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Why I'm voting for Trump 2020!



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19-11-2020 06:16
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:...rural America.... they will stop providing the Biden voting counties with such necessities...
Such a weird an uninformed alternate reality you have there GFM.
What percent of the US population are farmers?
1.3%

Random number again. You are making up numbers. Argument from randU fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
Go watch your RED DAWN dvd again and keep dreaming of the day.

Life is not a movie, dude.
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:... Trump is correct. He won this election, and it was rigged ...There is a sworn affidavit from someone...
Was it the registered sex offender? Will you believe what the court has to say on the matter?

The court doesn't get to say. The jury does.
tmiddles wrote:
Sounds like you already KNOW along with Trump.

Evidence is pretty strong. Some of these States, facing this threat, are already starting recounts and audits.
tmiddles wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote:... Are you confident Trump has a smoking gun???
As you can see GFM doesn't need anything else. He already knows. Verdict is in.

It's not in. It's looking good for Trump though.
tmiddles wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:Republicans being shut out ...It's all on video.....
For the US court to determine right? Or are you going to INFOWARS or some other venue instead?

Bulverism fallacy. False authority fallacies.
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
Not allowing Republicans to oversee the process is ILLEGAL.
So a judge will make that finding right? Or are the courts "rigged" too?

Compositional error fallacy with people as the class...bigotry. Not all courts are the same, dude.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
19-11-2020 06:16
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
[b]tmiddles wrote:
What percent of the US population are farmers?
1.3%[/b]


Yeah, aren't those country bumpkins amazing? The average US farmer feeds 155 people.

So go ahead, see how long you can survive without them.




The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
19-11-2020 06:19
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
keepit wrote:
I guess the us would have to buy the food from other countries.
Would other countries boycott us farm goods?


We create more food than anywhere else on the planet. Perhaps you haven't noticed. Farmers and ranchers in the U.S. feed not only the cities and counties of the U.S., they feed the world.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
19-11-2020 06:54
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
GasGuzzler wrote:...country bumpkins....
Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

Just like with coal miners, we have a robot for that now (made and developed in town).

But hey double down on a vision for the future circa 1850 and see how far you get. Trump delivered nothing to this "group" (again almost almost no one there) except for shut down exports to China.
He doesn't have a time machine either.




One of the biggest farmers in the US is Warren Buffett's son Howard. Not a trump fan. Lives in a blue state...

Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:...He already knows. Verdict is in.

It's not in. It's looking good for Trump though.
And will you accept the due process or turn around and claim it was rigged?
Edited on 19-11-2020 07:03
19-11-2020 11:28
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2702)
You are full of it. Not that many farms use a lot of automated equipment. Not all food crops can be machine harvested either. Jobs numbers are misleading, as with most democrat math. Many of the jobs, like harvesting, are highly seasonal. You are likely quoting full time, and annual average employment, discounting those lacking citizen status. Republicans are quite as stupid as democrats, and don't buy silly crap, hockey-stick graphs. The vast majority of fresh produce at any supermarket, is hand-picked. Machines aren't gentle, and tend to spoil the product. When I moved to Florida, I picked a few oranges, and grapefruit. They had machines do some, for juicing, but they also pretty much hire anybody to hand pick for stores. Paid cash on the spot. That was only 30 years ago. Pretty sure that hasn't changed much. Most of the groves around here are now housing developments, condos, storage lockers, and strip malls.
19-11-2020 12:11
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
HarveyH55 wrote:
...democrat math....


So math where coal jobs came back is what then? Trumpomerty?

You know me Harvey. I trust my Google searches.

And you're right. If "Rural America" could get immigrant farm workers all counted in politically they'd increase their numbers quite a bit.
Edited on 19-11-2020 12:18
19-11-2020 14:52
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.
Edited on 19-11-2020 14:54
19-11-2020 18:44
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
tmiddles wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:...country bumpkins....
Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I'll be sure to tell that to all the family farmers that are my neighbors. It's going to take me awhile, there are lot of them on my particular highway and in my particular town. Then I'll start on the next county.
tmiddles wrote:
Just like with coal miners, we have a robot for that now (made and developed in town).

None of them have robots working in the fields. Tractors and trucks, but no robots. Each machine has a driver.
tmiddles wrote:
...deleted word salad nonsense and Holy Links...
One of the biggest farmers in the US is Warren Buffett's son Howard. Not a trump fan. Lives in a blue state...

Who the **** cares?
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:...He already knows. Verdict is in.

It's not in. It's looking good for Trump though.
And will you accept the due process or turn around and claim it was rigged?

RQAA.

You really need to get out in the country more. No, perhaps not. You and your kind are no longer welcome here.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
19-11-2020 18:47
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
...democrat math....


