Remember me
▼ Content

a new model of global warming (before 10000BC)


a new model of global warming (before 10000BC)25-02-2020 04:36
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
1sunlight, water, carbon dioxide are the food of plants.

2 the supply of carbon dioxide is always insufficient.

3 if the supply of carbon dioxide increases, the plants will become stronger, denser, which means more energy is stored in plants.

4 the stored energy is gradually sent out and makes the atmosphere warmer.

5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.

6 the plants become weaker and thinner, they can't store enough energy to keep the atmosphere warm, and the ice age comes.

7 The amount of carbon dioxide from volcano eruption and out space accumulates on the earth's surface and it will lead to an interglacial period.

Jin Guangnian
25-02-2020 04:41
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKRlD45vMh4

carbon dioxide makes it different.
25-02-2020 05:13
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7472)
Tom Jin wrote:
1sunlight, water, carbon dioxide are the food of plants.

2 the supply of carbon dioxide is always insufficient.

3 if the supply of carbon dioxide increases, the plants will become stronger, denser, which means more energy is stored in plants.

You should have stopped at #3. You were fine up through that point.


#4 and thereafter threw you off the deep end.



.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
25-02-2020 05:40
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
for point 4, I believe most energy stored in plants will be sent out someday, via bushfire, respiration of microorganisms, and so on.
25-02-2020 22:33
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2415)
Tom Jin wrote:
for point 4, I believe most energy stored in plants will be sent out someday, via bushfire, respiration of microorganisms, and so on.


The energy in plants, won't make the atmosphere any warmer. It stored as sugars, starch, carbohydrates, oils. Most of which are consumed, by some sort of living thing, and used for other processes, like physical movement, reproduction.

All living things are based on carbon molecules. Plants are the only living that consumes carbon, directly from the environment, and only CO2. Everything else gets the carbon needed for life, from plants, or consuming plant eating animals.
25-02-2020 22:48
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
1sunlight, water, carbon dioxide are the food of plants.

2 the supply of carbon dioxide is always insufficient.

3 if the supply of carbon dioxide increases, the plants will become stronger, denser, which means more energy is stored in plants.
So far so good.
Tom Jin wrote:
4 the stored energy is gradually sent out and makes the atmosphere warmer.
Potential energy has no temperature. A plant is above zero deg K. It is radiating light to space, just like everything else on the surface.
Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.
Tom Jin wrote:
6 the plants become weaker and thinner, they can't store enough energy to keep the atmosphere warm, and the ice age comes.
Plants don't keep the atmosphere warm.
Tom Jin wrote:
7 The amount of carbon dioxide from volcano eruption and out space accumulates on the earth's surface and it will lead to an interglacial period.
Carbon dioxide has no capability to warm the Earth. You can't create energy out of nothing.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
26-02-2020 03:51
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
HarveyH55 wrote:

The energy in plants, won't make the atmosphere any warmer. It stored as sugars, starch, carbohydrates, oils. Most of which are consumed, by some sort of living thing, and used for other processes, like physical movement, reproduction.



We consume food and exhale carbon dioxide, the energy stored in food actually sends out to the surroundings and most of it warm the atmosphere.

I still need some experiments and calculations to obtain accurate data, at this stage I estimate that more than 95% of energy in plants eventually be sent out to environments.
26-02-2020 04:12
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
4 the stored energy is gradually sent out and makes the atmosphere warmer.
Potential energy has no temperature. A plant is above zero deg K. It is radiating light to space, just like everything else on the surface.


For example, in a rain forest, because of dense leaves of trees, most infrared radiation will be constrained in the forest, it can't be sent out directly to outer space.

Microorganisms consume rotten plant underground, the energy sent out by them will be kept in soil and make surroundings warm.
26-02-2020 04:29
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.
26-02-2020 18:23
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2415)
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.


The sun, is the energy sources that keeps the planet warm. Plants, CO2, and all those other things have no meaningful effect, on temperature. Plants only make use of a very tiny portion of the Sun's energy that reaches them. CO2 is a trace gas, only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.
26-02-2020 21:37
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
4 the stored energy is gradually sent out and makes the atmosphere warmer.
Potential energy has no temperature. A plant is above zero deg K. It is radiating light to space, just like everything else on the surface.


For example, in a rain forest, because of dense leaves of trees, most infrared radiation will be constrained in the forest, it can't be sent out directly to outer space.

Nope. A rain forest cannot trap light. It radiates directly to space.
Tom Jin wrote:
Microorganisms consume rotten plant underground, the energy sent out by them will be kept in soil and make surroundings warm.

Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
27-02-2020 02:31
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.


The sun, is the energy sources that keeps the planet warm. Plants, CO2, and all those other things have no meaningful effect, on temperature. Plants only make use of a very tiny portion of the Sun's energy that reaches them. CO2 is a trace gas, only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.


If you compare Amazon rain forest and Sahara desert, you will not deny temperature can be changed by plants. The capability of storing sunlight energy in plants makes the difference.
27-02-2020 05:36
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law. It is very cold at midnight in the desert, the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy. But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night. Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.
27-02-2020 05:54
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2415)
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law. It is very cold at midnight in the desert, the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy. But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night. Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.


Aren't deserts typically dry, low humidity? Would it be the wet, humid climate, in the RAIN forest, that keeps it warm? Not to mention, they are completely different climates.
27-02-2020 20:01
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.


The sun, is the energy sources that keeps the planet warm. Plants, CO2, and all those other things have no meaningful effect, on temperature. Plants only make use of a very tiny portion of the Sun's energy that reaches them. CO2 is a trace gas, only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.


If you compare Amazon rain forest and Sahara desert, you will not deny temperature can be changed by plants. The capability of storing sunlight energy in plants makes the difference.

Plants cannot change the temperature.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
27-02-2020 20:03
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law.

It has everything to do with it. It also has to do with the 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics, which you also probably deny.
Tom Jin wrote:
It is very cold at midnight in the desert,

Except when it's warm.
Tom Jin wrote:
the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy.

Sure it can.
Tom Jin wrote:
But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night.

Except when it's cool.
Tom Jin wrote:
Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.

No gas or vapor is capable of warming the Earth. You can't create energy out of nothing.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
27-02-2020 20:05
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law. It is very cold at midnight in the desert, the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy. But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night. Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.


Aren't deserts typically dry, low humidity? Would it be the wet, humid climate, in the RAIN forest, that keeps it warm? Not to mention, they are completely different climates.


Deserts can be quite warm at night, such as most anywhere in Arizona or the lower deserts of Nevada in the summer.. Rain forests can be quite cold as well, such as the Olympic rain forest in winter.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
28-02-2020 03:02
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law. It is very cold at midnight in the desert, the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy. But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night. Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.


Aren't deserts typically dry, low humidity? Would it be the wet, humid climate, in the RAIN forest, that keeps it warm? Not to mention, they are completely different climates.


I believe forest, especially the rain forest, can warm the atmosphere. Firstly, rain forests can store sunlight energy in carbohydrates. Secondly, there is another effective mechanism for rain forest to trap sunlight energy. The distance between treetop and ground is normally dozens of meters, most sunlight is reflected into forest and energy is trapped in it. This can explain why rain forest is much warmer than the desert at midnight. High humidity in rain forests also can help to trap energy.
28-02-2020 03:39
Tom Jin
☆☆☆☆☆
(10)
Into the Night wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.


The sun, is the energy sources that keeps the planet warm. Plants, CO2, and all those other things have no meaningful effect, on temperature. Plants only make use of a very tiny portion of the Sun's energy that reaches them. CO2 is a trace gas, only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.


If you compare Amazon rain forest and Sahara desert, you will not deny temperature can be changed by plants. The capability of storing sunlight energy in plants makes the difference.

Plants cannot change the temperature.


Yes, plants can change the temperature of the atmosphere. Actually, it plays a key role. During the ice age, carbon dioxide content is low than 250 ppm, in some extreme situations, it even reaches 100 ppm. Most forest can't obtain enough food (I mean carbon dioxide) and is replaced by bushland, grassland or even desert. you mention Stefan-Boltzmann law last time, actually, this law is very useful. It can help us to calculate how much sunlight energy can be trapped in rain forests in the daytime. I guess more than 50%. In the desert, when top sand becomes very hot, it can not store any energy, it just refect all energy back to the atmosphere and back to outer space.
28-02-2020 04:18
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2415)
Total bullshit... There is no way of knowing the CO2 content during the ice age, nobody was measuring it. Even with monitoring stations, it's still only a rough estimate, at best. CO2 isn't evenly distributed. Ice cores, aren't an accurate measure either.

