Why I'm Skeptical

Climate-Debate.com > Discussion Forum > Climate debate in general > Why I'm Skeptical > Page 3

Page 3 of 3

11-01-2025 06:19
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	500 meters width, 600 meters length, 20 meter depth... abra cadabra! SIX MILLION cubic meters of pure water to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95... Check your math, Mr. Chemistry Genius. According to MY calculations, this degree of dilution only get you to pH in the high fives, and LESS than pH = 6. I actually calculated the pH of your system to be pH = 5.9594 Perhaps this will be of some consolation. If your reservoir were just ten times bigger, at 60 million cubic meters, or 60,000 million LITERS, you could dilute those 6589 moles of hydrogen ion in your 150 gallons of HCl to a pH into the high sixes. In fact, 60 million cubic meters of water can dilute your acid to a pH of.. TA DA! pH = 6.9594 At this point you OVERSHOT the target pH of 6.95. Could have gotten away with a little LESS than 60 million cubic meters to dilute to the promised pH. It's a straightforward calculation to get moles H+ per liter by dividing a given number of moles H+ into a given number of liters. The pH is the negative logarithm of that number. Show me your math and I'll show you mine I showed a very similar calculation in the post I'll repost behind this one, so you can see how it is calculated in general. HOW ON EARTH DID YOU COME UP WITH pH = 6.95? Assuming it was somehow shielded from contact with the atmosphere. Did you know that natural rainfall pH is about 5.6 from the carbonic acid in it? VERY HIGHLY BUFFERED STUFF, that pure water! IBdaMann wrote: Im a BM wrote: Then show me how much the million cubic meters of sea water pH changes. Of course it won't be 6.95, given that it is starting around pH 8.3. Correct. The rapid dilution to pH 6.95 has to be in the pure water. Im a BM wrote: That should prove the dilution is buffering thing just as effectively. Nope. Let's stick with my scenario, i.e. 150 gallons of liquid HCL into a vast reservoir. The rate of dilution naturally depends on the circulation of the water in the reservoir, but if the reservoir is sufficiently large (greater than or equal in volume to 500M width, 600M length, 20M depth) then the 150 gallons of 11.6M liquid (cold) HCL will dilute to 6.95 pH. By the way, the pure water of pH 7.0 converting to a slightly acidic pH of 6.95 instead of something closer to 0.0, because of the quantity of the pure water, meets the definition of buffering. Im a BM wrote: Well, the (NOT a "chemical") bicarbonate in the baking soda gets PROTONATED Here you are guilty of silly wording. You should have written "Well, the chemical "sodium bicarbonate" in the baking soda gets PROTONATED ..." Im a BM wrote: Do you predict any fizzing when we dump the 150 gallons of acid into either the sea or the pure water reservoir? A lot would happen. I overcomplicated the scenario in my attempt to simplify it. I stipulated liquid HCL so that we wouldn't get bogged down with the details of working with a gas. However, HCL has to be very cold to be a liquid, and when you dump liquid HCL into either a reservoir or the ocean, it's going to revert back to being a gas, which will start bubbling ... which isn't itself "fizzing" but that comes with the standard dissociation of the HCL. The ocean water will do the same but will produce a bunch more CO2 and destroy the earth's global climate. Im a BM wrote:IBdaMann says that "You could dump 150 gallons of hydrochloric acid into the ocean and all the acid would be neutralized within 30 seconds because of dilution." Nope. That's not what I said. I specified that 150 gallons would be neutralized strictly from dilution in a reservoir of pure water, and that the ocean would accomplish the same diluting but will also provide added neutralization which will result in a reduced time to fully neutralize the HCL. Im a BM wrote: Thirty seconds to homogeneously blend 150 gallons of acid into a large enough volume of water to dilute it to the point of pH neutrality. Those be some HIGH SPEED hydrochloric acid molecules, zigzagging between the water molecules to get to a zone of lower acid concentration and homogenize it to neutral pH. I specified circulation of the water. If the water is mostly stationary, neutralization will obviously take longer.