So math where coal jobs came back is what then? Trumpomerty?

You know me Harvey. I trust my Google searches.

And you're right. If "Rural America" could get immigrant farm workers all counted in politically they'd increase their numbers quite a bit.

Google is not God.

Coal is still being mined, farmers and ranchers are still there and they don't own any robots more complex than a washing machine, work the fields themselves with their tractors and trucks, deal with the stupid government, and STILL manage to feed the world.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
19-11-2020 19:07
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.


Sounds about right. Farming is no easy path to riches.

Ya gotta eat. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your own home. That's a cost.
Ya gotta fix your tractors and trucks when they break down (and they do) and otherwise perform maintenance on them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your barn and other outbuildings. That's a cost.
Ya gotta buy seed, fertilizer, pesticides, and other supplies. That's a cost.
Ya gotta store all your shit safely so seed, fertilizer, pesticides, etc. don't contaminate the food you harvested and have to store. That's a cost.
Ya gotta get your product to market. That's a cost.
Ya gotta go fix the well again or dig another. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for your electricity like everyone else. That's a cost.
Ya gotta insure your equipment and home against loss. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for government to come out and tell you that you are ruining your land. That's a cost.
Ya gotta hire help you work the fields. You often have to provide housing for some of them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep your critters from escaping using fencing and other means. That includes fixing the fence where the moron driving down the road drove through it. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep the rats, mice, pigeons, seagulls, rabbits, raccoons, deer, and other pests from destroying your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep foxes, rats, mice, bears, dogs, eagles, hawks, and other predators from harming your critters. That's a cost.
Ya gotta feed your own critters, buy your own critters, house your own critters, etc. That's a cost.
Ya gotta provide your own security. There is no police within any reasonable time. That's a cost.
Ya gotta figure out how to heat your place. That's a cost.
Ya gotta deal with weather damage yourself. Even losses that might destroy your crop, your home, your equipment, or your outbuildings have to be dealt with yourself. You fix the damage from the downed tree, the flooded fields, the parched crops, the heavy snow that finally did in that old shed, etc. yourself.
Ya gotta deal with irrigation of your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for telecommunications like a phone or internet line where there is no cable service. Maybe by paying for a satellite service. That's a cost.
Ya get paid once or twice a year, depending on your crop.

Oh...and according to the God tmiddles, ya gotta buy and maintain all your robots too. That's a cost.


**** tmiddles. He has no effing clue how a farm or ranch is run, what it takes to run one, or even what happens there day to day.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 19-11-2020 19:11
20-11-2020 05:24
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.


Sounds about right. Farming is no easy path to riches.

Ya gotta eat. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your own home. That's a cost.
Ya gotta fix your tractors and trucks when they break down (and they do) and otherwise perform maintenance on them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your barn and other outbuildings. That's a cost.
Ya gotta buy seed, fertilizer, pesticides, and other supplies. That's a cost.
Ya gotta store all your shit safely so seed, fertilizer, pesticides, etc. don't contaminate the food you harvested and have to store. That's a cost.
Ya gotta get your product to market. That's a cost.
Ya gotta go fix the well again or dig another. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for your electricity like everyone else. That's a cost.
Ya gotta insure your equipment and home against loss. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for government to come out and tell you that you are ruining your land. That's a cost.
Ya gotta hire help you work the fields. You often have to provide housing for some of them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep your critters from escaping using fencing and other means. That includes fixing the fence where the moron driving down the road drove through it. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep the rats, mice, pigeons, seagulls, rabbits, raccoons, deer, and other pests from destroying your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep foxes, rats, mice, bears, dogs, eagles, hawks, and other predators from harming your critters. That's a cost.
Ya gotta feed your own critters, buy your own critters, house your own critters, etc. That's a cost.
Ya gotta provide your own security. There is no police within any reasonable time. That's a cost.
Ya gotta figure out how to heat your place. That's a cost.
Ya gotta deal with weather damage yourself. Even losses that might destroy your crop, your home, your equipment, or your outbuildings have to be dealt with yourself. You fix the damage from the downed tree, the flooded fields, the parched crops, the heavy snow that finally did in that old shed, etc. yourself.
Ya gotta deal with irrigation of your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for telecommunications like a phone or internet line where there is no cable service. Maybe by paying for a satellite service. That's a cost.
Ya get paid once or twice a year, depending on your crop.

Oh...and according to the God tmiddles, ya gotta buy and maintain all your robots too. That's a cost.


**** tmiddles. He has no effing clue how a farm or ranch is run, what it takes to run one, or even what happens there day to day.


