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Trump Skips another Climate Change Meeting With World Leaders...



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06-10-2019 09:15
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★☆
(1545)
James___ wrote:deletes temporary files like cookies. They showed once on the news that many websites will have a few tracking programs.
Incognito windows and better yet tor browsing are good too. But the fact that private companies have a file with the private data of individuals, against their will, is lame.
HarveyH55 wrote:
Privacy online, and on the phone, has always been a myth
Yes but making it legal to violate privacy makes it 10 times worse.
VernerHornung wrote:
Now you have to worry about pronouns. English had five of them in 1980, plus plurals and possessive forms for these. The number has grown to about 42 for New Yorkers since then
Where is Lenny Bruce when you need him! There needs to be some real rebellion against the Orwellian thought police. BUT having people free to define themselves is freedom. We just can't make rudeness illegal and be free. That's the deal. Real freedom means jerks run free.
12-10-2019 04:10
VernerHornungProfile picture★☆☆☆☆
(133)
tmiddles wrote:
Where is Lenny Bruce when you need him!

Lenny Bruce had slipped my mind, but yeah. How to Talk Dirty & Influence People, a parody of Dale Carnegie...


Never try to solve an NP-complete problem on your own with pencil & paper.
12-10-2019 18:47
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
tmiddles wrote:
James___ wrote:deletes temporary files like cookies. They showed once on the news that many websites will have a few tracking programs.
Incognito windows and better yet tor browsing are good too. But the fact that private companies have a file with the private data of individuals, against their will, is lame.

You volunteered. YOU used Google. YOU used any other website that installs cookies. It is no different than walking the street. People on that street know you are there. Any cop sees you walking by. Travel the same street over and over and that cop and the storekeepers will get to know you.
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Privacy online, and on the phone, has always been a myth
Yes but making it legal to violate privacy makes it 10 times worse.

You want privacy? Stop walking the same street. Stop using the internet. Stay in your house. Never go outdoors. Of course you won't get ultimate privacy anyway because your neighbors know you are some kind of weird hermit that never leaves the house.


The Parrot Killer
12-10-2019 18:53
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5192)
tmiddles wrote: There needs to be some real rebellion against the Orwellian thought police. BUT having people free to define themselves is freedom. We just can't make rudeness illegal and be free. That's the deal. Real freedom means jerks run free.

Well said.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS54CyMLXmI


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

When the alt-physics birds sing about "indivisible bodies," we've got pure BS. - VernerHornung

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
14-10-2019 13:44
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★☆
(1545)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: There needs to be some real rebellion against the Orwellian thought police. BUT having people free to define themselves is freedom. We just can't make rudeness illegal and be free. That's the deal. Real freedom means jerks run free.

Well said.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS54CyMLXmI
.
We are in complete agreement on something!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-oV42OMQoE Noam Chomsky defended the right of a guy denying the holocaust. Because you have to be free to think!

Into the Night wrote:
You volunteered. YOU used Google. YOU used any other website that installs cookies.
And Europe recently forced an affirmative consent on that (we've all been clicking through). We decide as a society what the nuances of contract law are. We need to do a better job in the US of protecting the public. We need to change the law. That's the point! What is currently legal is a horrible invasion of privacy based on power not mutual agreement. What if Google needed a signed, in ink, motorized contract from everyone to cross a certain line?

VernerHornung wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
Where is Lenny Bruce when you need him!

Lenny Bruce had slipped my mind, but yeah. How to Talk Dirty & Influence People, a parody of Dale Carnegie...
Ah! He's so good. See him in a small role in The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel
14-10-2019 17:23
James___
★★★★☆
(1829)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: There needs to be some real rebellion against the Orwellian thought police. BUT having people free to define themselves is freedom. We just can't make rudeness illegal and be free. That's the deal. Real freedom means jerks run free.

Well said.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS54CyMLXmI
.
We are in complete agreement on something!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-oV42OMQoE Noam Chomsky defended the right of a guy denying the holocaust. Because you have to be free to think!

Into the Night wrote:
You volunteered. YOU used Google. YOU used any other website that installs cookies.
And Europe recently forced an affirmative consent on that (we've all been clicking through). We decide as a society what the nuances of contract law are. We need to do a better job in the US of protecting the public. We need to change the law. That's the point! What is currently legal is a horrible invasion of privacy based on power not mutual agreement. What if Google needed a signed, in ink, motorized contract from everyone to cross a certain line?

VernerHornung wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
Where is Lenny Bruce when you need him!