11-01-2025 06:21
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	The post directly above this addresses the specific reservoir of pure water IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Bear that in mind as the underlying discussion shows how it would take THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water to dilute it that much. In fact, those SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS are only enough to dilute that acid to pH = 5.96 On the other hand, just 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer that 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid addition just as effectively as THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can by dilution. Because the pH buffering of the carbonate system is NOT dilution. Of course, you can't do the math without knowing what pH IS. pH = -log[H+] the negative logarithm of hydrogen ion, H+, in solution. I hope IBdaMann can agree to this definition of pH. It means that our concentrated hydrochloric acid has pH BELOW ZERO, about -1, in fact. I know that Into the Night is NOT on board for defining pH as -log[H+], for this very reason that it makes any solution with 1.0 or more moles H+ per liter have a pH equal to or less than zero. If IBdaMann does NOT agree with the definition of pH = -log[H+], he will have to show his alternative definition of pH for the equation he used to calculate that SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water will dilute that acid to pH = 6.95 MY version of the math says the pH should be 5.96. ALTERNATIVE FACTS The average liter of seawater has 2300 micromoles per liter of alkalinity. Conversely, the average liter of sea water has about 125 milligrams per liter CALCIUM CARBONATE EQUIVALENTS (ppm) alkalinity One million liters of seawater has 2300 moles or 125 kilograms calcium carbonate equivalents alkalinity. One million liters, or 1000 cubic meters of sea water has the capacity to neutralize 2300 moles of H+. 150 gallons, or 568 liters of 11.6 molar concentrated hydrochloric acid has 568 x 11.6 moles of H+. Which equals 6589 moles of H+ 2300 moles alkalinity per 1000 cubic meters, 6589 moles of H+ added. It would take 2982 cubic meters of sea water, rather than 1000, to completely consume all the hydrogen ions in 150 gallons concentrated hydrochloric acid. Those protons are taken out of solution by attachment to either carbonate ions or carbonate ions. This turns carbonate ions into bicarbonate ions, and it turns bicarbonate ions into carbonic acid. HCl + Na2CO3 = NaCl + NaHCO3 carbonate protonated to bicarbonate HCl + NaHCO3 = NaCl + H2CO3 bicarbonate protonated to carbonic acid H2CO3 = H2O + CO2 carbonic acid splitting into water and carbon dioxide 2982 cubic meters of sea water to get enough pH buffering to handle 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. You'll see a whole lot of fizzing as carbon dioxide gas bubbles out of it. But the pH will barely drop below 8.3. NOW, put that 6589 moles of hydrogen ion into 2982 cubic meters of PURE WATER. 2,982,000 liters of pure water to dilute 6589 moles of added H+. = 0.00221 moles per liter of ADDED H+ after dilution. 0.001 moles per liter H+ = ten to the minus 3 power = pH 3 More moles per liter H+ make pH LESS than 3. I could drag it out to the exact answer, but the trend is clear. The great buffering power of water itself through the magic of DILUTION enables 2982 cubic meters of pure water to "buffer" 150 gallons of added hydrochloric acid to pH < 3. A bit lower than 6.95. 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer those 150 gallons of acid COMPLETELY, to keep pH pretty close to 8.3 Damn, I don't want to get the exact pH for 0.0022 molar acid. Okay, dilution is perfectly linear, and pH is one unit per each power of ten. Make it about 3 MILLION cubic meters of pure water. 1000 times more dilute than when our 3000 cubic meters of water couldn't get the pH up to 3. Now we have the pH up to something less than 6. 30 million cubic meters of pure water dilutes your 150 gallons of acid to a pH approaching 7, but certainly not as high as 6.95. 3000 cubic meters of SEA WATER has a DIFFERENT mechanism for pH buffering. Now I'm curious if it matches up with the sea water has 2000 times as much pH buffering capacity as pure water axiom. I think I'm seeing 10,000 here. Then again, I fudged using 0.001 instead of 0.0022 for the H+ concentration to estimate pH = 3, when it is 2.2 times more acidic than that. So, it would take AT LEAST 2000 times as much volume of pure water to deal with 150 gallons of concentrated acid, compared to sea water, to minimize pH shift.
12-01-2025 04:12
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	This addresses the specific reservoir of pure water IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. Bear that in mind as the underlying discussion shows how it would take THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water to dilute it that much. In fact, those SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS are only enough to dilute that acid to pH = 5.96 On the other hand, just 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer that 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid addition just as effectively as THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can by dilution. Because the pH buffering of the carbonate system is NOT dilution. Of course, you can't do the math without knowing what pH IS. pH = -log[H+] the negative logarithm of hydrogen ion, H+, in solution. I hope IBdaMann can agree to this definition of pH. It means that our concentrated hydrochloric acid has pH BELOW ZERO, about -1, in fact. I know that Into the Night is NOT on board for defining pH as -log[H+], for this very reason that it makes any solution with 1.0 or more moles H+ per liter have a pH equal to or less than zero. If IBdaMann does NOT agree with the definition of pH = -log[H+], he will have to show his alternative definition of pH for the equation he used to calculate that SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water will dilute that acid to pH = 6.95 MY version of the math says the pH should be 5.96. ALTERNATIVE FACTS The average liter of seawater has 2300 micromoles per liter of alkalinity. Conversely, the average liter of sea water has about 125 milligrams per liter CALCIUM CARBONATE EQUIVALENTS (ppm) alkalinity One million liters of seawater has 2300 moles or 125 kilograms calcium carbonate equivalents alkalinity. One million liters, or 1000 cubic meters of sea water has the capacity to neutralize 2300 moles of H+. 