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Arctic waters not freezing15-11-2016 13:00
climate scientist
★★☆☆☆
(257)
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

To summarise, the average temperature at Barrow in October 2016 is only -1 deg C, whereas the long-term average in October is around -8 deg C. Data show that in September 2016, the sea-ice matched the 2007 record for being the lowest sea-ice extent on record.

Very low summer sea-ice in the Arctic seems to have implications for northern hemisphere winter weather patterns, owing to a shift in the polar vortex. See this article in Nature Climate Change here: http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate3136.html

The late winter (February) polar vortex has been shifting away from the North American continent and closer to the Eurasian continent over the past three decades. The authors found that there is a larger polar vortex over Eurasia and a smaller polar vortex over North America during very low Arctic sea-ice years. This has likely led to increased snowfall over the Eurasian continent over the last three decades, and has implications for future Eurasian winter weather, given that the September sea-ice minimum in the Arctic is predicted to decrease further.
15-11-2016 13:30
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
climate scientist wrote:
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

Do you have any articles from authoritative sources about things that are actually happening?


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
16-11-2016 00:27
Ceist
★★★☆☆
(592)
climate scientist wrote:
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

To summarise, the average temperature at Barrow in October 2016 is only -1 deg C, whereas the long-term average in October is around -8 deg C. Data show that in September 2016, the sea-ice matched the 2007 record for being the lowest sea-ice extent on record.

Very low summer sea-ice in the Arctic seems to have implications for northern hemisphere winter weather patterns, owing to a shift in the polar vortex. See this article in Nature Climate Change here: http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate3136.html

The late winter (February) polar vortex has been shifting away from the North American continent and closer to the Eurasian continent over the past three decades. The authors found that there is a larger polar vortex over Eurasia and a smaller polar vortex over North America during very low Arctic sea-ice years. This has likely led to increased snowfall over the Eurasian continent over the last three decades, and has implications for future Eurasian winter weather, given that the September sea-ice minimum in the Arctic is predicted to decrease further.


Thanks for the link to the paper published in Nature- Climate Change.

Here's some news from the other hemisphere:

http://acecrc.org.au/news/low-winter-sea-ice-coverage-around-antarctica/



Figure 1: Dark blue line represents 2016 sea ice extent. Light blue area represents maximum/minimum recorded extent between 1979-2015. Black line represents average extent between 1979-2015


16-11-2016 13:32
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
Ceist wrote: Thanks for the link to the paper published in Nature- Climate Change.

It's nice to get caught up on your favorite soap opera.

Hey, did you hear Trump won over here? Yeah, Hillary won't be making her crimes just "go away." I thought you'd be pleased to know the world will be a better place going forward.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
16-11-2016 21:48
Ceist
★★★☆☆
(592)
climate scientist wrote:
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

To summarise, the average temperature at Barrow in October 2016 is only -1 deg C, whereas the long-term average in October is around -8 deg C. Data show that in September 2016, the sea-ice matched the 2007 record for being the lowest sea-ice extent on record.

Very low summer sea-ice in the Arctic seems to have implications for northern hemisphere winter weather patterns, owing to a shift in the polar vortex. See this article in Nature Climate Change here: http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate3136.html

The late winter (February) polar vortex has been shifting away from the North American continent and closer to the Eurasian continent over the past three decades. The authors found that there is a larger polar vortex over Eurasia and a smaller polar vortex over North America during very low Arctic sea-ice years. This has likely led to increased snowfall over the Eurasian continent over the last three decades, and has implications for future Eurasian winter weather, given that the September sea-ice minimum in the Arctic is predicted to decrease further.