But, the one thing, you can look up yourself, is your claim of CO2 reaching 100 ppm, and plant life survives. At 180 ppm, most every plant known to man, can only produce barely enough to survive. No new growth, no reproduction, just barely hanging on. at 150 ppm, all plants die, they'll last as long as any stored nutrients last. CO2 levels and plant growth have been studied in great detail. The ideal level, is around 800 ppm million, for commercial plants. CO2 is cheap, 1200 ppm is safe to work in, without equipment, and what commercial greenhouses use almost universally these days. Augmentation equipment is pretty cool these days, very efficient use of the fuel burned. A gas engine, produces CO2, heat, electricity, and can even pump water for irrigation, and nutrients. Very little waste, and the results are well worth it. More CO2, produces healthier, fast growing, stronger plants.
28-02-2020 20:07
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Not possible. You cannot trap light. You are ignoring the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


It has nothing to do with Stefan-Boltzmann's law. It is very cold at midnight in the desert, the reason is the desert can't store sunlight energy. But things are different in the rain forest. It's much warmer at night. Due to the respiration of plants and microorganisms, a large amount of water vapor is sent out, which is also greenhouse gas.


Aren't deserts typically dry, low humidity? Would it be the wet, humid climate, in the RAIN forest, that keeps it warm? Not to mention, they are completely different climates.


I believe forest, especially the rain forest, can warm the atmosphere.

Not possible. You can't reduce entropy in any system. You can't reduce radiance and increase the temperature at the same time. You can't create energy out of nothing.
Tom Jin wrote:
Firstly, rain forests can store sunlight energy in carbohydrates.

Not a temperature.
Tom Jin wrote:
Secondly, there is another effective mechanism for rain forest to trap sunlight energy. The distance between treetop and ground is normally dozens of meters, most sunlight is reflected into forest and energy is trapped in it.

You can't trap sunlight. You can't trap any light.
Tom Jin wrote:
This can explain why rain forest is much warmer than the desert at midnight.

It isn't.
Tom Jin wrote:
High humidity in rain forests also can help to trap energy.

You can't trap light.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
28-02-2020 20:11
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13301)
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Tom Jin wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
[quote]Tom Jin wrote:
5 a certain percent of remains of plants is buried in the soil every year and becomes rock later which causes the amount of carbon dioxide continuously decreases.
There is no carbon dioxide in plants. Plants need us just as much as we need plants.


Plants can change sunlight energy, water, carbon dioxide into carbohydrates. If some of the carbohydrates are not consumed by living things and eventually buried in the land and become rocks, the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will decrease gradually, which will lead to ice age on earth.


The sun, is the energy sources that keeps the planet warm. Plants, CO2, and all those other things have no meaningful effect, on temperature. Plants only make use of a very tiny portion of the Sun's energy that reaches them. CO2 is a trace gas, only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.


If you compare Amazon rain forest and Sahara desert, you will not deny temperature can be changed by plants. The capability of storing sunlight energy in plants makes the difference.

Plants cannot change the temperature.


Yes, plants can change the temperature of the atmosphere.

Nope. You can't create energy out of nothing.
Tom Jin wrote:
Actually, it plays a key role.

None.
Tom Jin wrote:
During the ice age, carbon dioxide content is low than 250 ppm, in some extreme situations, it even reaches 100 ppm.

No one was measuring CO2 during the ice age. We don't even know if there WAS an ice age.
Tom Jin wrote:
Most forest can't obtain enough food (I mean carbon dioxide)

CO2 is not food.
Tom Jin wrote:
and is replaced by bushland, grassland or even desert.

Bushes and grass use CO2 to make carbohydrates more effectively than trees. There is vegetation in the deserts too.
Tom Jin wrote:
you mention Stefan-Boltzmann law last time, actually, this law is very useful. It can help us to calculate how much sunlight energy can be trapped in rain forests in the daytime.

You can't trap light.
Tom Jin wrote:
I guess more than 50%. In the desert, when top sand becomes very hot, it can not store any energy, it just refect all energy back to the atmosphere and back to outer space.

If the sand is hot from absorbing energy from the Sun, that is not reflection. That is absorption.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit




Join the debate a new model of global warming (before 10000BC):

Remember me

Related content
ThreadsRepliesLast post
Welcome to model-land!031-10-2019 16:20
High carbon dioxide could suppress cooling clouds, climate change model warns127-02-2019 20:54
GreenMan's Climate Model4001-03-2018 21:16
Climate model projections compared to observations2512-11-2017 18:58
The Global Temperature Model4023-07-2016 10:22
▲ Top of page
Public Poll
Who is leading the renewable energy race?

US

EU

China

Japan

India

Brazil

Other

Don't know


Thanks for supporting Climate-Debate.com.
Copyright © 2009-2020 Climate-Debate.com | About | Contact