Energy and resource crisis in the future

Xadoman wrote:

Oil comes from organic material, mostly algae,which was quickly buried in mud at the bottom of oceans and lakes – So, it never had a chance to fossilize. Pressure, heat and time converted the organic material into kerogen, oil and natural gas

AND the sun's not burning out anytime soon so we can keep growing fuel if we can't find it in the ground conveniently enough.

I want to belive that this is true. The question is - is the oil renewable at current rate of consumption. If not then there is going to be a depletion and the concequences of such event that are self explanatory.

I don't believe you. Shale oil is not mined.

We have more oil than ever. Oil is also a renewable resource.

The Parrot Killer

Whoever told you that is lying. Soil can be form easily within a single year.

So you figure there will never be rain or snow to fill up aquifers again, eh? What makes you believe this?

Oil is damn cheap right now. That means there is plenty of it to satisfy the market demands. That means that so far, it is not being depleted at all.

No such logic. Zenos paradoxes are not logic. They are philosophical arguments.

Nope. Earth synthesizes oil continuously. No algae or other living substance required.

Xadoman wrote:

Nope. Earth synthesizes oil continuously. No algae or other living substance required.

I want to belive it. From what and how the earth synthesize oil? Is there a long term depletion problem or could this process last till the sun dies?

Xadoman wrote:

I don't believe you. Shale oil is not mined.

We have more oil than ever. Oil is also a renewable resource.

The Parrot Killer

I meant oil shale, a rock. I have been to those underground mines and I have seen with my own eyes how this rock is removed from the underground. Eventually the ground collapses.

Xadoman wrote:

Whoever told you that is lying. Soil can be form easily within a single year.

No it can not.

Xadoman wrote:
Topsoil forms very slowly

Xadoman wrote:
and due to heavy farming its erosion/depletion is faster than its formation.

Xadoman wrote:
Simple as that. Why do you think farmers fertilize their soil?

Xadoman wrote:

So you figure there will never be rain or snow to fill up aquifers again, eh? What makes you believe this?

Ever heard about Jakarta. They pumped their ground water at the rate so much that the whole city has sunk 4 meter during last 40 years.

Xadoman wrote:

Oil is damn cheap right now. That means there is plenty of it to satisfy the market demands. That means that so far, it is not being depleted at all.

Depletion could be a sudden event. For example when you drink a bottle of beer then the last gulp might be the biggest but after that it is all over.

Xadoman wrote:

No such logic. Zenos paradoxes are not logic. They are philosophical arguments.

According to logic it is not possible for a rabbit to catch a turtle.

Xadoman wrote:
I do not care if it is philosophical argument or not.

Xadoman wrote:
That is why I belive in common sense.

Xadoman wrote:
I have seen with my own eyes how a cat has catched a mouse. Simple as that.

Xadoman wrote:

No such logic. Zenos paradoxes are not logic. They are philosophical arguments.

According to logic it is not possible for a rabbit to catch a turtle.

Xadoman wrote:
I do not care if it is philosophical argument or not.

Xadoman wrote:
That is why I belive in common sense.

Xadoman wrote:
I have seen with my own eyes how a cat has catched a mouse. Simple as that.

Oil from shale isn't mined. I don't believe you.

Nope. Takes as little as a year.

Logic doesn't talk about rabbits and turtles. Logic is a closed functional system, like mathematics.

Xadoman take this for what it's worth: I believe you find people like ITN/IBD within ever great debate. Their goal is to end discussion, to frustrate those trying to seek out the truth, to essentially keep the truth from being discovered. Here they are simply debate killers.

Xadoman wrote:

Xadoman take this for what it's worth: I believe you find people like ITN/IBD within ever great debate. Their goal is to end discussion, to frustrate those trying to seek out the truth, to essentially keep the truth from being discovered. Here they are simply debate killers.

I just got into this forum. I almost jumped to the climate hysteria bandwagon not long time ago but thanks to this forum I do not belive this hysteria anymore. I was always a little bit sceptical and did not dig more deeply into this matter but now I am almost convinced that the whole thing is overexaggerated. On the other hand some claims of ITN/IBD are too beautiful to be true. Like endless supply of oil , gas etc. I myself am a depletion doomer and I think that there will be big problems in the nearest future when we run out of natural resources.