150 gallons, or 568 liters of 11.6 molar concentrated hydrochloric acid has 568 x 11.6 moles of H+. Which equals 6589 moles of H+ 2300 moles alkalinity per 1000 cubic meters, 6589 moles of H+ added. It would take 2982 cubic meters of sea water, rather than 1000, to completely consume all the hydrogen ions in 150 gallons concentrated hydrochloric acid. Those protons are taken out of solution by attachment to either carbonate ions or carbonate ions. This turns carbonate ions into bicarbonate ions, and it turns bicarbonate ions into carbonic acid. HCl + Na2CO3 = NaCl + NaHCO3 carbonate protonated to bicarbonate HCl + NaHCO3 = NaCl + H2CO3 bicarbonate protonated to carbonic acid H2CO3 = H2O + CO2 carbonic acid splitting into water and carbon dioxide 2982 cubic meters of sea water to get enough pH buffering to handle 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. You'll see a whole lot of fizzing as carbon dioxide gas bubbles out of it. But the pH will barely drop below 8.3. NOW, put that 6589 moles of hydrogen ion into 2982 cubic meters of PURE WATER. 2,982,000 liters of pure water to dilute 6589 moles of added H+. = 0.00221 moles per liter of ADDED H+ after dilution. 0.001 moles per liter H+ = ten to the minus 3 power = pH 3 More moles per liter H+ make pH LESS than 3. I could drag it out to the exact answer, but the trend is clear. The great buffering power of water itself through the magic of DILUTION enables 2982 cubic meters of pure water to "buffer" 150 gallons of added hydrochloric acid to pH < 3. A bit lower than 6.95. 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer those 150 gallons of acid COMPLETELY, to keep pH pretty close to 8.3 Damn, I don't want to get the exact pH for 0.0022 molar acid. Okay, dilution is perfectly linear, and pH is one unit per each power of ten. Make it about 3 MILLION cubic meters of pure water. 1000 times more dilute than when our 3000 cubic meters of water couldn't get the pH up to 3. Now we have the pH up to something less than 6. 30 million cubic meters of pure water dilutes your 150 gallons of acid to a pH approaching 7, but certainly not as high as 6.95. 3000 cubic meters of SEA WATER has a DIFFERENT mechanism for pH buffering. Now I'm curious if it matches up with the sea water has 2000 times as much pH buffering capacity as pure water axiom. I think I'm seeing 10,000 here. Then again, I fudged using 0.001 instead of 0.0022 for the H+ concentration to estimate pH = 3, when it is 2.2 times more acidic than that. So, it would take AT LEAST 2000 times as much volume of pure water to deal with 150 gallons of concentrated acid, compared to sea water, to minimize pH shift.[/quote]
12-01-2025 19:28
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution.
12-01-2025 20:58
Swan★★★★★ (6865)	Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability IBdaMann claims that Gold is a molecule, and that the last ice age never happened because I was not there to see it. The only conclusion that can be drawn from this is that IBdaMann is clearly not using enough LSD. According to CDC/Government info, people who were vaccinated are now DYING at a higher rate than non-vaccinated people, which exposes the covid vaccines as the poison that they are, this is now fully confirmed by the terrorist CDC This place is quieter than the FBI commenting on the chink bank account information on Hunter Xiden's laptop I LOVE TRUMP BECAUSE HE PISSES OFF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT I CAN'T STAND. ULTRA MAGA "Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody, I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat." MOTHER THERESA OF CALCUTTA So why is helping to hide the murder of an American president patriotic? Sonia makes me so proud to be a dumb white boy Now be honest, was I correct or was I correct? LOL

12-01-2025 23:05
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering.
13-01-2025 01:10
Swan★★★★★ (6865)	Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering. I am hearing Lou Costello say.........I just don't care IBdaMann claims that Gold is a molecule, and that the last ice age never happened because I was not there to see it. The only conclusion that can be drawn from this is that IBdaMann is clearly not using enough LSD. According to CDC/Government info, people who were vaccinated are now DYING at a higher rate than non-vaccinated people, which exposes the covid vaccines as the poison that they are, this is now fully confirmed by the terrorist CDC This place is quieter than the FBI commenting on the chink bank account information on Hunter Xiden's laptop I LOVE TRUMP BECAUSE HE PISSES OFF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT I CAN'T STAND. ULTRA MAGA "Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody, I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat." MOTHER THERESA OF CALCUTTA So why is helping to hide the murder of an American president patriotic? Sonia makes me so proud to be a dumb white boy Now be honest, was I correct or was I correct? LOL
13-01-2025 01:52
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering. I am hearing Lou Costello say.........I just don't care You are correct. We should compare IBdaMann's 150 gallons of concentrated acid, which requires something like 30 BILLION liters of water to dilute it to pH 6.95.. How many gallons of acid come out of an old mine, as sulfuric acid produced by pyrite oxidation? Iron Mountain, near Mt. Shasta, Marxifornia, is one of my favorites cause it has pH so far below zero in the acid mine discharge. So, how much acid does that mine discharge EVERY DAY? About 100,000 - 200,000 MOLES H+ per day discharged from just one mine. Not just your average mine, I'll admit. those 150 gallons of IBdaMann's acid only had 6589 mole H+ to dilute. How much water does it take to dilute the Iron Mountain acid mine drainage, if we depend on the dilution is buffering approach, and we want our river to stay at pH 6.95? At least 600 million cubic meters, if my math is correct. Every day, they have to find another 600 million cubic meters of pure water to dilute the mine's acid drainage to pH 6.95 Fortunately, they can direct that mine drainage into a constructed wetland. There, under low oxygen conditions, sulfate reducing bacteria generate alkalinity to neutralize the acidity in the acid mine discharge. The groundwater discharge from that constructed wetland will have pH 6.95, or maybe even higher.
