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Wanting info about a chart


Wanting info about a chart26-01-2020 04:15
sydney
☆☆☆☆☆
(3)
If we look here: https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
we see a chart at the top of the page.

What is the cause of the more-or-less regular rising and falling pattern from the start until quite recently?

Thanks...
26-01-2020 04:38
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(6253)
sydney wrote:
If we look here: https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
we see a chart at the top of the page.

What is the cause of the more-or-less regular rising and falling pattern from the start until quite recently?

Thanks...

It's rubbish. Ignore it. Nobody knows the earth's atmospheric CO2 level. The only "data" that exists is fabricated. This chart is intended solely as a panic-generation device based on dishonesty. You have only yourself to blame if you fall for it.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
26-01-2020 05:19
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2520)
This is what you're refering to on the Nasa page (a CO2 level chart):

And this is the Earth's temp history for 800,000 years (basically the ice ages and interglacials):


So it's an excellent question you ask! A bit of a "chicken or the egg" if someone is fixated on CO2 and temp being the only factors. Which they are not.

I believe the theory on ice ages is that it's due to changes in the Earth's orbit. We talked about that a bit here:
Marcus R introduces milankovitch-cycles
Link he shared: https://www.livescience.com/64813-milankovitch-cycles.html

I guess more life = more CO2 ?? But I'm really fuzzy on how that all plays out. I'd love to know more.

Don't mind IBD. He's here to shut the board down. Before he goes any further he will tell you we have no idea what the temperature is in Denver either.

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is ever valid for them
Edited on 26-01-2020 05:28
26-01-2020 06:01
James___
★★★★★
(2415)
sydney wrote:
If we look here: https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
we see a chart at the top of the page.

What is the cause of the more-or-less regular rising and falling pattern from the start until quite recently?

Thanks...



That's actually something I plan on pursuing. They know it happened, glacial periods and inter-glacial periods but not why. According to Scripps Institute of Oceanography, they asked "Why do clouds form?"
They form because a weather system develops. Oceans release CO2 when they warm and absorb CO2 when they cool. And with me, I do think I know the reason why. But for the time being that doesn't matter because there's nothing I can do about it at the moment.
With that said, the fires in Australia and the droughts in the 1st decade of this millennia most likely caused by the lack of ozone in the stratosphere over Antarctica. That's caused by ODSs.
With the former, the Milankovitch cycles are often mentioned but no one can explain why they happen.

https://www.universetoday.com/39012/milankovitch-cycle/

p.s., in looking back at previous inter-glacial periods, 3 out of 4 had a higher peak warming than anything we've yet to experience. And those happened over periods of time in excess of a 1,000 years.
Edited on 26-01-2020 06:03
26-01-2020 06:18
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2520)
James___ wrote:...the Milankovitch cycles are often mentioned but no one can explain why they happen...
If we're able to calculate them accurately we wouldn't need to know why I supposed.

It's probably deceptively simple but the Earth getting a little closer and a little further from the Sun over thousands of years certainly does explain temperature change
26-01-2020 06:35
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1641)
tmiddles wrote:
Before he goes any further he will tell you we have no idea what the temperature is in Denver either.


You keep spouting off about this, but I've never heard your answer.

I will even define Denver for you by the given map. I will also determine Denver to include airspace to 714 ft above ground level. That is the tallest building, and if you're on it you can fairly say you're in Denver.

So, what is the temperature OF Denver?


gasguzzler, calling the jet stream the "Norwegian jet stream" is a bigoted statement. -James-
Attached image:


Edited on 26-01-2020 06:35
26-01-2020 06:56
James___
★★★★★
(2415)
tmiddles wrote:
James___ wrote:...the Milankovitch cycles are often mentioned but no one can explain why they happen...
If we're able to calculate them accurately we wouldn't need to know why I supposed.

It's probably deceptively simple but the Earth getting a little closer and a little further from the Sun over thousands of years certainly does explain temperature change



tmiddles, I just lost all respect for you with that post. Now about the climate getting warmer today. When are we going to start cooling again? That is what comes next. Why some of us take the time to do the math.

But your post was clever.
26-01-2020 06:58
James___
★★★★★
(2415)
GasGuzzler wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
Before he goes any further he will tell you we have no idea what the temperature is in Denver either.


You keep spouting off about this, but I've never heard your answer.

I will even define Denver for you by the given map. I will also determine Denver to include airspace to 714 ft above ground level. That is the tallest building, and if you're on it you can fairly say you're in Denver.

So, what is the temperature OF Denver?



You should quote tmiddles on what he posted to me. He doesn't understand and you don't care but some of us find the science interesting and possibly worthwhile.
26-01-2020 07:20
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2520)
James___ wrote: Now about the climate getting warmer today. When are we going to start cooling again?
My point was that if we can figure out what it's doing we can use that even if we haven't figured out why it's doing it.
26-01-2020 07:38
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(6253)
tmiddles wrote:My point was that if we can figure out what it's doing we can use that even if we haven't figured out why it's doing it.

