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Albert Einstein said.


Albert Einstein said.08-01-2017 12:22
giabaodiepProfile picture☆☆☆☆☆
(6)
Albert Einstein – The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing
08-01-2017 12:27
Tim the plumber
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(1295)
giabaodiep wrote:
Albert Einstein – The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing


Yes. Currently we are using vast amounts of food as fuel which is killing at least 20 million of the world's poor a year.

It is also maintaining the utter inpoverishment of the world's poorest 2 or 3 billion people.

If we stop this evil the world's poorest will very quickly get richer. There will be a boom in the rate of development in the 2nd and 3rd world.

This will make us in the rich world richer.
08-01-2017 15:13
spot
★★★★☆
(1065)
Tim the plumber wrote:
giabaodiep wrote:
Albert Einstein – The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing


Yes. Currently we are using vast amounts of food as fuel which is killing at least 20 million of the world's poor a year.

It is also maintaining the utter inpoverishment of the world's poorest 2 or 3 billion people.

If we stop this evil the world's poorest will very quickly get richer. There will be a boom in the rate of development in the 2nd and 3rd world.

This will make us in the rich world richer.


That would be something to think about, if your figures had any basis in the real world.


IBdaMann wrote:
"Air" is not a body in and of itself. Ergo it is not a blackbody.


Planck's law describes the spectral density of electromagnetic radiation emitted by a black body in thermal equilibrium at a given temperature T.
08-01-2017 16:55
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
Tim the plumber wrote: Currently we are using vast amounts of food as fuel......


Its worse than that. Correction to your statement: Currently we are using (NOT burning efficiently) vast amounts of food as fuel......because ethanol is being incorrectly used in low compression ratio gasoline engines. To be burned efficiently, ethanol must be burned in ethanol engines.
Remember these points, 1) diesel fuel works efficiently in diesel engines (tho lots of pollution), 2) ethanol works efficiently in ethanol engines, 3) gasoline works efficiently in gasoline engines. To use any of the fuels in other engines is waste, or won't or may not run other engines.
Agree with your other assessments AND extend remarks.
20 million die per year..... because we use ethanol as a fuel. That is true. But compounding those 20 million deaths per year, is that ethanol DOES NOT save gasoline stocks in the long run, but uses more gasoline stocks.
That is why the oil companies did NOT PROTEST TOO MUCH, when the EPA mandated ethanol dilution of our national gasoline stocks. The oil companies knew ethanol didn't perform properly in gasoline engines & WOULD USE MORE GASOLINE IN THE LONG RUN.
All other environmental negatives about ethanol in gasoline are true.
Edited on 08-01-2017 16:59
08-01-2017 21:17
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
litesong wrote:
Tim the plumber wrote: Currently we are using vast amounts of food as fuel......


Its worse than that. Correction to your statement: Currently we are using (NOT burning efficiently) vast amounts of food as fuel......because ethanol is being incorrectly used in low compression ratio gasoline engines. To be burned efficiently, ethanol must be burned in ethanol engines.
Whether we are burning it efficiently or not. It is being used as fuel (actually as the moderator for fuel).
litesong wrote:
Remember these points, 1) diesel fuel works efficiently in diesel engines (tho lots of pollution),
Diesel engines are pretty good these days. The same thing that happened to gasoline engines happened to diesel engines. Only poorly adjusted engines put out soot.
litesong wrote:
2) ethanol works efficiently in ethanol engines,
No, it doesn't for the same reason is doesn't work efficiently in any engine. It's available BTU is too low, producing a colder burn. Lower temperatures mean a LESS efficient engine.
litesong wrote:
3) gasoline works efficiently in gasoline engines. To use any of the fuels in other engines is waste, or won't or may not run other engines.
The gasoline engine is tuned for gasoline. It can be retuned for other fuels. Remember, it's all about available BTU, not compression ratio.
litesong wrote:
Agree with your other assessments AND extend remarks.
20 million die per year..... because we use ethanol as a fuel. That is true. But compounding those 20 million deaths per year, is that ethanol DOES NOT save gasoline stocks in the long run, but uses more gasoline stocks.
Actually, it doesn't.
litesong wrote:
That is why the oil companies did NOT PROTEST TOO MUCH, when the EPA mandated ethanol dilution of our national gasoline stocks.
Ethanol is not used to save gasoline stocks. It is used as a fuel moderator.
litesong wrote:
The oil companies knew ethanol didn't perform properly in gasoline engines & WOULD USE MORE GASOLINE IN THE LONG RUN.
Actually, the oil companies knew ethanol DID perform properly in gasoline engines. We've used it before. All you need to do is make sure fuel system components such as gaskets can handle the alcohol as well as the gasoline. TEL is better on gaskets and fuel system components.
litesong wrote:
All other environmental negatives about ethanol in gasoline are true.

