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What are the key challenges in lowering CO2 emissions?


What are the key challenges in lowering CO2 emissions?02-01-2020 01:12
stevew87
☆☆☆☆☆
(2)
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?
02-01-2020 02:27
Harry CProfile picture★☆☆☆☆
(143)
There's an overwhelming force that says CO2 'no es un problema'. Why do we want to shift the balance of power in the world which could be potentially more concentrated and corrupt, pay more money for energy and upset our economy?
02-01-2020 02:38
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1814)
Why do you use the word "pollution" when referring to a life essential gas?
02-01-2020 03:24
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7480)
GasGuzzler wrote: Why do you use the word "pollution" when referring to a life essential gas?

Great question.

Isn't CO2 generating THERMAL POLLUTION that gets TRAPPED in our atmosphere, causing RADIATIVE FEEDBACKS that cause Global Warming?

I thought that is why it is more important to eliminate CO2 from the planet (existential threat/ top poriority) than to merely feed plants (nice to have but only after we save the planet).


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
02-01-2020 06:22
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13323)
stevew87 wrote:
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?


Why do you feel you need to reduce CO2? Please explain how you are going to accomplish this.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
02-01-2020 09:39
MarcusRProfile picture★☆☆☆☆
(111)
Into the Night wrote:
stevew87 wrote:
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?


Why do you feel you need to reduce CO2? Please explain how you are going to accomplish this.


CO2 is so far the Main driver of global warming and the changes of climate. 1.95 W/m2 and counting:
yhttps://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2016GL071930

The road map is already clear
1. Change elevtricity generation to fossil free forms of generation. Manyncountries have alreadh done so. We have less than 1% fossil generation, and the decission is already made to convert the last planta from fossil to biofuels.
2. Electrification of transport. Not Just personal transport in cars, but public transports and the fleet of trucks.
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation and long haul shipping. One plannedninvestement nearby us using Forest residuals can alone take care of all domestic flights. And that is just from ONE Pulp Mill.
4. Fossil free Steel production such as yhttp://www.hybritdevelopment.com/ or similar projects
5. Electrification of mining: yhttps://www.nyteknik.se/fordon/boliden-elektrifierar-gruvtruckar-med-kontaktledningar-6900762 in Swedish but you get the point.
6. Stopping CO2 emissions from cement manufacturing: yhttps://www.cementa.se/sv/nollvision2030
7. Continue to develop the reactors types selected within gen IV fission reactors: yhttps://www.gen-4.org/gif/jcms/c_9260/Public whether or not they will be able to compete with renewables is Another issue.

Thus is what already is happening thanks to development of technology.

On a personal level, get COO's for renewables for your Home. Next time you change your heating system, get a modern efficient system (geo, air-air), install solar panels on your roof, next time you change your far go electric - or even better start using public transports if possible, reduce relying as long as aviation won't use more biofuels and so in and so forth.


That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us. Except for the few with their hands in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry. They will have their left food HARD on the breaks trying to resist the change that is already happening.
02-01-2020 14:47
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7480)
MarcusR wrote: CO2 is so far the Main driver of global warming and the changes of climate. 1.95 W/m2 and counting:

Preach it brother! Gimme that ol' time religion! Unleash the dogma to chase the karma! Pray, brother, pray!

MarcusR wrote: On a personal level, get COO's for renewables for your Home. Next time you change your heating system, get a modern efficient system (geo, air-air), install solar panels on your roof, next time you change your far go electric - or even better start using public transports if possible, reduce relying as long as aviation won't use more biofuels and so in and so forth. That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us.

What does any of this have to do with Climate?

MarcusR wrote: Except for the few with their hands in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry.

I bet you're talking about those capitalists, right? Those FEW capitalists. Man, why do we even put up with them?

MarcusR wrote: They will have their left food HARD on the breaks trying to resist the change that is already happening.

Oh yeah, of course, the change that is already happening. By the way, is that the Climate change that is already happening or are you talking about the FEW capitalists with their left food HARD on the breaks?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
02-01-2020 16:21
James___
★★★★★
(3185)
MarcusR wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
stevew87 wrote:
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?


Why do you feel you need to reduce CO2? Please explain how you are going to accomplish this.