NASA Sees Temperatures Rise and Sea Ice Shrink - Climate Trends 2016
https://youtu.be/JK7NV2YheGk

http://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/2016/climate-trends-continue-to-break-records



Edited on 16-11-2016 21:49
17-11-2016 00:45
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
With the High Arctic in darkness for almost 2 months to date:
1990's decade of Arctic sea ice extent to date was 4% less than that of the 1980's.
2000's decade of Arctic sea ice extent to date was 10% less than that of the 1980's.
The year 2012 of Arctic sea ice extent to date was 20% less than that of the 1980's.
The year 2016 of Arctic sea ice extent to date is 23% less than that of the 1980's.
The 1980's average November 1 Arctic sea ice VOLUME was 18,100 cubic kilometers. November 1, 2016 Arctic sea ice VOLUME was 6400 cubic kilometers, a loss of 11,700 cubic kilometers or a loss of 64.6%. The energy needed to melt this ice is 36 times the U.S. annual energy consumption. Since 1958, High Arctic temperature has been rising (more before satellite temperatures?). Two plus years ago, High Arctic temperature over nearly 4 million square kilometers, for 140 straight days was over average. For a few days at the end of 2015, the North Pole was THAWING! From the end of 2015 into 2016, there were 150 straight days over average temperature. For 100 straight days during that period, temperatures were 3degC to 11degC over average. For 65 straight days presently, High Arctic temperatures are & have been over average AND MOSTLY WAY OVER AVERAGE. High Arctic temperatures over nearly 4 million square kilometers presently are 18degC over average...I believe the highest anomaly since 1958. For 10 years the sun has been at a low TSI (including a 3+ year period, setting a 100 year record low). But, Earth temperatures have not returned to early 20th century levels. For 385+(?) straight months, Earth temperatures have been over the 20th century average.
Edited on 17-11-2016 00:56
17-11-2016 00:46
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
Ceist wrote:NASA Sees Temperatures Rise and Sea Ice Shrink - Climate Trends 2016

...and NASA will continue to "see" these things until Trump replaces its political appointee oversight.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-11-2016 00:50
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:With the High Arctic in darkness for almost 2 months:.

litesong, buddy! Welcome to Climate-Debate. Did you hear that Trump won? I apologize for not keeping abreast of your Arctic updates but now that you're here I hope you'll stay a while.

Good to see you.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-11-2016 04:17
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.
//////
litesong wrote:
The preferred classes of IBM, where NOT science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in its non-earned hi skule DEE-plooomaa.
17-11-2016 06:10
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
"where" is "were".
17-11-2016 12:38
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.
//////
litesong wrote:
The preferred classes of IBM, where NOT science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in its non-earned hi skule DEE-plooomaa.

litesong! Great to see you. How's Earthlig-1 holding up? How's everything in Washington State?


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-11-2016 23:09
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
High Arctic temperatures over nearly 4 million square kilometers presently are 18degC over average...I believe the highest anomaly since 1958.


ibm bluffed:
litesong, buddy! Welcome to Climate-Debate. Good to see you.
litesong! Great to see you.
///////
litesong wrote:
High Arctic temperatures over nearly 4 million square kilometers, have reached their highest satellite recorded anomaly temperatures, now of 19degC. over average. Of course, this recent vast inundation of southern heat to High Arctic darkness is on top of the nearly 70 days of over-energy heat that has battled Arctic ice formation. Yes, this icing (no icing?) on the cake has lead present Arctic sea ice VOLUME to be 64+% less than the average to date Arctic sea ice VOLUME of the 1980's. The 19degC over average temperature may be on the verge of moderating. However, the nearly 70 days of over-heating may NOT be ending & could easily continue well past 100 days. We'll see.
17-11-2016 23:41
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
November 18, 2014 High Arctic temperature, averaged over millions of square kilometers was -24 degC, 1 degC over average. Present High Arctic temperature, averaged over millions of square kilometers is -6degC. 2016 High Arctic temperature hasn't been near 1degC of the average temperature for 65+ days.
Edited on 17-11-2016 23:44
18-11-2016 00:26
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
However, the nearly 70 days of over-heating may NOT be ending & could easily continue well past 100 days. We'll see.