Xadoman wrote:

Oil from shale isn't mined. I don't believe you.

I already told you I meant a rock called "oil shale" or what ever it is called in English.

Xadoman wrote:
It has been the only abundant energy resource in our country and soon it is going to be depleted.

Xadoman wrote:
After that our country has to import electricity from other countries.

Xadoman wrote:

Nope. Takes as little as a year.

At current rate it is disappearing 100 times faster than it forms.

Xadoman wrote:
Due to heavy farming etc.

Xadoman wrote:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/only-60-years-of-farming-left-if-soil-degradation-continues/

Xadoman wrote:

Logic doesn't talk about rabbits and turtles. Logic is a closed functional system, like mathematics.

A simple zeno paradox confirms to me that claims based on logic could lead to very wrong conslusions.

Xadoman wrote:
That is why I belive in common sense.

Xadoman wrote:
Common sense tells me that a cat could catch a mouse without problems.

Xadoman wrote:

Xadoman take this for what it's worth: I believe you find people like ITN/IBD within ever great debate. Their goal is to end discussion, to frustrate those trying to seek out the truth, to essentially keep the truth from being discovered. Here they are simply debate killers.

I just got into this forum. I almost jumped to the climate hysteria bandwagon not long time ago but thanks to this forum I do not belive this hysteria anymore. I was always a little bit sceptical and did not dig more deeply into this matter but now I am almost convinced that the whole thing is overexaggerated. On the other hand some claims of ITN/IBD are too beautiful to be true. Like endless supply of oil , gas etc. I myself am a depletion doomer and I think that there will be big problems in the nearest future when we run out of natural resources.

James___ wrote:

Xadoman wrote:

Xadoman take this for what it's worth: I believe you find people like ITN/IBD within ever great debate. Their goal is to end discussion, to frustrate those trying to seek out the truth, to essentially keep the truth from being discovered. Here they are simply debate killers.

I just got into this forum. I almost jumped to the climate hysteria bandwagon not long time ago but thanks to this forum I do not belive this hysteria anymore. I was always a little bit sceptical and did not dig more deeply into this matter but now I am almost convinced that the whole thing is overexaggerated. On the other hand some claims of ITN/IBD are too beautiful to be true. Like endless supply of oil , gas etc. I myself am a depletion doomer and I think that there will be big problems in the nearest future when we run out of natural resources.

What could be the 2 biggest issues in the future is overpopulation

James___ wrote:
and a lack of fresh water.

James___ wrote:
The South China Sea is supposed to have more oil than the Middle East.

James___ wrote:
That leaves us with what economical solution is there for fresh water?

James___ wrote:
This would be for aspects of society from agricultural to manufacturing to a person's home. We've seen what happened when the price of crude went up,

James___ wrote:
what about when the price of water goes up?

Shale doesn't burn. Oil is not mined. I don't believe you.

Meh. A mythical substance that doesn't exist is going to be depleted???

The zeno paradoxes are arguments of philosophy, not logic. They have nothing to do with logic at all.

ook up the Fischer-Tropsch process. It can be done with CO or CO2.
Just combine CO2, hydrogen, heat, and pressure in the presence of an iron catalyst, you will get light, sweet, crude oil and methane.

These conditions exist naturally underground.

The Earth is a giant Fischer-Tropsch reactor continuously making oil.

We have more oil than ever right now. What depletion?

Natural resources occur because of natural processes. Rain and snow provide fresh water. The makes oil and methane constantly. Methane is also found in swamps, refuse piles, oil wells, and elsewhere.

Nothing has stopped the rain and snow. Nothing has stopped the Earth from producing oil and methane. Nothing has stopped refuse piles from producing methane.

Xadoman wrote:I am a simple man and belive in common sense.

Xadoman wrote:According to logic the rabbit could never catch a turtle( zeno paradox)

Xadoman wrote: but common sense tells us that sure it can.

Xadoman wrote: Once the oil shale is burnt in our country we no more have it. Simple as that.

Xadoman wrote: The future is concerning.

Xadoman wrote:

Shale doesn't burn. Oil is not mined. I don't believe you.

Of course it burns.

Xadoman wrote:
I have been to power stations that use oil shale for electricity production.
[quote]Xadoman wrote:
[quote]Into the Night wrote:
The zeno paradoxes are arguments of philosophy, not logic. They have nothing to do with logic at all.