CO2 is so far the Main driver of global warming and the changes of climate. 1.95 W/m2 and counting:
yhttps://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2016GL071930

The road map is already clear
1. Change elevtricity generation to fossil free forms of generation. Manyncountries have alreadh done so. We have less than 1% fossil generation, and the decission is already made to convert the last planta from fossil to biofuels.
2. Electrification of transport. Not Just personal transport in cars, but public transports and the fleet of trucks.
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation and long haul shipping. One plannedninvestement nearby us using Forest residuals can alone take care of all domestic flights. And that is just from ONE Pulp Mill.
4. Fossil free Steel production such as yhttp://www.hybritdevelopment.com/ or similar projects
5. Electrification of mining: yhttps://www.nyteknik.se/fordon/boliden-elektrifierar-gruvtruckar-med-kontaktledningar-6900762 in Swedish but you get the point.
6. Stopping CO2 emissions from cement manufacturing: yhttps://www.cementa.se/sv/nollvision2030
7. Continue to develop the reactors types selected within gen IV fission reactors: yhttps://www.gen-4.org/gif/jcms/c_9260/Public whether or not they will be able to compete with renewables is Another issue.

Thus is what already is happening thanks to development of technology.

On a personal level, get COO's for renewables for your Home. Next time you change your heating system, get a modern efficient system (geo, air-air), install solar panels on your roof, next time you change your far go electric - or even better start using public transports if possible, reduce relying as long as aviation won't use more biofuels and so in and so forth.


That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us. Except for the few with their hands in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry. They will have their left food HARD on the breaks trying to resist the change that is already happening.



CO2 could be playing a role in warming the lower troposphere but science suggests it's actually decreased O2. And when trying to search online for O2 levels, they say around 21%. CO2 levels are around 0%. 0.04 is close to 0, right?
Yet with oxygen levels, what is about 21%? O2 actually removes heat from the troposphere, O3 from the tropopause and CO2 from the mesopause.

This is how biased science has become But oxygen is many hundreds of times more abundant in the atmosphere, and the flipside of this transaction is a drop in O2 levels from about 209,580 to 209,460 ppm. That's a loss of just 0.06 percent, a negligible amount for the planet and its O2-breathing creatures, Homo sapiens included.
https://www.inverse.com/article/21419-atmospheric-oxygen-levels-falling

And scientists are not supposed to say it doesn't matter because of quantity.
0.06% is more than 0.04%. And O2 removes heat through convection. It rises into the upper troposphere where it radiates heat into the tropopause.
But as scientists say, as long as we have enough to breathe, who cares?
02-01-2020 16:59
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7480)
James___ wrote: CO2 could be playing a role in warming the lower troposphere but science suggests it's actually decreased O2.

When has science ever "suggested" something?

James___ wrote: This is how biased science has become

I'm guessing that you don't really know what science is, otherwise you wouldn't be claiming that there is "bias" in science or that it "suggests" things. Science does not "hint" and contains no subjectivity.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
02-01-2020 19:07
James___
★★★★★
(3185)
IBdaMann wrote:
James___ wrote: CO2 could be playing a role in warming the lower troposphere but science suggests it's actually decreased O2.

When has science ever "suggested" something?

James___ wrote: This is how biased science has become

I'm guessing that you don't really know what science is, otherwise you wouldn't be claiming that there is "bias" in science or that it "suggests" things. Science does not "hint" and contains no subjectivity.

.



And I bet you don't have a girlfriend either, right? I mean if she wanted to stay home and watch a movie that would suggest nothing to you, right?
And yes, I moved the goal posts. I had to. Your kicks were easily blocked.
02-01-2020 19:26
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7480)
James___ wrote: And I bet you don't have a girlfriend either, right?

Absolutely correct! My wife put the kabosh on that.

James___ wrote: And yes, I moved the goal posts. I had to. Your kicks were easily blocked.

Much appreciated.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
02-01-2020 21:23
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13323)
MarcusR wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
stevew87 wrote:
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?


Why do you feel you need to reduce CO2? Please explain how you are going to accomplish this.


CO2 is so far the Main driver of global warming

No gas or vapor is capable of warming the Earth using IR emitted from Earth's surface. You cannot create energy out of nothing.
MarcusR wrote:
and the changes of climate.