Such as...?


The Parrot Killer
09-01-2017 02:03
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
litesong wrote: ethanol works efficiently in ethanol engines
///////
"AGW denier liar whiner badnight" bluffed: No, it doesn't for the same reason is doesn't work efficiently in any engine.
//////
litesong wrote: By your statement, there is no reason to have ethanol engines. The INDY racing series will like to hear that.
Edited on 09-01-2017 02:07
09-01-2017 06:07
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1392)
You people can argue compression, efficiency, BTU's, moderators, octanes all night long. While I find it all very interesting, the one fact remains.

We BURN OUR FOOD while families across the globe STARVE TO DEATH.

Ethanol supporters; are you willing look another man in the eye and say, "You, your wife , and your children will go hungry, and likely die from starvation. But it's OK, because the food that would have saved you, I need to burn it so I can save the planet".

Think about that for a minute.....not cool.
09-01-2017 19:02
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
Into the Night wrote:
litesong wrote:[quote]litesong wrote:
1) diesel fuel works efficiently in diesel engines (tho lots of pollution),
Diesel engines are pretty good these days.

VW exec gets a load of grief:
http://www.autoblog.com/2017/01/09/vw-executive-arrested-diesel-emissions-scandal/
Should be many exec cellmates.
09-01-2017 20:48
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
litesong wrote:
litesong wrote: ethanol works efficiently in ethanol engines
///////
"AGW denier liar whiner badnight" bluffed: No, it doesn't for the same reason is doesn't work efficiently in any engine.
//////
litesong wrote: By your statement, there is no reason to have ethanol engines. The INDY racing series will like to hear that.


They already know.


The Parrot Killer
09-01-2017 20:51
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
GasGuzzler wrote:
You people can argue compression, efficiency, BTU's, moderators, octanes all night long. While I find it all very interesting, the one fact remains.

We BURN OUR FOOD while families across the globe STARVE TO DEATH.

Ethanol supporters; are you willing look another man in the eye and say, "You, your wife , and your children will go hungry, and likely die from starvation. But it's OK, because the food that would have saved you, I need to burn it so I can save the planet".

Think about that for a minute.....not cool.


We're not only burning our food, we are wasting fuel to do it.

It takes fuel to raise, harvest, process and ship that stuff.

As far as starvation goes, ethanol is not causing it. Distribution of food is causing it. We have enough food and water, but it's not in the right place. Getting it there is the issue. Either it's shipping into a war zone, or there is no money to ship it there.


The Parrot Killer
09-01-2017 20:52
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
litesong wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
litesong wrote:[quote]litesong wrote:
1) diesel fuel works efficiently in diesel engines (tho lots of pollution),
Diesel engines are pretty good these days.

VW exec gets a load of grief:
http://www.autoblog.com/2017/01/09/vw-executive-arrested-diesel-emissions-scandal/
Should be many exec cellmates.


Compositional error.

What happened with VW does not affect all diesel engines.


The Parrot Killer
09-01-2017 22:15
Tim the plumber
★★★★☆
(1295)
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
You people can argue compression, efficiency, BTU's, moderators, octanes all night long. While I find it all very interesting, the one fact remains.

We BURN OUR FOOD while families across the globe STARVE TO DEATH.

Ethanol supporters; are you willing look another man in the eye and say, "You, your wife , and your children will go hungry, and likely die from starvation. But it's OK, because the food that would have saved you, I need to burn it so I can save the planet".

Think about that for a minute.....not cool.


We're not only burning our food, we are wasting fuel to do it.

It takes fuel to raise, harvest, process and ship that stuff.

As far as starvation goes, ethanol is not causing it. Distribution of food is causing it. We have enough food and water, but it's not in the right place. Getting it there is the issue. Either it's shipping into a war zone, or there is no money to ship it there.


No. Acute starvation such as in Syria is like that but the slow hunger that haunts the third world is the result of the food as fuel policy.

People dying singly off camera do not make the news but they do so by the millions per year.
09-01-2017 22:28
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1392)
Into the night...you worry me. Sometimes you are right on and then like a ball hit on corked bat you just gone!

Distribution of food is causing starvation???!!!

No money to ship it there?