I see. Your assertion is that past performance is a guarantee of future results. We don't need to know "why" it has done what it has done up to this point, just that we can call it a "trend" and just "know" what will happen next.

That's a brilliant model.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
26-01-2020 07:41
James___
★★★★★
(2415)
tmiddles wrote:
James___ wrote: Now about the climate getting warmer today. When are we going to start cooling again?
My point was that if we can figure out what it's doing we can use that even if we haven't figured out why it's doing it.



You really don't get it, do you? If we don't understand Natural Climate Variation or what I like to call NCV, we can't say AGW. As you said, the Earth warms because it moves closer to the Sun and cools if it is moving away from the Sun.
Problem solved. It isn't and this gets into technical science. If you look at most information online, it's generic. Ever wonder why it's typically warmer at 4:00 pm rather than at noon when the Sun is directly overhead?
The Solar Constant is 1366 w/m^2. Generic answer. It doesn't answer the question. There is an answer though if you care to do the math.
Sadly, I can't help you with the position that you put yourself in. You gave people like GasGuzzler the answer or at least a quote they can use against you.
26-01-2020 07:42
sydney
☆☆☆☆☆
(3)
Please stop hijacking this topic.

Either you have an informed, fact-based answer to my original question or you do not.

If you do not, don't post here.
26-01-2020 08:15
James___
★★★★★
(2415)
sydney wrote:
Please stop hijacking this topic.

Either you have an informed, fact-based answer to my original question or you do not.

If you do not, don't post here.



Please be mindful of where you are. If you read my response to tmiddles, if as in this link https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/features/GlobalWarming/page3.php, 3 periods of warming greater than what we are experiencing today. Might be the same link you posted.
The simple most basic problem is this, if we don't know the exact, specific reason why an ice age happens or why there is an inter-glacial period, then how can we say AGW?

Australia is having forest fires because of AGW. It's called ozone depletion. Over Antarctica.
And you will learn, in here there are basically no rules. I was on tmiddles side until he told me we know why the planet warms. It moves closer to the Sun. And that is your answer. And if the Earth moves away from the Sun, it cools.
That is the answer to your original post. If you want to know the physics, are you any good at math? Don't worry. Most people in here don't have time for it either. I'm sure you'll fit right in.


Best Wishes
The Guy Who Likes Math

Edited on 26-01-2020 08:34
26-01-2020 08:23
sydney
☆☆☆☆☆
(3)
I joined this site today; I am greatly disappointed at the quality of replies.

I will see what I can do to resign my membership.

I will not be returning.
26-01-2020 18:59
Harry CProfile picture★☆☆☆☆
(140)
sydney wrote:
I joined this site today; I am greatly disappointed at the quality of replies.

I will see what I can do to resign my membership.

I will not be returning.


If you don't have anything more than that chart, it's your loss. You got some good information. When you observe any anecdotal evidence you would be wise to research the source, and I'm not talking about NASA. Research the source of the information. There's too many flaws in that graphic presentation to rely upon for predictive purposes.

Many people here on both sides of the debate are hasty to dismiss evidence contrary to their side. You should have expected that. Compound that with interpersonal conflicts that have been ongoing and spill on to other threads and this looks like standard fare.


You learn something new every day if you are lucky!
26-01-2020 19:14
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11753)
sydney wrote:
If we look here: https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
we see a chart at the top of the page.

What is the cause of the more-or-less regular rising and falling pattern from the start until quite recently?

Thanks...


Nothing. It's made up data. Is it not possible to measure global atmospheric CO2 concentration. We don't have enough stations today. Mauna Loa has also been shown to be cooking their data. It's useless. No one was measuring CO2 concentrations at all before 1956. This data is pure conjecture. It is random numbers.


The Parrot Killer
26-01-2020 19:17
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11753)
tmiddles wrote:
This is what you're refering to on the Nasa page (a CO2 level chart):

And this is the Earth's temp history for 800,000 years (basically the ice ages and interglacials):

It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth. NASA didn't exist for 800,000 years.
tmiddles wrote:
So it's an excellent question you ask! A bit of a "chicken or the egg" if someone is fixated on CO2 and temp being the only factors. Which they are not.

No 'chicken', no 'egg'. Nothing.
tmiddles wrote:
I believe the theory on ice ages is that it's due to changes in the Earth's orbit. We talked about that a bit here:
Marcus R introduces milankovitch-cycles
Link he shared: https://www.livescience.com/64813-milankovitch-cycles.html

I guess more life = more CO2 ?? But I'm really fuzzy on how that all plays out. I'd love to know more.

About the so-called 'ice ages'? How do you know they even occurred?
tmiddles wrote:
Don't mind IBD. He's here to shut the board down.

Inversion fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
Before he goes any further he will tell you we have no idea what the temperature is in Denver either.

We don't. RQAA.


The Parrot Killer
26-01-2020 19:19
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(6253)
sydney wrote:
I joined this site today; I am greatly disappointed at the quality of replies.

I will see what I can do to resign my membership.

I will not be returning.

You will be totally missed. Godspeed.


.


Sea level varies from place to place in the world - keepit

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist




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