13-01-2025 20:49
Swan★★★★★ (6865)	Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering. I am hearing Lou Costello say.........I just don't care You are correct. We should compare IBdaMann's 150 gallons of concentrated acid, which requires something like 30 BILLION liters of water to dilute it to pH 6.95.. How many gallons of acid come out of an old mine, as sulfuric acid produced by pyrite oxidation? Iron Mountain, near Mt. Shasta, Marxifornia, is one of my favorites cause it has pH so far below zero in the acid mine discharge. So, how much acid does that mine discharge EVERY DAY? About 100,000 - 200,000 MOLES H+ per day discharged from just one mine. Not just your average mine, I'll admit. those 150 gallons of IBdaMann's acid only had 6589 mole H+ to dilute. How much water does it take to dilute the Iron Mountain acid mine drainage, if we depend on the dilution is buffering approach, and we want our river to stay at pH 6.95? At least 600 million cubic meters, if my math is correct. Every day, they have to find another 600 million cubic meters of pure water to dilute the mine's acid drainage to pH 6.95 Fortunately, they can direct that mine drainage into a constructed wetland. There, under low oxygen conditions, sulfate reducing bacteria generate alkalinity to neutralize the acidity in the acid mine discharge. The groundwater discharge from that constructed wetland will have pH 6.95, or maybe even higher. If you wrote that to me, then you failed, because I did not read it. But by all means feel free to continue failing and flailing. And ponder who knew what about Oswald, and when did they know it. IBdaMann claims that Gold is a molecule, and that the last ice age never happened because I was not there to see it. The only conclusion that can be drawn from this is that IBdaMann is clearly not using enough LSD. According to CDC/Government info, people who were vaccinated are now DYING at a higher rate than non-vaccinated people, which exposes the covid vaccines as the poison that they are, this is now fully confirmed by the terrorist CDC This place is quieter than the FBI commenting on the chink bank account information on Hunter Xiden's laptop I LOVE TRUMP BECAUSE HE PISSES OFF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT I CAN'T STAND. ULTRA MAGA "Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody, I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat." MOTHER THERESA OF CALCUTTA So why is helping to hide the murder of an American president patriotic? Sonia makes me so proud to be a dumb white boy Now be honest, was I correct or was I correct? LOL
13-01-2025 21:19
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Swan wrote: Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution. Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering. I am hearing Lou Costello say.........I just don't care You are correct. We should compare IBdaMann's 150 gallons of concentrated acid, which requires something like 30 BILLION liters of water to dilute it to pH 6.95.. How many gallons of acid come out of an old mine, as sulfuric acid produced by pyrite oxidation? Iron Mountain, near Mt. Shasta, Marxifornia, is one of my favorites cause it has pH so far below zero in the acid mine discharge. So, how much acid does that mine discharge EVERY DAY? About 100,000 - 200,000 MOLES H+ per day discharged from just one mine. Not just your average mine, I'll admit. those 150 gallons of IBdaMann's acid only had 6589 mole H+ to dilute. How much water does it take to dilute the Iron Mountain acid mine drainage, if we depend on the dilution is buffering approach, and we want our river to stay at pH 6.95? At least 600 million cubic meters, if my math is correct. Every day, they have to find another 600 million cubic meters of pure water to dilute the mine's acid drainage to pH 6.95 Fortunately, they can direct that mine drainage into a constructed wetland. There, under low oxygen conditions, sulfate reducing bacteria generate alkalinity to neutralize the acidity in the acid mine discharge. The groundwater discharge from that constructed wetland will have pH 6.95, or maybe even higher. If you wrote that to me, then you failed, because I did not read it. But by all means feel free to continue failing and flailing. And ponder who knew what about Oswald, and when did they know it. Oh, Swan, this just breaks my heart. As you are well aware, it is YOU who I have been writing to... YOU are the "target audience" for my unrequited love. I really thought you were the one. You fit my ideal "target audience" soulmate profile so perfectly. You have college level education and literacy in science. You open up this website because you are genuinely concerned about climate change and take the issue seriously. You already understand the basics that are already out there in the news all the time about how human activity has increased the concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, how temperatures have been rising, how it is becoming more and more clear that extreme weather events are a consequence. You want to apply your knowledge of science to take the discussion to the next level. You want to discuss the latest research publications and the implications of the newest information being acquired. You aren't just some kind of scientifically illiterate troll. And you won't even read my love letters anymore. I have lost my target audience and I must now try to find some reason, ANY reason, to go on living.