Eliminate all gov subsidies on ethanol and see how much food you can ship with that money. Haven't looked up the numbers but my gut says we could at least make a huge dent in world hunger and ship it to them. In other words...the US gov buys corn from the producers instead of funding ethanol. We get rid of crap fuel and feed the hungry. Win. Win.
10-01-2017 03:07
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
Tim the plumber wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
You people can argue compression, efficiency, BTU's, moderators, octanes all night long. While I find it all very interesting, the one fact remains.

We BURN OUR FOOD while families across the globe STARVE TO DEATH.

Ethanol supporters; are you willing look another man in the eye and say, "You, your wife , and your children will go hungry, and likely die from starvation. But it's OK, because the food that would have saved you, I need to burn it so I can save the planet".

Think about that for a minute.....not cool.


We're not only burning our food, we are wasting fuel to do it.

It takes fuel to raise, harvest, process and ship that stuff.

As far as starvation goes, ethanol is not causing it. Distribution of food is causing it. We have enough food and water, but it's not in the right place. Getting it there is the issue. Either it's shipping into a war zone, or there is no money to ship it there.


No. Acute starvation such as in Syria is like that but the slow hunger that haunts the third world is the result of the food as fuel policy.

People dying singly off camera do not make the news but they do so by the millions per year.

No, it's the result of no money to ship food in with, and poor soil or conditions to grow their own.


The Parrot Killer
10-01-2017 03:09
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the night...you worry me. Sometimes you are right on and then like a ball hit on corked bat you just gone!

Distribution of food is causing starvation???!!!

No money to ship it there?

Eliminate all gov subsidies on ethanol and see how much food you can ship with that money. Haven't looked up the numbers but my gut says we could at least make a huge dent in world hunger and ship it to them. In other words...the US gov buys corn from the producers instead of funding ethanol. We get rid of crap fuel and feed the hungry. Win. Win.


Food isn't free. It costs money to grow it, harvest it, process it, and get it to where it needs to be. Money is a BIG issue. Poor countries can't afford to buy their food from abroad and they have difficulty growing their own.


The Parrot Killer
10-01-2017 16:03
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1392)
Money is a BIG issue.


Gov spending MY money on subsidies for crap food, ah sorry, fuel is a bigger issue.

I've been trying to find a total $ spent on ethanol subs but haven't had the time to dig for it. Anyone know it?
10-01-2017 19:03
Tim the plumber
★★★★☆
(1295)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Money is a BIG issue.


Gov spending MY money on subsidies for crap food, ah sorry, fuel is a bigger issue.

I've been trying to find a total $ spent on ethanol subs but haven't had the time to dig for it. Anyone know it?


This might help;

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jan/22/quarter-us-grain-biofuels-food

One quarter of US grain crops fed to cars - not people, new figures show
10-01-2017 19:04
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1392)
thanks..i'll take a look
11-01-2017 18:31
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
Into the Night wrote: What happened with VW does not affect all diesel engines.


Audi, Porsche, Bentley, Mercedes, Nissan, Hyundai, & some French diesels are being swept up for their continuing pollution over the years. S.Korea & France have considerations to ban diesels.
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/france-plans-diesel-engine-cull-fight-over-pollution
11-01-2017 20:48
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9232)
litesong wrote:
Into the Night wrote: What happened with VW does not affect all diesel engines.


Audi, Porsche, Bentley, Mercedes, Nissan, Hyundai, & some French diesels are being swept up for their continuing pollution over the years. S.Korea & France have considerations to ban diesels.
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/france-plans-diesel-engine-cull-fight-over-pollution


No, they are being swept up by a government that perceives pollution over the years. Big difference.


The Parrot Killer
11-01-2017 23:05
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
"AGW denier liar whiner badnight" bluffed:
litesong wrote:
Audi, Porsche, Bentley, Mercedes, Nissan, Hyundai, & some French diesels are being swept up for their continuing pollution over the years. S.Korea & France have considerations to ban diesels.
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/france-plans-diesel-engine-cull-fight-over-pollution

No, they are being swept up by a government that perceives pollution over the years. Big difference.

It's good that many gov'ts for years, don't know what's killing its citizens, but "AGW denier liar whiner badnight" knows what AIN'T killing them.
11-01-2017 23:28
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
litesong wrote:VW exec gets a load of grief:
http://www.autoblog.com/2017/01/09/vw-executive-arrested-diesel-emissions-scandal/
Should be many exec cellmates.

Ah..... more execs: http://www.newser.com/story/236729/6-volkswagen-employees-indicted-in-emissions-scandal.html?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=im

Need to be more execs.... & how 'bout some engineers?

Standing joke in engineering classes:
When ah started these classes, ah couldn't spell, "en-jun-ear", but now ah are one.
Edited on 11-01-2017 23:34




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