You've laid out the challenges of farming quite well. Reminds me of a conversation I had with a huge moron a few years ago.

I was paying for my stuff at an edge of town gas station. The employee took my money and glanced outside at the combine dumping soybeans into the grain truck just across the highway.

"I'm in the wrong business," he said. "That guy is putting $10,000 in his pocket every time he drives out of here with a truckload of beans".

I engaged him a bit and offered the fact that a combine can easily cost a half million dollars. He rambled some more and then offered up the argument that corn and beans are native to Iowa and grow on their own, and all a guy has to do is buy land and harvest the money one month out of the year.

At this point I realized the futility of the conversation. I held up my chocolate milk and said, "As long as that farmer keeps feeding and milking the brown cow I'm a happy man. Have a nice day!" The quizzical look on his face was painful.

SO many people could benefit SO much just by spending a single day outside the city limits. My door is always open, even to schmucks like tmids. Maybe I could teach him some Midwest values and common decency......but I doubt it.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
Edited on 20-11-2020 05:27
20-11-2020 06:11
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
Guzzler and ITN... You both are true American patriots!! God bless the both of you.
20-11-2020 06:39
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
Oh, and WI is known as the "dairy state"... we are commonly referred to as "cheeseheads"... farming is very big here... plenty of my neighbors are farmers... my best friend is also a farmer... none of them are "multimillionaires"... my neighbor has had a tarp over his house roof for many years now... his outdoor buildings are quite run down... he has sold off a couple small plots of his farmland and houses are there now. His equipment is for the most part quite aged... HARDLY a "multimillionaire"... Same goes for my other farmer neighbors... Sure, there's some corporate farms in the area, and they seem to be doing quite well, but many of the small family farms in my area are struggling, especially if they are not doing the whole "organic farming" thing... my best friend who is a farmer is also nowhere near being a "multimillionaire" either...

You have absolutely no ****ing clue what you are talking about tmiddles... you have obviously never spent a full day inside of (at least what felt like) a 120degF haymow, sweating your ****ing ass off, stacking wagon after wagon after wagon after wagon load full of hay for the critters to eat, for one of many examples of what farmers do to feed the animals that feed YOU, and grow the crops that feed YOU... I'm not a farmer myself, but I've helped out farmers with such manual labor when necessary... that's what rural God-fearing folks do... they look out for each other. They have each other's backs.

When my road flooded over and tree stumps and other debris settled in the road so it was undriveable, the township didn't instantly show up to clear it... no, I was out there with my run down tractor and I cleared it out by myself, for me and my neighbors...

You don't know a damn thing about rural life, tmiddles... you don't know a damn thing about flyover country... you don't appreciate the hard work and very long seven day work weeks that such people do each and every day to provide you with food, water, energy, and many other supplies that you regularly make use of each and every day.

Get out of the city and learn a little... appreciate all of the good things, all of the hard sweaty manual labor, that the people who your Demonrat leaders tell you to hate actually do for you on a daily basis...
Edited on 20-11-2020 06:55
20-11-2020 10:01
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2702)
I think Twiddles knows that there are a lot of jobs, that require actual people, doing physical labor. It just makes him feel better about himself, that he never had to stoop to our level, and pretend we are no better than machines.
20-11-2020 14:20
James___
★★★★★
(3429)
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.
Edited on 20-11-2020 14:39
20-11-2020 17:32
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
20-11-2020 18:03
James___
★★★★★
(3429)
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.



And now you're threatening me. Did I tell you that my grandmother's neighbor had a bunch of livestock? They had a dairy farm. Yep, cattle grazing is definitely a lot of work.
The cows actually knew to come in so they could be milked.
Ever taste milk straight from the cow? When milk is pasteurized, it tastes different. An acquired taste is necessary to be able to drink it.
20-11-2020 18:35
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
James___ wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.



And now you're threatening me. Did I tell you that my grandmother's neighbor had a bunch of livestock? They had a dairy farm. Yep, cattle grazing is definitely a lot of work.
The cows actually knew to come in so they could be milked.
Ever taste milk straight from the cow? When milk is pasteurized, it tastes different. An acquired taste is necessary to be able to drink it.


No threat, just saying a farmer won't take kindly to you telling him he doesn't work much.

Ever taste milk straight from a goat? Grandpa always raised goats. Grew up on goat burgers and goat milk. Haven't had either in 30 years, probably now it would taste like shit.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
20-11-2020 18:58
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
GasGuzzler wrote:
I know a lot of farmers. ...None are multimillionaires.

2018 average farmer net worth: 2.8 million

Y'all seem a bit confused about the difference between a farmer and a farm hand.

Maybe you think a teller owns the bank.