Ten years ago, I probably wouldn't have made such a statement, altho over-average High Arctic temperature periods were increasing, along with higher High Arctic temperatures, for over half a century. Now tho, between August to May, when direct solar energy is near or at its least effect, anomalous High Arctic temperatures AND OVER-AVERAGE TIME PERIODS have just went berserk. Yes, the term High Arctic Berserker is in play.... & more fitting than other applications to the Norse Warrior term.
Edited on 18-11-2016 00:28
18-11-2016 13:21
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:Ten years ago, I probably wouldn't have made such a statement, altho over-average High Arctic temperature periods were increasing, along with higher High Arctic temperatures, for over half a century. Now tho, between August to May, when direct solar energy is near or at its least effect, anomalous High Arctic temperatures AND OVER-AVERAGE TIME PERIODS have just went berserk. Yes, the term High Arctic Berserker is in play.... & more fitting than other applications to the Norse Warrior term.

litesong buddy, I don't get it. You spent an entire year explaining to those climate-lemming knuckleheads that the Arctic thermal berserkers brought COLDER temperatures, not warmer temperatures because they push the Arctic freeze to the south.

Is this new berserker different?


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
18-11-2016 14:42
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:litesong buddy, I don't get it.
//////
litesong wrote: Indeed, IBM didn't get science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in its unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa. Also, IBM didn't get buddies.
18-11-2016 22:46
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:litesong buddy, I don't get it.
//////
litesong wrote: Indeed, IBM didn't get science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in its unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa. Also, IBM didn't get buddies.

litesong, buddy, you totally rock. Go "climate" berserkers!


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
19-11-2016 21:40
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
litesong wrote:
However, the nearly 70 days of over-heating may NOT be ending & could easily continue well past 100 days. We'll see.


Ten years ago, I probably wouldn't have made such a statement, altho over-average High Arctic temperature periods were increasing, along with higher High Arctic temperatures, for over half a century. Now tho, between August to May, when direct solar energy is near or at its least effect, anomalous High Arctic temperatures AND OVER-AVERAGE TIME PERIODS have just went berserk. Yes, the term High Arctic Berserker is in play.... & more fitting than other applications to the Norse Warrior term.


The High Arctic Berserker has seized some Arctic sea ice, causing it to cease. Presently, the Arctic sea ice is 140,000 square kilometers LESS than 2 days before. This sea ice loss is possibly within one month of the time that Arctic sea ice is NORMALLY at its most rapid formation. Yeah, the High Arctic Berserker is aptly named, but is only an effect of greater AGW powers at work.
19-11-2016 23:54
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:The High Arctic Berserker has seized some Arctic sea ice, causing it to cease.


The Global Warming berserker is kicking butt, melting ice and taking names.



Is he the one that's destroying polar bear territory and banishing them to floating icebergs?


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
20-11-2016 00:09
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
The present High Arctic Berserker has dropped Arctic sea ice 950,000 square kilometers to date BELOW the the stunning low level of 2012. It is good that ibm(inner bowel movement?) plays with its cartoons, since it never had science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in an unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa.
20-11-2016 01:18
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote: The present High Arctic Berserker has dropped Arctic sea ice 950,000 square kilometers to date BELOW the the stunning low level of 2012.


Late Breaking News
Army of Global Warming Berserkers Hits High Arctic
Al Jazeera crew captures dramatic footage of attack as entire ice families are decimated and Climate is lost amongst the carnage.
Al Jazeera



An IPCC-outlawed band of brigand Global Warming berserkers has raided millions of square kilometers of the high Arctic. Polar bears are fleeing for refugee camps that are already bursting at the seams. Huge tracts surrounding the North Pole are already without running water, electricity, and basic medical services. The ICRC has already declared the unprovoked assault "tantamount to torture."


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
20-11-2016 07:39
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:
litesong wrote: The present High Arctic Berserker has dropped Arctic sea ice 950,000 square kilometers to date BELOW the the stunning low level of 2012.
Army of Global Warming Berserkers


Meanwhile, High Arctic Berserker drops Arctic sea ice to date further to 1.11 million square kilometers LESS than the already dastardly low 2012 sea ice losses.

Also on the meanwhile, ibm continues its cartoon fails.[/quote]
20-11-2016 15:52
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:Meanwhile, High Arctic Berserker drops Arctic sea ice to date further to 1.11 million square kilometers LESS than the already dastardly low 2012 sea ice losses.

Correct, the Global Warming berserkers continue to hew at ice levels across millions of square kilometers of the high Arctic and continue to slash prices on auto insurance for families with multiple vehicles.




Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
20-11-2016 21:55
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
litesong wrote:the nearly 70 days of over-heating may NOT be ending & could easily continue well past 100 days. We'll see.
//////
litesong wrote: Tho the outrageous 19+degC over-average temperature on nearly 4 million square kilometers of the High Arctic is dropping, the High Arctic Berserker continues, now 140,000 square kilometers LESS that a few days ago, & approaching 75 straight days over-average. Anyone say 100+ days..... We'll see.
Edited on 20-11-2016 22:23
21-11-2016 12:24
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:
litesong wrote:the nearly 70 days of over-heating may NOT be ending & could easily continue well past 100 days. We'll see.
//////
litesong wrote: Tho the outrageous 19+degC over-average temperature on nearly 4 million square kilometers of the High Arctic is dropping, the High Arctic Berserker continues, now 140,000 square kilometers LESS that a few days ago, & approaching 75 straight days over-average. Anyone say 100+ days..... We'll see.

There's no stopping those ice-killing climate beserkers.




Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
21-11-2016 16:54
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:
[b]litesong wrote:...the High Arctic Berserker.....


There's no stopping those ice-killing climate beserkers.


Ah, you must've seen my post BEFORE I corrected the spelling.
21-11-2016 19:29
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:Ah, you must've seen my post BEFORE I corrected the spelling.

I'm just trying to help you spread the word, you know, to fight the good fight.

AGW-energy-powered "climate" berserkers: available now in an Arctic near you.




.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
22-11-2016 04:17
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:
litesong wrote:Ah, you must've seen my post BEFORE I corrected the spelling.

I'm just trying to help.....[/img]


But, all your cartoon characters look like T-rump, Steve Bannon, or General Flynn.
22-11-2016 11:59
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:But, all your cartoon characters look like T-rump, Steve Bannon, or General Flynn.

Like ass-kickers who get the job done and who win.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
22-11-2016 17:34
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
IBdaMann wrote:
litesong wrote:But, all your cartoon characters look like T-rump, Steve Bannon, or General Flynn.

Like ass-kickers who get the job done and who win.




"Sieg Heil" & the white nationalists salute in their meeting. Numbers doubled & growing since T-rump came on the scene. Their goal is back into the millions. All in the spirits of Strom Thurmond, Jesse Helms, Jeff Sessions, Gen. Flynn, Steve Bannon, & T-rump.

But the popular vote(THE VOTE in democratic countries) shows Hillary Clinton winning by 1.7 million votes(& increasing). Yeah, re-pubic-lick-uns show they win UN-democratically (electoral college, gerrymandering, chairmanships). Yeah again, the most undemocratic institution in america is the Congress.

Meanwhile, the High Arctic Berserker has extended to 75 days over "average" temperatures.
Edited on 22-11-2016 17:54
22-11-2016 19:16
spot
★★★☆☆
(925)
Stick to Warhammer or will they not play with you for making the rules up as you went along?
23-11-2016 00:56
KKING
☆☆☆☆☆
(11)
climate scientist wrote:
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

To summarise, the average temperature at Barrow in October 2016 is only -1 deg C, whereas the long-term average in October is around -8 deg C. Data show that in September 2016, the sea-ice matched the 2007 record for being the lowest sea-ice extent on record.

Very low summer sea-ice in the Arctic seems to have implications for northern hemisphere winter weather patterns, owing to a shift in the polar vortex. See this article in Nature Climate Change here: http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate3136.html

The late winter (February) polar vortex has been shifting away from the North American continent and closer to the Eurasian continent over the past three decades. The authors found that there is a larger polar vortex over Eurasia and a smaller polar vortex over North America during very low Arctic sea-ice years. This has likely led to increased snowfall over the Eurasian continent over the last three decades, and has implications for future Eurasian winter weather, given that the September sea-ice minimum in the Arctic is predicted to decrease further.


How so, I hear the arctic ice is growing, are we sure of using the same measures thickness, area, satellites, contaminated observational thingies?)? Can you please define how the Guardian, the purveyor of usually biased beliefs, come to this miraculous conclusion? I am only interested in the science, insults will get you reprimanded one would hope.
23-11-2016 05:32
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
[b]KKING wrote:..I hear the arctic ice is growing, are we sure of using the same measures thickness, area, satellites, contaminated observational thingies?)?