Zenos logic was flawless.

Xadoman wrote:
I can not see anything wrong with his logic.

Xadoman wrote:
The problem is that his flawless logic

Xadoman wrote:
leads to wrong conclusions.

Xadoman wrote:
That is why I am very skeptical of anyone who makes bold claims based on only logic.

Xadoman wrote:
I need more to be convinced.

Xadoman wrote:

ook up the Fischer-Tropsch process. It can be done with CO or CO2.
Just combine CO2, hydrogen, heat, and pressure in the presence of an iron catalyst, you will get light, sweet, crude oil and methane.

These conditions exist naturally underground.

The Earth is a giant Fischer-Tropsch reactor continuously making oil.

We have more oil than ever right now. What depletion?

Natural resources occur because of natural processes. Rain and snow provide fresh water. The makes oil and methane constantly. Methane is also found in swamps, refuse piles, oil wells, and elsewhere.

Nothing has stopped the rain and snow. Nothing has stopped the Earth from producing oil and methane. Nothing has stopped refuse piles from producing methane.

Too good to be true.

Xadoman wrote:
I do not say it is wrong

Xadoman wrote:
but I do belive at current rate of consumption the oil is not renewable resource. It is going to be depleted.

WRONG. The Zeno paradox of the tortoise and Achillis (or the hare) is a logical fallacy known as a contextomy fallacy. It shifts the context as required to allow the tortoise to win by reducing the speed of Achillis (or the hare) in each context

Because it is a fallacy, not logic.

This religion is the reason you deny logic and philosophy, and now you have denied mathematics as well as chemistry.

Xadoman wrote:No. Zenos logic is flawless. It it not possible for Achillis to catch a tortoise. The point I want to make is that I am very skeptical of whoever that makes bold claims based only some logic mind game. I need more to belive.

Xadoman wrote: His logic is sound. Even 2500 years later nobody can not refute his logic.

Xadoman wrote: I do not deny zenos paradox.

Into the Night wrote:

Xadoman wrote:

Whoever told you that is lying. Soil can be form easily within a single year.

No it can not.

Yes it can.

Xadoman wrote:
I do not deny zenos paradox. It is flawless and sound logic.

tmiddles wrote:Anyone that doubts logic can be sound and dead wrong, as you've pointed out very well, is simply uneducated.

tmiddles wrote:My favorite quote on logic "Logic is a systematic method of coming to the wrong conclusion with confidence."

IBdaMann wrote:

tmiddles wrote:Anyone that doubts logic can be sound and dead wrong, as you've pointed out very well, is simply uneducated.

Incorrect. You cannot be sound and be wrong.

tmiddles wrote: Yes you can if the tool is imperfect. Logic is a deeply flawed and imperfect tool as is rational thought on the whole.

tmiddles wrote:You can do "Something" perfectly but have the result be flawed if that "Something" you're doing isn't entirely reliable.

tmiddles wrote: If you don't believe logic can obey all it's own rules and produce an answer that is dead wrong you simply need to educate yourself.

IBdaMann wrote:
I'm sure you have some examples handy...

tmiddles wrote: Not that is settled and accepted. On you.

tmiddles wrote:
https://www.psychologicalscience.org/publications/observer/obsonline/what-is-logical-is-not-always-true.html

tmiddles wrote:
[quote]tmiddles wrote:
https://www.psychologicalscience.org/publications/observer/obsonline/what-is-logical-is-not-always-true.html

IBdaMann wrote:
I appreciate you ...

Xadoman wrote:
tmiddles, I saw your thread about body in room and I must say I am truly puzzled now how the body does not freeze in the room. I do not belive in the climate hysteria anymore though.

spot wrote: ... but you know enough to dismiss all the science telling you that climate change is real
Ok

So your puzzled at why you don't freeze to death in a room but you know enough to dismiss all the science telling you that climate change is real


Ok

Xadoman wrote:tmiddles made calculations and according to them we should eat 14 large pizzas a day just to maintain our body tempreture. Something does not add up and I cannot understand yet what is it.

It's just that no one has ever observed this and he insists that it happens, which is perfectly fine ... I just think we should see an example of it first. Don't you? We don't want to be believing in things that don't really exist, do we?