Even for farm hands the automation takes over year by year.




Trumpers do seem lost in an antiquated bygone era.
Edited on 20-11-2020 19:28
20-11-2020 19:20
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
James___ wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.



And now you're threatening me.

No, he's just saying that you would be 'poking the bear'... that tends to eventually lead to one's moronic ass getting kicked...

James___ wrote:
Did I tell you that my grandmother's neighbor had a bunch of livestock? They had a dairy farm.

Obviously you didn't pay much (if any) attention to all of the work that goes into livestock...

James___ wrote:
Yep, cattle grazing is definitely a lot of work.
The cows actually knew to come in so they could be milked.
Ever taste milk straight from the cow? When milk is pasteurized, it tastes different. An acquired taste is necessary to be able to drink it.

Having livestock involves A LOT more than "cattle grazing" and "milking"... Although I've seen a small bit of what farmers do, I am definitely not a farmer myself, so correct me if I am wrong, and forgive me if I don't know specific nuances, but this is just a very small sampling of the manual labor that having livestock involves:

** Livestock (such as cows) can sometimes slip on hard wet surfaces and end up "doing the splits"... In such a case, hopefully one notices the event soon enough and hopefully the cow is okay to where it can be pulled back up onto its feet. That requires awareness, time, and effort.

** Livestock don't solely eat grass. They also eat hay, silage, grain (and other supplements and foods). Feeding the critters on a daily basis, and gathering/storing/transporting such food requires manual labor.

** Livestock (females) can give birth. Farmers have to be around and aware when this occurs so that they can assist with the birthing, especially if it doesn't go smoothly. That requires manual labor.

** Cows have to be milked twice a day, no matter how sick and crummy you are feeling. Thankfully it doesn't have to be done by hand anymore, but there is still some manual labor involved with hooking up all of the machines to their teats. Even with the milking machines, it is NOT a fun job.

** Livestock do #2, and they do it A LOT... Their pens need to be cleaned out, their bedding needs to be discarded and replaced, and their excrement and used bedding needs to be taken care of. That all requires manual labor.

** Livestock also need to be able to drink water. If there is no natural or accessible source of water available to them, then such a source needs to be provided (and constantly refilled). In the winter, that water source needs to remain unfrozen, as livestock cannot drink ice. That all requires manual labor.

** Livestock also need to be vaccinated, dewormed, groomed, trimmed, cared for if they happen to fall ill, and etc... That all requires manual labor.

** Livestock need to be kept safe from predators, from the elements, and need to be kept track of so that they don't wander off of the property and etc... That requires building and maintaining fencing and various shelters. That requires manual labor.


That's just the beginning of it, and that doesn't even get into all of the rules and regulations that are placed upon farmers that even further shove Uncle Sam's d*** up their asses...

I thank God for farmers since they are willing to put in all of that hard work, all the while getting f***ed up the ass by Uncle Sam, while typically barely holding their own financially (or downright struggling to get by), in order to feed themselves and others.
Edited on 20-11-2020 19:27
20-11-2020 19:37
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
tmiddles wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
I know a lot of farmers. ...None are multimillionaires.

2018 average farmer net worth: 2.8 million

Y'all seem a bit confused about the difference between a farmer and a farm hand.

Maybe you think a teller owns the bank.

Even for farm hands the automation takes over year by year.




Trumpers do seem lost in an antiquated bygone era.

Here, you are making up numbers as well as putting on full display your lack of accounting and finance knowledge...
20-11-2020 19:44
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
gfm7175 wrote:
...you are making up numbers...
ah and here we have the relevance to this board.

The NOTHING CAN BE KNOWN defense.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-household-well-being/income-and-wealth-in-context/

Is the USDA rigged too?

"Households operating commercial farms had $2.8 million in total wealth at the median"
20-11-2020 19:51
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
...you are making up numbers...
ah and here we have the relevance to this board.

The NOTHING CAN BE KNOWN defense.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-household-well-being/income-and-wealth-in-context/

Is the USDA rigged too?

"Households operating commercial farms had $2.8 million in total wealth at the median"

You continue to show your complete lack of accounting, finance, and mathematics knowledge... "total wealth" is not just 'liquid assets', nor is it a 'net worth'... 'median' is not an 'average'.

The 'nothing can be known' mantra of yours is a bogus position assignment, and will next time be dismissed as a violation of the tmiddles ordinance.
Edited on 20-11-2020 19:53
20-11-2020 19:58
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
...you are making up numbers...
ah and here we have the relevance to this board.

The NOTHING CAN BE KNOWN defense.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-household-well-being/income-and-wealth-in-context/

Is the USDA rigged too?