Define 'climate change'. Buzzword fallacy.
MarcusR wrote:
1.95 W/m2 and counting:

Argument from randU fallacy. You quoting made up numbers.
MarcusR wrote:
yhttps://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2016GL071930

False authority fallacy. A source of random numbers is not data.
MarcusR wrote:
The road map is already clear
1. Change elevtricity generation to fossil free forms of generation.

Already there. Fossils are not used for fuel. Fossils don't burn.
MarcusR wrote:
Many countries have already done so.

Wasn't hard.
MarcusR wrote:
We have less than 1% fossil generation,

Zero, actually. Fossils don't burn.
MarcusR wrote:
and the decision is already made to convert the last plants from fossil to biofuels.

There are no plants to convert. Fossils don't burn. We don't use them for fuel.
MarcusR wrote:
2. Electrification of transport.

How will that electricity be provided? You can't create energy out of nothing.
MarcusR wrote:
Not Just personal transport in cars, but public transports and the fleet of trucks.

How will that electricity be provided? Coal plants? Oil burning plants? Methane burning plants?
MarcusR wrote:
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation

You obviously have no idea of the requirements of aviation fuel. You can't just change it on a whim.
MarcusR wrote:
and long haul shipping.

Such as trains, trucks, and ships? Why would they use expensive biofuel?
MarcusR wrote:
One planned investement nearby us using Forest residuals can alone take care of all domestic flights.

No, it can't. You don't understand the requirement of aviation fuel.
MarcusR wrote:
And that is just from ONE Pulp Mill.

Pulp mills burn their own fuel they get from the lignin they extract from the wood. There is no extra.
MarcusR wrote:
4. Fossil free Steel production such as yhttp://www.hybritdevelopment.com/ or similar projects

Already there. Fossils aren't used as a fuel.
MarcusR wrote:
5. Electrification of mining: yhttps://www.nyteknik.se/fordon/boliden-elektrifierar-gruvtruckar-med-kontaktledningar-6900762 in Swedish but you get the point.

Dangerous. Mines are explosive environments.
MarcusR wrote:
6. Stopping CO2 emissions from cement manufacturing: yhttps://www.cementa.se/sv/nollvision2030

So you don't like cement either. There is no need to stop CO2 or to prevent cement making.
MarcusR wrote:
7. Continue to develop the reactors types selected within gen IV fission reactors: yhttps://www.gen-4.org/gif/jcms/c_9260/Public whether or not they will be able to compete with renewables is Another issue.

Some folks don't like nukes. They are more expensive than other forms of energy as well.
MarcusR wrote:
Thus is what already is happening thanks to development of technology.

No. These are pipe dreams, most of them.
MarcusR wrote:
On a personal level, get COO's for renewables for your Home.

Unknown acronym. Did you know that both oil and methane are renewable fuels?
MarcusR wrote:
Next time you change your heating system, get a modern efficient system

Always a good idea.
MarcusR wrote:
(geo, air-air),

Not always available, not always efficient.
MarcusR wrote:
install solar panels on your roof,

Limited life span, expensive, and very difficult to maintain.
MarcusR wrote:
next time you change your car go electric -

Electric cars have severe disadvantages, namely the long refueling time. Also that energy has to come from somewhere. Coal plants?
MarcusR wrote:
or even better start using public transports if possible,

They gotta pay for their energy too. It isn't free. Most use diesel oil.
MarcusR wrote:
reduce relying as long as aviation

So you don't like aircraft. Guess you don't like flying anywhere or benefiting from the stuff they ship.
MarcusR wrote:
won't use more biofuels and so in and so forth.

You don't understand the requirements of aviation fuel. This stuff has to work at 40,000 ft and not degrade or phase separate. No biofuel can do that.
MarcusR wrote:
That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us.

Nope. You are naming quite a few pipe dreams.
MarcusR wrote:
Except for the few with their hands in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry.

There is no fossil fuel industry. Fossils don't burn.
MarcusR wrote:
They will have their left food HARD on the breaks trying to resist the change that is already happening.