18-01-2025 01:51
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	This addresses the specific reservoir of pure water IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Bear that in mind as the underlying discussion shows how it would take THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water to dilute it that much. In fact, those SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS are only enough to dilute that acid to pH = 5.96 On the other hand, just 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer that 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid addition just as effectively as THIRTY MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can by dilution. Because the pH buffering of the carbonate system is NOT dilution. Of course, you can't do the math without knowing what pH IS. pH = -log[H+] the negative logarithm of hydrogen ion, H+, in solution. I hope IBdaMann can agree to this definition of pH. It means that our concentrated hydrochloric acid has pH BELOW ZERO, about -1, in fact. I know that Into the Night is NOT on board for defining pH as -log[H+], for this very reason that it makes any solution with 1.0 or more moles H+ per liter have a pH equal to or less than zero. If IBdaMann does NOT agree with the definition of pH = -log[H+], he will have to show his alternative definition of pH for the equation he used to calculate that SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water will dilute that acid to pH = 6.95 MY version of the math says the pH should be 5.96. ALTERNATIVE FACTS The average liter of seawater has 2300 micromoles per liter of alkalinity. Conversely, the average liter of sea water has about 125 milligrams per liter CALCIUM CARBONATE EQUIVALENTS (ppm) alkalinity One million liters of seawater has 2300 moles or 125 kilograms calcium carbonate equivalents alkalinity. One million liters, or 1000 cubic meters of sea water has the capacity to neutralize 2300 moles of H+. 150 gallons, or 568 liters of 11.6 molar concentrated hydrochloric acid has 568 x 11.6 moles of H+. Which equals 6589 moles of H+ 2300 moles alkalinity per 1000 cubic meters, 6589 moles of H+ added. It would take 2982 cubic meters of sea water, rather than 1000, to completely consume all the hydrogen ions in 150 gallons concentrated hydrochloric acid. Those protons are taken out of solution by attachment to either carbonate ions or carbonate ions. This turns carbonate ions into bicarbonate ions, and it turns bicarbonate ions into carbonic acid. HCl + Na2CO3 = NaCl + NaHCO3 carbonate protonated to bicarbonate HCl + NaHCO3 = NaCl + H2CO3 bicarbonate protonated to carbonic acid H2CO3 = H2O + CO2 carbonic acid splitting into water and carbon dioxide 2982 cubic meters of sea water to get enough pH buffering to handle 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. You'll see a whole lot of fizzing as carbon dioxide gas bubbles out of it. But the pH will barely drop below 8.3. NOW, put that 6589 moles of hydrogen ion into 2982 cubic meters of PURE WATER. 2,982,000 liters of pure water to dilute 6589 moles of added H+. = 0.00221 moles per liter of ADDED H+ after dilution. 0.001 moles per liter H+ = ten to the minus 3 power = pH 3 More moles per liter H+ make pH LESS than 3. I could drag it out to the exact answer, but the trend is clear. The great buffering power of water itself through the magic of DILUTION enables 2982 cubic meters of pure water to "buffer" 150 gallons of added hydrochloric acid to pH < 3. A bit lower than 6.95. 2982 cubic meters of SEA WATER can buffer those 150 gallons of acid COMPLETELY, to keep pH pretty close to 8.3 Damn, I don't want to get the exact pH for 0.0022 molar acid. Okay, dilution is perfectly linear, and pH is one unit per each power of ten. Make it about 3 MILLION cubic meters of pure water. 1000 times more dilute than when our 3000 cubic meters of water couldn't get the pH up to 3. Now we have the pH up to something less than 6. 30 million cubic meters of pure water dilutes your 150 gallons of acid to a pH approaching 7, but certainly not as high as 6.95. 3000 cubic meters of SEA WATER has a DIFFERENT mechanism for pH buffering. Now I'm curious if it matches up with the sea water has 2000 times as much pH buffering capacity as pure water axiom. I think I'm seeing 10,000 here. Then again, I fudged using 0.001 instead of 0.0022 for the H+ concentration to estimate pH = 3, when it is 2.2 times more acidic than that. So, it would take AT LEAST 2000 times as much volume of pure water to deal with 150 gallons of concentrated acid, compared to sea water, to minimize pH shift.
18-01-2025 01:52
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution.