"Households operating commercial farms had $2.8 million in total wealth at the median"


Also from your article is info on the average family farm, which is what was being discussed, dumbass.

In 2018, the typical U.S. farm household had $862,000 in wealth.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
Edited on 20-11-2020 19:59
20-11-2020 20:13
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.


Sounds about right. Farming is no easy path to riches.

Ya gotta eat. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your own home. That's a cost.
Ya gotta fix your tractors and trucks when they break down (and they do) and otherwise perform maintenance on them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your barn and other outbuildings. That's a cost.
Ya gotta buy seed, fertilizer, pesticides, and other supplies. That's a cost.
Ya gotta store all your shit safely so seed, fertilizer, pesticides, etc. don't contaminate the food you harvested and have to store. That's a cost.
Ya gotta get your product to market. That's a cost.
Ya gotta go fix the well again or dig another. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for your electricity like everyone else. That's a cost.
Ya gotta insure your equipment and home against loss. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for government to come out and tell you that you are ruining your land. That's a cost.
Ya gotta hire help you work the fields. You often have to provide housing for some of them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep your critters from escaping using fencing and other means. That includes fixing the fence where the moron driving down the road drove through it. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep the rats, mice, pigeons, seagulls, rabbits, raccoons, deer, and other pests from destroying your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep foxes, rats, mice, bears, dogs, eagles, hawks, and other predators from harming your critters. That's a cost.
Ya gotta feed your own critters, buy your own critters, house your own critters, etc. That's a cost.
Ya gotta provide your own security. There is no police within any reasonable time. That's a cost.
Ya gotta figure out how to heat your place. That's a cost.
Ya gotta deal with weather damage yourself. Even losses that might destroy your crop, your home, your equipment, or your outbuildings have to be dealt with yourself. You fix the damage from the downed tree, the flooded fields, the parched crops, the heavy snow that finally did in that old shed, etc. yourself.
Ya gotta deal with irrigation of your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for telecommunications like a phone or internet line where there is no cable service. Maybe by paying for a satellite service. That's a cost.
Ya get paid once or twice a year, depending on your crop.

Oh...and according to the God tmiddles, ya gotta buy and maintain all your robots too. That's a cost.


**** tmiddles. He has no effing clue how a farm or ranch is run, what it takes to run one, or even what happens there day to day.


You've laid out the challenges of farming quite well. Reminds me of a conversation I had with a huge moron a few years ago.

I was paying for my stuff at an edge of town gas station. The employee took my money and glanced outside at the combine dumping soybeans into the grain truck just across the highway.

"I'm in the wrong business," he said. "That guy is putting $10,000 in his pocket every time he drives out of here with a truckload of beans".

I engaged him a bit and offered the fact that a combine can easily cost a half million dollars. He rambled some more and then offered up the argument that corn and beans are native to Iowa and grow on their own, and all a guy has to do is buy land and harvest the money one month out of the year.

At this point I realized the futility of the conversation. I held up my chocolate milk and said, "As long as that farmer keeps feeding and milking the brown cow I'm a happy man. Have a nice day!" The quizzical look on his face was painful.

SO many people could benefit SO much just by spending a single day outside the city limits. My door is always open, even to schmucks like tmids. Maybe I could teach him some Midwest values and common decency......but I doubt it.

Certainly generous of you, but schmucks like tmiddles tries to make farming life more difficult by his attempts to make the Church of Global Warming, the Church of Covid, and the Church of Green state religions.

Why would you invite losers like this into your home? He will see the watering pond out back and claim it's 'natural wetland' and get the government to take the use of your land, to protect a bird that isn't even living on your property. He will claim that the pesticides you are using are 'dangerous' and should be banned, leaving you with no way to control insects destroying your crop. He will ban gasoline diesel engines, leaving you with no trucks, no tractors, no combine, no anything, since none of it can do it's job properly on batteries.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:15
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
gfm7175 wrote:
Guzzler and ITN... You both are true American patriots!! God bless the both of you.

You can join that compliment as well. You are trying to fight for upholding the Constitution of the United States and of the State of Wisconsin.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:21
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
HarveyH55 wrote:
I think Twiddles knows that there are a lot of jobs, that require actual people, doing physical labor. It just makes him feel better about himself, that he never had to stoop to our level, and pretend we are no better than machines.


He puts down anything like plumbers, electricians, framers, farmers, ranchers, garbage collectors, gravel pit operators, well diggers, road workers, truckers, the police, mechanics, etc. because the are 'below' his class. They are all just blue collar morons to him.

NOTHING in the city would function without them.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:22
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.

If he survives it!


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:27
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.