YOU don't get to dictate energy markets.
YOU don't get to dictate aviation markets.
YOU don't get to dictate transportation markets.

You are not the king.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
02-01-2020 21:28
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13323)
James___ wrote:
MarcusR wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
stevew87 wrote:
Off the top of my head i believe the key ones are...
- energy production for fuelling homes etc.
- making transport green (so going electric, utilising public transport etc).
- I've heard industrial or concrete production can also release a lot of CO2?
- carbon tax/offsetting to change the way companies pollute.

Any others/adjustments you'd make to this list?


Why do you feel you need to reduce CO2? Please explain how you are going to accomplish this.


CO2 is so far the Main driver of global warming and the changes of climate. 1.95 W/m2 and counting:
yhttps://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2016GL071930

The road map is already clear
1. Change elevtricity generation to fossil free forms of generation. Manyncountries have alreadh done so. We have less than 1% fossil generation, and the decission is already made to convert the last planta from fossil to biofuels.
2. Electrification of transport. Not Just personal transport in cars, but public transports and the fleet of trucks.
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation and long haul shipping. One plannedninvestement nearby us using Forest residuals can alone take care of all domestic flights. And that is just from ONE Pulp Mill.
4. Fossil free Steel production such as yhttp://www.hybritdevelopment.com/ or similar projects
5. Electrification of mining: yhttps://www.nyteknik.se/fordon/boliden-elektrifierar-gruvtruckar-med-kontaktledningar-6900762 in Swedish but you get the point.
6. Stopping CO2 emissions from cement manufacturing: yhttps://www.cementa.se/sv/nollvision2030
7. Continue to develop the reactors types selected within gen IV fission reactors: yhttps://www.gen-4.org/gif/jcms/c_9260/Public whether or not they will be able to compete with renewables is Another issue.

Thus is what already is happening thanks to development of technology.

On a personal level, get COO's for renewables for your Home. Next time you change your heating system, get a modern efficient system (geo, air-air), install solar panels on your roof, next time you change your far go electric - or even better start using public transports if possible, reduce relying as long as aviation won't use more biofuels and so in and so forth.


That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us. Except for the few with their hands in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry. They will have their left food HARD on the breaks trying to resist the change that is already happening.



CO2 could be playing a role in warming the lower troposphere

No gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth. You can't create energy out of nothing.
James___ wrote:
but science suggests it's actually decreased O2.

No lack of gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth. You can't create energy out of nothing.
James___ wrote:
This is how biased science has become
No science here...move along...move along...
James___ wrote:
And scientists are not supposed to say it doesn't matter because of quantity.
Scientists don't have anyone controlling what they cannot say.
James___ wrote:
0.06% is more than 0.04%. And O2 removes heat through convection.
Heat is not contained in anything. Convection IS a form of heat.
James___ wrote:
It rises into the upper troposphere where it radiates heat into the tropopause.
Convection is not radiance.
James___ wrote:
But as scientists say, as long as we have enough to breathe, who cares?

Name these scientists that say this in this context.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
03-01-2020 04:26
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3376)
MarcusR wrote:
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation and long haul shipping...
That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us.


Growing fuel seems like it would have a lot more latitude than growing food. I'm sure if biofuels had more relevance in the market we'd Johnny Appleseed out way to much higher production growing in new places and ways.

Also it's worth noting as you have Marcus that these changes have a lot of other benefits.
03-01-2020 12:16
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13323)
tmiddles wrote:
MarcusR wrote:
3. Increase the share of biofuels for aviation and long haul shipping...
That is just a few things that already is happening, to the better for all of us.


Growing fuel seems like it would have a lot more latitude than growing food. I'm sure if biofuels had more relevance in the market we'd Johnny Appleseed out way to much higher production growing in new places and ways.

Also it's worth noting as you have Marcus that these changes have a lot of other benefits.


Growing corn for ethanol is like burning our food for fuel.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
03-01-2020 18:35
keepit
★★★★☆
(1699)
You got that right ITN.
03-01-2020 21:02
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7480)
Into the Night wrote:Growing corn for ethanol is like burning our food for fuel.

I'm envisioning a man asking his wife if the pot roast is ready yet ... because it's freezing in the apartment and wants to get the fireplace going.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist




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