Sorry your hearing is non-existent. You would have saved your hearing by passing science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in your unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa to find the right units of measure. But you didn't & lost your hearing.

With the High Arctic in darkness for 2 months to date:
1990's decade of Arctic sea ice extent to date was 4% less than that of the 1980's.
2000's decade of Arctic sea ice extent to date was 10% less than that of the 1980's.
The year 2016 of Arctic sea ice extent to date is 23% less than that of the 1980's (with the recent downward lurch, 24+%).
The 1980's average November 1 Arctic sea ice VOLUME was 18,100 cubic kilometers. November 1, 2016 Arctic sea ice VOLUME was 6400 cubic kilometers, a loss of 11,700 cubic kilometers or a loss of 64.6%. The energy needed to melt this ice is 36 times the U.S. annual energy consumption. Since 1958, High Arctic temperature has been rising (more before satellite temperatures?). Two plus years ago, High Arctic temperature over nearly 4 million square kilometers, for 140 straight days was over average. For a few days at the end of 2015, the North Pole was THAWING! From the end of 2015 into 2016, there were 150 straight days over average temperature. For 100 straight days during that period, temperatures were 3degC to 11degC over average. For 75 straight days presently, High Arctic temperatures are & have been over average AND MOSTLY WAY OVER AVERAGE. High Arctic temperatures over nearly 4 million square kilometers presently are 20degC over average...I believe the highest anomaly since 1958. For 10 years the sun has been at a low TSI (including a 3+ year period, setting a 100 year record low). But, Earth temperatures have not returned to early 20th century levels. For 385+(?) straight months, Earth temperatures have been over the 20th century average.
////////
Citing climate scientist Ed Hawkins, Brandon compared the trend of sea ice extent to "a bouncy ball going down a hill" — it's definitely going down, but "sometimes it bounces higher and sometimes lower."
Edited on 23-11-2016 06:32
23-11-2016 13:06
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
KKING wrote: How so, I hear the arctic ice is growing, are we sure of using the same measures thickness, area, satellites, contaminated observational thingies?)? Can you please define how the Guardian, the purveyor of usually biased beliefs, come to this miraculous conclusion? I am only interested in the science, insults will get you reprimanded one would hope.

I recommend you peruse this thread for better coverage of the subject matter:

http://www.climate-debate.com/forum/lets-revisit-earths-ice-accumulation-d6-e1199.php

You are correct, the ice mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet and of Antarctica is steadily increasing. Hence warmizombies like to focus on "sea ice" which fluctuates every year with the weather. Since polar sea ice quantity is a random event, there is no such thing as a trend (just like there are no trends in coin flips) but they will insist that there is, and that it proves Global Warming.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
23-11-2016 13:22
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
KKING wrote:How so, I hear the arctic ice is growing, are we sure of using the same measures thickness, area, satellites, contaminated observational thingies?)? Can you please define how the Guardian, the purveyor of usually biased beliefs, come to this miraculous conclusion? I am only interested in the science, insults will get you reprimanded one would hope.

Oh, I forgot to mention, litesong makes some excellent posts. I recommend reading them both on this site (even in this very thread above) and on the Topix Global Warming forum. He's got a bazillion stories about AGW-energized heat demons assaulting the Arctic and forcing the freeze southward to provide us winter weather, and of "Climate" berserkers slashing Arctic ice to the bone. Very entertaining and well worth the read. You probably won't be able to put it down. His numbers are typically off by twelve to twenty degrees Celsius in favor of Global Warming but a little dab of suspension of disbelief will go a long way to placing you, the reader, right in the center of the action. Coming to theaters near you.




.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
23-11-2016 15:07
Surface Detail
★★★★☆
(1673)
KKING wrote:
climate scientist wrote:
See here for an interesting article about what is happening in the Arctic this year:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/14/why-sea-reluctant-freeze-arctic-climate-weatherwatch

To summarise, the average temperature at Barrow in October 2016 is only -1 deg C, whereas the long-term average in October is around -8 deg C. Data show that in September 2016, the sea-ice matched the 2007 record for being the lowest sea-ice extent on record.