And now you're threatening me. Did I tell you that my grandmother's neighbor had a bunch of livestock? They had a dairy farm. Yep, cattle grazing is definitely a lot of work.
The cows actually knew to come in so they could be milked.
Ever taste milk straight from the cow? When milk is pasteurized, it tastes different. An acquired taste is necessary to be able to drink it.


No threat, just saying a farmer won't take kindly to you telling him he doesn't work much.

Ever taste milk straight from a goat? Grandpa always raised goats. Grew up on goat burgers and goat milk. Haven't had either in 30 years, probably now it would taste like shit.

Goats are weird. Never raised 'em myself. Some neighbors around here will rent them to clear off some land. I just use a hog mower or a plow, depending on what I'm going to use that bit of land for.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:30
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
tmiddles wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
I know a lot of farmers. ...None are multimillionaires.

2018 average farmer net worth: 2.8 million

Random number. Argument from randU fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
Y'all seem a bit confused about the difference between a farmer and a farm hand.

We are describing farmers, not farm hands.
tmiddles wrote:
Even for farm hands the automation takes over year by year.

What automation? The tractor? The truck? The combine? No, they don't replace farmhands.
tmiddles wrote:
Trumpers do seem lost in an antiquated bygone era.

It's not a bygone era. Farming exists.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 20:35
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
...you are making up numbers...
ah and here we have the relevance to this board.

The NOTHING CAN BE KNOWN defense.

No one ever made that argument, dumbass.
tmiddles wrote:
Is the USDA rigged too?

Yes. It's a government agency like any other. Like usual, you are taking government statistics completely out of context as well.
tmiddles wrote:
"Households operating commercial farms had $2.8 million in total wealth at the median"

You DO know how much land, equipment, barns, houses, etc cost, right? 2.8 million in assets with 2.8 million in liabilities means no net worth, dumbass.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-11-2020 21:19
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
...you are making up numbers...
ah and here we have the relevance to this board.

The NOTHING CAN BE KNOWN defense.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-household-well-being/income-and-wealth-in-context/

Is the USDA rigged too?

"Households operating commercial farms had $2.8 million in total wealth at the median"


Also from your article is info on the average family farm, which is what was being discussed, dumbass.

In 2018, the typical U.S. farm household had $862,000 in wealth.

BINGO!! and nice catch on that... I didn't even bother to look at his article.
20-11-2020 22:25
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.


Sounds about right. Farming is no easy path to riches.

Ya gotta eat. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your own home. That's a cost.
Ya gotta fix your tractors and trucks when they break down (and they do) and otherwise perform maintenance on them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your barn and other outbuildings. That's a cost.
Ya gotta buy seed, fertilizer, pesticides, and other supplies. That's a cost.
Ya gotta store all your shit safely so seed, fertilizer, pesticides, etc. don't contaminate the food you harvested and have to store. That's a cost.
Ya gotta get your product to market. That's a cost.
Ya gotta go fix the well again or dig another. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for your electricity like everyone else. That's a cost.
Ya gotta insure your equipment and home against loss. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for government to come out and tell you that you are ruining your land. That's a cost.
Ya gotta hire help you work the fields. You often have to provide housing for some of them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep your critters from escaping using fencing and other means. That includes fixing the fence where the moron driving down the road drove through it. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep the rats, mice, pigeons, seagulls, rabbits, raccoons, deer, and other pests from destroying your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep foxes, rats, mice, bears, dogs, eagles, hawks, and other predators from harming your critters. That's a cost.
Ya gotta feed your own critters, buy your own critters, house your own critters, etc. That's a cost.
Ya gotta provide your own security. There is no police within any reasonable time. That's a cost.
Ya gotta figure out how to heat your place. That's a cost.
Ya gotta deal with weather damage yourself. Even losses that might destroy your crop, your home, your equipment, or your outbuildings have to be dealt with yourself. You fix the damage from the downed tree, the flooded fields, the parched crops, the heavy snow that finally did in that old shed, etc. yourself.
Ya gotta deal with irrigation of your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for telecommunications like a phone or internet line where there is no cable service. Maybe by paying for a satellite service. That's a cost.
Ya get paid once or twice a year, depending on your crop.

Oh...and according to the God tmiddles, ya gotta buy and maintain all your robots too. That's a cost.


**** tmiddles. He has no effing clue how a farm or ranch is run, what it takes to run one, or even what happens there day to day.


You've laid out the challenges of farming quite well. Reminds me of a conversation I had with a huge moron a few years ago.

I was paying for my stuff at an edge of town gas station. The employee took my money and glanced outside at the combine dumping soybeans into the grain truck just across the highway.

"I'm in the wrong business," he said. "That guy is putting $10,000 in his pocket every time he drives out of here with a truckload of beans".