18-01-2025 01:55
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 The next round of discussion will be to calculate the impact of one drop of acid containing 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid on ONE LITER of SEA WATER. Having shown that a drop of such acid brings a liter of pure water down from (neutral) pH 7 to (acidic) pH 5.96 This addresses the specific reservoir of PURE WATER IBdaMann describes, 500 meters by 600 meters and 20 meters deep. IBdaMann says that these SIX MILLION CUBIC METERS of pure water can dilute 150 gallons of concentrated (11.6 Molar) hydrochloric acid to pH = 6.95 Six million cubic meters, as per IBdaMann's prescribed reservoir size, is sixty thousand million liters, or sixty "billion" liters, as Americans like to call them. So, let's shrink the whole thing down to a one liter microcosm. One liter is 1/6,000,000,000 the volume of our vast pure water reservoir. So, we will add 1/600,000,000 of 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid. 150 gallons is 568 LITERS of concentrated hydrochloric acid. At 11.6 moles of acid per liter, 568 liters of concentrated hydrochloric acid contains 6589 MOLES of hydrochloric acid going into six billion liters of reservoir. 6589 Moles of HYDROGEN ION divided by six billion to go into 1 liter of water. 6589/6,000,000,000 = 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric acid Add exactly 0.00000109 moles of hydrochloric in a drop to one liter of pure water. This is a 0.00000109 Molar solution of strong acid. The LOGARITHM of this [H+] = log0.00000109 = -5.96257 The NEGATIVE logarithm of this [H+] = pH = 5.96257 The same pH achieved when six billion times as much of the acid is diluted into six billion times as much pure water. pH = 5.96257 More than an order of magnitude more acidic than pH 7.0 IBdaMann understands math and chemistry much better than I do, so I'm sure that I'm gonna get schooled for calculating it all wrong. He'll show why the pH comes out to 6.95, because he deliberately chose the dimensions of the reservoir to ensure this. And then he will show what a moron I am when we have fun with math and science and get back to SEA WATER and actual pH BUFFERING, not dilution.[/q Thank you, Swan for this insight. And thank IBdaMann for providing the idea of a six billion liter reservoir for 150 gallons of concentrated hydrochloric acid for a guaranteed pH of 6.95 By showing this actually would turn the massive volume of unbuffered water ACIDIC to the tune of pH 5.96, it is an excellent demonstration that water itself is NOT a buffer. NOPE. Dilution is NOT buffering. You are correct. We should compare IBdaMann's 150 gallons of concentrated acid, which requires something like 30 BILLION liters of water to dilute it to pH 6.95.. How many gallons of acid come out of an old mine, as sulfuric acid produced by pyrite oxidation? Iron Mountain, near Mt. Shasta, Marxifornia, is one of my favorites cause it has pH so far below zero in the acid mine discharge. So, how much acid does that mine discharge EVERY DAY? About 100,000 - 200,000 MOLES H+ per day discharged from just one mine. Not just your average mine, I'll admit. those 150 gallons of IBdaMann's acid only had 6589 mole H+ to dilute. How much water does it take to dilute the Iron Mountain acid mine drainage, if we depend on the dilution is buffering approach, and we want our river to stay at pH 6.95? At least 600 million cubic meters, if my math is correct. Every day, they have to find another 600 million cubic meters of pure water to dilute the mine's acid drainage to pH 6.95 Fortunately, they can direct that mine drainage into a constructed wetland. There, under low oxygen conditions, sulfate reducing bacteria generate alkalinity to neutralize the acidity in the acid mine discharge. The groundwater discharge from that constructed wetland will have pH 6.95, or maybe even higher. Oh, Swan, this just breaks my heart. As you are well aware, it is YOU who I have been writing to... YOU are the "target audience" for my unrequited love. I really thought you were the one. You fit my ideal "target audience" soulmate profile so perfectly. You have college level education and literacy in science. You open up this website because you are genuinely concerned about climate change and take the issue seriously. You already understand the basics that are already out there in the news all the time about how human activity has increased the concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, how temperatures have been rising, how it is becoming more and more clear that extreme weather events are a consequence. You want to apply your knowledge of science to take the discussion to the next level. You want to discuss the latest research publications and the implications of the newest information being acquired. You aren't just some kind of scientifically illiterate troll. And you won't even read my love letters anymore. I have lost my target audience and I must now try to find some reason, ANY reason, to go on living.
