wrote:not quantum theory

Quantum theory is unambiguous.

keepit wrote: Well, maybe some basic math is but math is just a description, it doesn't explain mechanisms usually.

Explaining mechanisms is not a requirement of unambiguity.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
10-02-2020 19:23
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
IBDM,
Did you get your information about my cognitive characteristics out of the "Data Mine" or the "Manual"?
10-02-2020 20:26
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote: IBDM, Did you get your information about my cognitive characteristics out of the "Data Mine" or the "Manual"?

Nope, ... from your posts ... and your batting average.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
10-02-2020 21:12
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
IBDM,
Well, i'm almost done with my 8th decade. Among your countless conclusions about my cognitive characteristics have you concluded that uncle al has come to visit me?
10-02-2020 21:45
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote:IBDM, Well, i'm almost done with my 8th decade. Among your countless conclusions about my cognitive characteristics have you concluded that uncle al has come to visit me?

What did he tell you about Greenhouse Effect? Is it really caused by Spot under the staircase?


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
10-02-2020 23:12
James___
★★★★★
(2249)
IBdaMann wrote:
keepit wrote:IBDM, Well, i'm almost done with my 8th decade. Among your countless conclusions about my cognitive characteristics have you concluded that uncle al has come to visit me?

What did he tell you about Greenhouse Effect? Is it really caused by Spot under the staircase?


.



Have you 2 tried marriage counselling? I heard it helps.
14-02-2020 00:45
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
In general do you need measurements to make decisions or do you need scientific principles? For example, and this is for ITN, do you need precise measurements to fly the plane or do you need approximate measurements plus knowledge of aerodynamics to make decisions?
14-02-2020 01:08
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote:
In general do you need measurements to make decisions or do you need scientific principles? For example, and this is for ITN, do you need precise measurements to fly the plane or do you need approximate measurements plus knowledge of aerodynamics to make decisions?


A tactical nighttime IFR landing anyone?

Hey Into the Night, would you be OK with a aircraft fuel gauge that told you you had, say an eighth of a tank more than you had?

Would you be OK with an ILS positioning that was only off by a couple of hundred meters?


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
14-02-2020 01:12
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2265)
IBdaMann wrote:...an ILS positioning that was only off by a couple of hundred meters?
Oooh good question IBD.

ITN how accurate (I think that's the right word) would the ILS need to be for you to agree to fly the plane?
Edited on 14-02-2020 02:02
14-02-2020 01:20
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
Night time instrument landings are easier than daytime because the lights go through the fog in the night but don't help much during the day.

A couple hundred meter mistake in and ILS landing is totally unacceptable. Even 50 feet is unacceptable. The point is measurements in climate change may be inadequate whereas making decisions based on scientific principles may be sufficient.
Edited on 14-02-2020 01:23
14-02-2020 01:22
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:...an ILS positioning that was only off by a couple of hundred meters?
Oooh good question IBD.

ITN how accurate (I think that's the right word) would the ILS need to be for you to agree to fly the plain?


You need to specify ... how accurate he needs it to be to fly the fruited plain.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
14-02-2020 01:24
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote:Night time instrument landings are easier than daytime because the lights go through the fog in the night but don't help much during the day.


The person who reads your posts to you omitted the word "tactical." There are no lights in a tactical landing.

Have you ever been in a war zone?


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
14-02-2020 01:25
keepit
★★★★☆
(1070)
No
14-02-2020 01:46
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5955)
keepit wrote: No

Well, lights are verboten (Dft - Deutsch for tmiddles) inside the warzone. Inside the aircraft only dim, red lights are allowed, to permit safe, basic movement about by the crew as needed.

Tactical landings typically involve the pilot rotating the wings to near vertical and just dropping the aircraft vertically (not completely but close) to a low altitude close to the landing zone and then quickly landing. Of course this is done at night so that adversaries cannot see the aircraft and have no time to react to the aircraft's presence.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist




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