I engaged him a bit and offered the fact that a combine can easily cost a half million dollars. He rambled some more and then offered up the argument that corn and beans are native to Iowa and grow on their own, and all a guy has to do is buy land and harvest the money one month out of the year.

At this point I realized the futility of the conversation. I held up my chocolate milk and said, "As long as that farmer keeps feeding and milking the brown cow I'm a happy man. Have a nice day!" The quizzical look on his face was painful.

SO many people could benefit SO much just by spending a single day outside the city limits. My door is always open, even to schmucks like tmids. Maybe I could teach him some Midwest values and common decency......but I doubt it.

Certainly generous of you, but schmucks like tmiddles tries to make farming life more difficult by his attempts to make the Church of Global Warming, the Church of Covid, and the Church of Green state religions.

Why would you invite losers like this into your home? He will see the watering pond out back and claim it's 'natural wetland' and get the government to take the use of your land, to protect a bird that isn't even living on your property. He will claim that the pesticides you are using are 'dangerous' and should be banned, leaving you with no way to control insects destroying your crop. He will ban gasoline diesel engines, leaving you with no trucks, no tractors, no combine, no anything, since none of it can do it's job properly on batteries.


Simple answer? Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
20-11-2020 22:37
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1875)
Into the Night wrote:
You DO know how much land, equipment, barns, houses, etc cost, right? 2.8 million in assets with 2.8 million in liabilities means no net worth, dumbass.


Great point, especially the part about the dumbass.


All the time the base and surface are at equal temperature as the equilibrium graduates to establish the temperature development--Pete Rogers
20-11-2020 22:52
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1325)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
You DO know how much land, equipment, barns, houses, etc cost, right? 2.8 million in assets with 2.8 million in liabilities means no net worth, dumbass.


Great point, especially the part about the dumbass.

That was my favorite part as well.
20-11-2020 23:14
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13776)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Again you re living in a very strange alternate universe GG. Farming is automated and the average "farmer" is a multimillionaire. Your country farm family fantasy disappeared a long time ago.

I know a lot of farmers. Some do pretty well. Others are struggling. None are multimillionaires.

tmiddles wrote: I trust my Google searches.


Terrible mistake. Google is biased and has full blown filters on their searches.


Sounds about right. Farming is no easy path to riches.

Ya gotta eat. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your own home. That's a cost.
Ya gotta fix your tractors and trucks when they break down (and they do) and otherwise perform maintenance on them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta maintain your barn and other outbuildings. That's a cost.
Ya gotta buy seed, fertilizer, pesticides, and other supplies. That's a cost.
Ya gotta store all your shit safely so seed, fertilizer, pesticides, etc. don't contaminate the food you harvested and have to store. That's a cost.
Ya gotta get your product to market. That's a cost.
Ya gotta go fix the well again or dig another. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for your electricity like everyone else. That's a cost.
Ya gotta insure your equipment and home against loss. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for government to come out and tell you that you are ruining your land. That's a cost.
Ya gotta hire help you work the fields. You often have to provide housing for some of them. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep your critters from escaping using fencing and other means. That includes fixing the fence where the moron driving down the road drove through it. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep the rats, mice, pigeons, seagulls, rabbits, raccoons, deer, and other pests from destroying your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta keep foxes, rats, mice, bears, dogs, eagles, hawks, and other predators from harming your critters. That's a cost.
Ya gotta feed your own critters, buy your own critters, house your own critters, etc. That's a cost.
Ya gotta provide your own security. There is no police within any reasonable time. That's a cost.
Ya gotta figure out how to heat your place. That's a cost.
Ya gotta deal with weather damage yourself. Even losses that might destroy your crop, your home, your equipment, or your outbuildings have to be dealt with yourself. You fix the damage from the downed tree, the flooded fields, the parched crops, the heavy snow that finally did in that old shed, etc. yourself.
Ya gotta deal with irrigation of your crop. That's a cost.
Ya gotta pay for telecommunications like a phone or internet line where there is no cable service. Maybe by paying for a satellite service. That's a cost.
Ya get paid once or twice a year, depending on your crop.

Oh...and according to the God tmiddles, ya gotta buy and maintain all your robots too. That's a cost.


**** tmiddles. He has no effing clue how a farm or ranch is run, what it takes to run one, or even what happens there day to day.


You've laid out the challenges of farming quite well. Reminds me of a conversation I had with a huge moron a few years ago.

I was paying for my stuff at an edge of town gas station. The employee took my money and glanced outside at the combine dumping soybeans into the grain truck just across the highway.

"I'm in the wrong business," he said. "That guy is putting $10,000 in his pocket every time he drives out of here with a truckload of beans".