18-01-2025 09:10
Into the Night★★★★★ (23078)	Im a BM wrote: Of much greater relevance to the discussion of environmental science than calculating how gargantuan in size a reservoir of pure water would be to dilute 150 gallons of concentrated acid to pH 6.95 ...deleted spam... Stop spamming and making shit up. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
20-01-2025 18:40
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	It looks like IBdaMann is STUMPED! Ten days after he proposed a 500 meter by 600 meter and 20 meters deep reservoir of pure water to "buffer" (actually DILUTE) 150 gallons of 11.6 Molar hydrochloric acid to a guaranteed pH of 6.95 He was shown the MATH that proves this volume of water is only enough to dilute it to pH 5.96 I may be the only one who even notices he's been AWOL. COME BACK, IBdaMANN! Somebody needs to identify the scientifically illiterate morons! All the IBdaMann fans, so MANY of them after more than nine years of trolling, have nobody to come to with their questions about the hard stuff. We still have Into the Night to enlighten with "RQAA" for their science questions that can't be answered just by asserting that something is NOT something else. After so many thousands of posts over so many years, how can it be that IBdaMann goes away for ten days and nobody even notices he's gone? Maybe he is with GasGuzzler and gfm7175 and HarveyH55 and all the other scientific genius trolls that made climate-debate.com the internet's BEST discussion site. And they didn't even invite Into the Night to their party at some OTHER website. I hope I'm right that IBdaMann is not dead or injured or otherwise unable to post due to bad news. I hope he found a better home where he is getting the respect he deserves. Swan wrote: IBdaMann wrote: Im a BM wrote:"I think I speak for everyone..." - IBdaMann Clue in on the words "I think." You'll become more proficient at that as you get better at English. Pro Tip: Amphibious = Amphibian, amphibious animals are amphibians. Don't ever forget it. Im a BM wrote: And MYSELF, I think I speak for EVERY PhD scientist on the "Board" at the "single best discussion site on the Internet" You only speak for yourself. You did kind of kill it with your spamming. It's how you advertize that you are a Marxist. [quote]Im a BM wrote: What is a "magical" acid, and how does it cause a more pronounced impact on sea water than pure water? An actual chemist would have no problem understanding the exponential nature of acidity and basicity, and how sea water will have a much more pronounced effect on any acid than pure water will. Im a BM wrote: What makes water itself such an excellent pH buffer? Dilution. Check the definition of "buffering." You could dump 150 gallons of hydrochloric acid into the ocean and all of the acid will be neutralized within 30 seconds because of dilution. You could dump 150 gallons of hydrochloric acid into a vast reservoir of pure water and all 150 gallons of the hydrochloric acid would dilute to pH 6.95 in less than one minute, with no other form of neutralization. Do you need to review the definition of buffering? Im a BM wrote:How do those phantom inertial gases prove that "greenhouse gases" are BUNK? Greenhouse effect itself is bunk; hence there is no such thing as greenhouse gas. Im a BM wrote: THIS IS "THE SINGLE BEST DISCUSSION SITE ON THE INTERNET"!!! You can thank gfm7175 for his vigilant quality control efforts, GasGuzzler for his culinary configuration management, and for Ralph's research into methane reservoirs. Amphibian is a noun, amphibious is an adjective. Not everything that has amphibious traits is an amphibian. Aee attached photo for and amphibious craft that is not an amphibian except inside of your jello brain Linguistic skills verified 130

30-01-2025 00:30
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Only a scientifically illiterate moron would post this: "However, HCL has to be very cold to be liquid, and when you dump liquid HCL into either a reservoir or the ocean, it's going to revert back to being a gas, which will start bubbling ... which isn't itself 'fizzing' but that comes with the standard dissociation of HCl." - IBdaMann The claim that hydrochloric acid becomes a gas unless it is very cold is ABSURD. There is NO BUBBLING of any kind from having the acid "revert back to being a gas" if you add ACID to WATER. Now add a very small amount of water to concentrated hydrochloric acid, and you will get some very brief but vigorous bubbling, not because any acid "reverts" to being a gas, but because the heat released by the reaction causes the water added to boil. The chemical reaction is when a hydrogen ion, just a proton without an electron, bonds to a water molecule to form hydronium ion H3O+. H+ + H2O = H3O+ plus HEAT OF HYDRATION in exothermic reaction. Of course, if you want to yank that proton off the hydronium ion, to "dissociate" into a separate hydrogen ion and water molecule, you would have to add energy for this ENDOTHERMIC reaction. H3O+ plus energy = H+ + H2O Hydrochloric acid doesn't have to be cold to be liquid. It boils at a higher temperature than water. Indeed, many laboratory digestion procedures involve use of hydrochloric acid at temperatures above water boiling point, and HCl has a MUCH HIGHER boiling point than pure water. Hydrochloric acid raises the boiling point of any water it is added to. There is no need to keep hydrochloric acid on ice to prevent it from "reverting" to being a gas. IBdaMann just doesn't get this chemistry stuff and should stop making a fool of himself pretending that he does. IBdaMann wrote: Im a BM wrote: Then show me how much the million cubic meters of sea water pH changes. Of course it won't be 6.95, given that it is starting around pH 8.3. Correct. The rapid dilution to pH 6.95 has to be in the pure water. Im a BM wrote: That should prove the dilution is buffering thing just as effectively. Nope. Let's stick with my scenario, i.e. 