Very low summer sea-ice in the Arctic seems to have implications for northern hemisphere winter weather patterns, owing to a shift in the polar vortex. See this article in Nature Climate Change here: http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate3136.html

The late winter (February) polar vortex has been shifting away from the North American continent and closer to the Eurasian continent over the past three decades. The authors found that there is a larger polar vortex over Eurasia and a smaller polar vortex over North America during very low Arctic sea-ice years. This has likely led to increased snowfall over the Eurasian continent over the last three decades, and has implications for future Eurasian winter weather, given that the September sea-ice minimum in the Arctic is predicted to decrease further.


How so, I hear the arctic ice is growing, are we sure of using the same measures thickness, area, satellites, contaminated observational thingies?)? Can you please define how the Guardian, the purveyor of usually biased beliefs, come to this miraculous conclusion? I am only interested in the science, insults will get you reprimanded one would hope.

You heard wrongly. The Arctic sea ice is currently at a record minimum for the time of year, continuing the downward trend of the last few decades. The Greenland ice cap has also been losing mass at an average rate of about 270 billion tons of ice per year for the past few years.

National Snow and Ice Data Center
A high-resolution record of Greenland mass balance

You hope in vain; insults don't get you reprimanded here. Nevertheless, some of us do choose to stick to the science, supporting our arguments with references to scientific articles and ignoring any name-calling.
23-11-2016 17:42
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
Surface Detail wrote: You heard wrongly. The Arctic sea ice is currently at a record minimum for the time of year, continuing the downward trend of the last few decades.

Did I call it or what? Fluctuations in sea ice quantity are random, controlled by the weather, which is random. There are no trends in random events.

But you so desperately NEED TO BELIEVE otherwise. It's looking like you never had any intention of grasping science in the first place.

Surface Detail wrote: The Greenland ice cap has also been losing mass at an average rate of about 270 billion tons of ice per year for the past few years.

Sorry, your pitiful denial won't get you any sympathy here. We fully debunked any and all of those crazy notions about Greenland ice mass disappearing. Boots on the ground performed actual measurements and Greenland has been accumulating ice mass balance at a rate of 2% per decade over the last five decades. The ice mass balance is steadily increasing. Your denial reveals the world of hurt in which you find yourself. Reality runs counter to your WACKY religious view. I don't know what to tell you.

Surface Detail wrote: You hope in vain; insults don't get you reprimanded here.

This site, unlike you, does not consider mere disagreement with your WACKY religious view to be an "insult." You really should stay off the internet. It is full of differing viewpoints, to include the correct ones. If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the blast furnace.

Surface Detail wrote: Nevertheless, some of us do choose to stick to the science, supporting our arguments with references to scientific articles and ignoring any name-calling.

Correction: You ignore the science and stick exclusively to name-calling.

Watch ...

Since temperature is a measure of energy, how do you explain temperature increasing without additional energy? (yes, I'm happy to let you run through your violation of the 1st LoT yet again)


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
24-11-2016 02:21
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
[b]IBdaMann wrote: Did I call it or what? Fluctuations....


You never called science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in an unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa. You flunked & fluctuated it away.
Edited on 24-11-2016 02:26
24-11-2016 04:46
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3109)
litesong wrote:
IBdaMann wrote: Did I call it or what? Fluctuations....
You never called science chemistry astronomy physics algebra & pre-calc in an unearned hi skule DEE-plooomaa. You flunked & fluctuated it away.

That AGW-energy berserker must have kicked my ass.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
24-11-2016 15:32
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
litesong wrote: But the popular vote (THE VOTE in democratic countries) shows Hillary Clinton winning by 1.7 million votes (& increasing). Yeah, re-pubic-lick-uns show they win UN-democratically (electoral college, gerrymandering, chairmanships).


The popular vote (THE VOTE in democratic countries) shows Hillary Clinton winning by 2+ million votes, now. Tho democrats wanted a popular vote (THE VOTE in democratic countries), undemocratic re-pubic-lick-uns used undemocratic methods to stall eliminating an electoral college.

In the past, re-pubic-lick-uns used to say every vote counted. Now, re-pubic-lick-uns say that 2+ million votes don't count. That's the re-pubic-lick-un way.... tho not the DEMOCRATIC WAY.
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