I engaged him a bit and offered the fact that a combine can easily cost a half million dollars. He rambled some more and then offered up the argument that corn and beans are native to Iowa and grow on their own, and all a guy has to do is buy land and harvest the money one month out of the year.

At this point I realized the futility of the conversation. I held up my chocolate milk and said, "As long as that farmer keeps feeding and milking the brown cow I'm a happy man. Have a nice day!" The quizzical look on his face was painful.

SO many people could benefit SO much just by spending a single day outside the city limits. My door is always open, even to schmucks like tmids. Maybe I could teach him some Midwest values and common decency......but I doubt it.

Certainly generous of you, but schmucks like tmiddles tries to make farming life more difficult by his attempts to make the Church of Global Warming, the Church of Covid, and the Church of Green state religions.

Why would you invite losers like this into your home? He will see the watering pond out back and claim it's 'natural wetland' and get the government to take the use of your land, to protect a bird that isn't even living on your property. He will claim that the pesticides you are using are 'dangerous' and should be banned, leaving you with no way to control insects destroying your crop. He will ban gasoline diesel engines, leaving you with no trucks, no tractors, no combine, no anything, since none of it can do it's job properly on batteries.


Simple answer? Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
Right out of the Art of War. Don't cast your pearls before swine. That's from the Bible. BTW, the Art of War has an excellent treatise on the use of spies and the cost and tactics concerning exposing your position to the enemy. You should read that book. Much of what he wrote is still valid today, despite the time when it was written, in the days of warfare on foot and horseback.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 20-11-2020 23:18
21-11-2020 00:21
James___
★★★★★
(3429)
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
James___ wrote:
Had relatives who grew corn in Ohio. If it wasn't time for planting or harvesting, the amount of work to do was limited. And we visited their farm quite a bit. With some crops, everything is pretty much requires little manual labor because of machines.
And it's probably produce which uses seasonal workers. That limits once again how much work the farm owners do.


Many grain farmers also have livestock. I'd call that manual labor. But go ahead and tell one of my farming friends that he doesn't do much work. You'll have a whole new set of medical issues.



And now you're threatening me. Did I tell you that my grandmother's neighbor had a bunch of livestock? They had a dairy farm. Yep, cattle grazing is definitely a lot of work.
The cows actually knew to come in so they could be milked.
Ever taste milk straight from the cow? When milk is pasteurized, it tastes different. An acquired taste is necessary to be able to drink it.


No threat, just saying a farmer won't take kindly to you telling him he doesn't work much.

Ever taste milk straight from a goat? Grandpa always raised goats. Grew up on goat burgers and goat milk. Haven't had either in 30 years, probably now it would taste like shit.


From what you say, all they do is work. That's not true.
gasguzzler and from, what neither of you get is that Iowa corn and soy bean farmers might not want you guys threatening me and saying their also cattle ranchers.
What you guys need to do is show where grain farmers are also cattle ranchers. You made the claim and while making a baseless claim you are also saying that I should feel threatened.
Edited on 21-11-2020 00:56
21-11-2020 00:23
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
Into the Night wrote:
Coal is still being mined, ...




Yep....

Few other things are happening too.

The country is fine, they aren't as confused as Trump about the future economy ( or the present economy ).

The Carrier AC situation is a perfect example.

The CEO was very candid that the workers were still going to be replaced by robots.
21-11-2020 02:33
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2702)
Automation, is a Utopian pipe dream. A machine can be built and trained to perform some very specific, repetitive tasks. And do it very well. But if there is an issue, it's not going to catch and correct for it. It'll keep following the program, until the problem is discovered. Quite possibly, after a lot of quality issues produced. I worked in injection molding for a few years. The machines work pretty well, but need a babysitter, to inspect parts, and occasionally make a few subtle adjustments, apply some mold release. Know when to call maintenance, when something starts to fail, or isn't quite right. Pretty easy work, most of the time, but some serious issue to come up. People will always be superior to machines, since we can be trained to do multiple tasks, and not have to be shut down to be re-tooled, between tasks. At my current warehouse job, I can easily step in, and do a dozen or more different jobs there, just need to be told were to go. Nothing is that difficult to learn either, stuff I hadn't done, will be similar enough, I can pick it up pretty quick.
21-11-2020 03:14
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3488)
HarveyH55 wrote:...People will always be superior to machines....
I think as we progress you go from a 10 person crew to 1 or 2 people using machines. It's a good thing. It's progress.

You really need to have leadership that understands how things are changing though.



Some moron, like Trump, could look at the above and preach to the people that we gotta save those steel jobs! You just need to hope people like that aren't elected.
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