150 gallons of liquid HCL into a vast reservoir. The rate of dilution naturally depends on the circulation of the water in the reservoir, but if the reservoir is sufficiently large (greater than or equal in volume to 500M width, 600M length, 20M depth) then the 150 gallons of 11.6M liquid (cold) HCL will dilute to 6.95 pH. By the way, the pure water of pH 7.0 converting to a slightly acidic pH of 6.95 instead of something closer to 0.0, because of the quantity of the pure water, meets the definition of buffering. Im a BM wrote: Well, the (NOT a "chemical") bicarbonate in the baking soda gets PROTONATED Here you are guilty of silly wording. You should have written "Well, the chemical "sodium bicarbonate" in the baking soda gets PROTONATED ..." Im a BM wrote: Do you predict any fizzing when we dump the 150 gallons of acid into either the sea or the pure water reservoir? A lot would happen. I overcomplicated the scenario in my attempt to simplify it. I stipulated liquid HCL so that we wouldn't get bogged down with the details of working with a gas. However, HCL has to be very cold to be a liquid, and when you dump liquid HCL into either a reservoir or the ocean, it's going to revert back to being a gas, which will start bubbling ... which isn't itself "fizzing" but that comes with the standard dissociation of the HCL. The ocean water will do the same but will produce a bunch more CO2 and destroy the earth's global climate. Im a BM wrote:IBdaMann says that "You could dump 150 gallons of hydrochloric acid into the ocean and all the acid would be neutralized within 30 seconds because of dilution." Nope. That's not what I said. I specified that 150 gallons would be neutralized strictly from dilution in a reservoir of pure water, and that the ocean would accomplish the same diluting but will also provide added neutralization which will result in a reduced time to fully neutralize the HCL. Im a BM wrote: Thirty seconds to homogeneously blend 150 gallons of acid into a large enough volume of water to dilute it to the point of pH neutrality. Those be some HIGH SPEED hydrochloric acid molecules, zigzagging between the water molecules to get to a zone of lower acid concentration and homogenize it to neutral pH. I specified circulation of the water. If the water is mostly stationary, neutralization will obviously take longer. Edited on 30-01-2025 01:21
30-01-2025 03:27
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2339)	Swan wrote: Whomever took the time to type that has demonstrated clear mental instability I am hearing Lou Costello say.........I just don't care If you wrote that to me, then you failed, because I did not read it. But by all means feel free to continue failing and flailing. And ponder who knew what about Oswald, and when did they know it. Oh, Swan, this just breaks my heart. I believe that I speak for both @sealover and myself when I bare my soul to you and tell you how deeply this hurts so much more than just our pride. As you are well aware, it is YOU we have been writing to... YOU are the "target audience" for our unrequited love. We really thought you were the one. You fit our ideal "target audience" soulmate profile so perfectly. You have college level education and impressively competent literacy in science. You selected this website as a place to join and post your contributions because you are genuinely concerned about climate change and take the issue seriously. You already understand the basics that are already out there in the news all the time about how human activity has increased the concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, how temperatures have been rising, how it is becoming more and more clear that extreme weather events are a consequence. You want to apply your knowledge of science to take the discussion to the next level. You want to discuss the latest research publications and the implications of the newest information being acquired. You aren't just some kind of scientifically illiterate troll. And now you won't even read our love letters. We have lost our target audience and we must now try to find some reason, ANY reason, to go on living.
30-01-2025 05:33
Into the Night★★★★★ (23078)	Im a BM wrote: You have college level education and impressively competent literacy in science. No, he doesn't. Im a BM wrote: You selected this website as a place to join and post your contributions because you are genuinely concerned about climate change and take the issue seriously. Climate cannot change. Im a BM wrote: You already understand the basics that are already out there in the news all the time about how human activity has increased the concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, how temperatures have been rising, how it is becoming more and more clear that extreme weather events are a consequence. No gas or vapor can create energy out of nothing. You are ignoring the 1st law of thermodynamics again. Im a BM wrote: You want to apply your knowledge of science to take the discussion to the next level. You want to discuss the latest research publications and the implications of the newest information being acquired. You aren't just some kind of scientifically illiterate troll. Yes he is, just like you. Im a BM wrote: And now you won't even read our love letters. We have lost our target audience and we must now try to find some reason, ANY reason, to go on living. Planning on suicide, Robert? The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan

Page 3 of 3

Join the debate Why I'm Skeptical:

Threads	Replies	Last post
22 Reasons to be Skeptical of Man-Made Global Warming	49	27-04-2024 04:05
22 Reasons to be Skeptical of Man-Made Global Warming	216	29-01-2020 05:52
21 Reasons To Be Skeptical of Man-Made Climate Change	7	20-09-2019 21:46
This is one of the reasons why I am skeptical of human-induced global warming	56	08-10-2018 19:56
20 Reasons To Be Skeptical Of Human-Induced Global Warming	69	27-09-2018 20:50