Lenny Bruce had slipped my mind, but yeah. How to Talk Dirty & Influence People, a parody of Dale Carnegie...
Ah! He's so good. See him in a small role in The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel



You know something odd about saying people can be rude to others if they feel like it. I lost a job that way. My coworkers didn't support a disabled Veteran having a family. But when I wanted one, I created a hostile work environment for them.
Even Christians told me that they couldn't allow me to have a family. Am curious at what point did their right to free speech take away my rights?
If people have nothing better to do than to bother someone else, they should get a life instead of saying free speech.
Had a friend from Spain who explained it to me. There used to be common law where people lived their own lives but that was replaced with corporate or as you say, business law.
Thing is, according to business law, has Trump done anything wrong? Can you prove intent? If not then when he cheated on his taxes, his wives and asked Ukraine for a favor, business law can easily be manipulated.
After all, when Trump and his sister increased charges billed to their father, supply and demand. Capitalism. That's actually allowed by law even though they were avoiding the gift tax by using a shell company. Business law can allow for children to overcharge their parent.
So when you say that people can be rude to people who don't want to be bothered by them, then people aren't free to live their own life but can only do what's allowed by any law that applies to a business. Kind of why I think the US is falling apart. As you say, corporate law gives people rights. It doesn't. It makes businesses people. Campaign finance laws have been changed to give corporations the same rights to contribute to campaigns as people.

https://www.npr.org/2014/07/28/335288388/when-did-companies-become-people-excavating-the-legal-evolution
14-10-2019 20:42
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
You volunteered. YOU used Google. YOU used any other website that installs cookies.
And Europe recently forced an affirmative consent on that (we've all been clicking through). We decide as a society what the nuances of contract law are. We need to do a better job in the US of protecting the public. We need to change the law. That's the point! What is currently legal is a horrible invasion of privacy based on power not mutual agreement. What if Google needed a signed, in ink, motorized contract from everyone to cross a certain line?


For the line you are insisting on, there would be no Google. You couldn't look up any crockpot web pages to cut and paste anymore.


The Parrot Killer
17-10-2019 15:01
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★☆
(1545)
Into the Night wrote:
For the line you are insisting on, there would be no Google.
Search would be an extremely profitable business regardless of how many restrictions were put on it's business model. With no cookies at all you'd make a killing owning search. No reason Google needs extra favors as a business to invade privacy and cyberstalk everyone.
17-10-2019 17:01
VernerHornungProfile picture★☆☆☆☆
(133)
tmiddles wrote:
Ah! He's so good. See him in a small role in The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel

A modern remake of the '50s, but yeah. "We're corrupted." Wouldn't be out of sorts if the roulette wheels at Trump Entertainment Resorts have a lead ingot under the double zero, to make the ball land there a bit more often than it should.

I thought you were taking a break; I've been avoiding the Trump threads because they give me heartburn. Maalox already has several cookies on my computer.
~



Never try to solve an NP-complete problem on your own with pencil & paper.
17-10-2019 22:32
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
For the line you are insisting on, there would be no Google.
Search would be an extremely profitable business regardless of how many restrictions were put on it's business model.

No. It would not.
tmiddles wrote:
With no cookies at all you'd make a killing owning search.

Search doesn't need cookies. Turn them off in your browser if you're so paranoid about them.
tmiddles wrote:
No reason Google needs extra favors as a business to invade privacy and cyberstalk everyone.

If you don't like Google there are other search engines out there.


The Parrot Killer
17-10-2019 22:35
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
VernerHornung wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
Ah! He's so good. See him in a small role in The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel

A modern remake of the '50s, but yeah. "We're corrupted." Wouldn't be out of sorts if the roulette wheels at Trump Entertainment Resorts have a lead ingot under the double zero, to make the ball land there a bit more often than it should.

I thought you were taking a break; I've been avoiding the Trump threads because they give me heartburn. Maalox already has several cookies on my computer.
~


Such a wheel is easily caught by the local gambling authority. It would be extremely stupid to risk a license to print money casino license on such cheating techniques.

Trump isn't corrupted, and he isn't breaking any law.


The Parrot Killer
17-10-2019 22:51
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1508)
Only the democrats give away 'free' stuff, and even then, it's not really free, is it? A web presence costs money, the more traffic on your site, the more you have to pay to support it. People are cheap, they don't voluntarily pay for anything, more than they need to. One way or or another, you have to pay-to-play.
18-10-2019 13:31
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★☆
(1545)
VernerHornung wrote:I've been avoiding the Trump threads because they give me heartburn.
I can honestly say Trump is the most traumatic thing to happen in my own life! Granted I've been pretty lucky not to have real trauma in the past but still, for a politician to make life such a nightmare is astounding. I think the worst is yet to come sadly. I should go watch Bob Roberts again, that was a great film.

Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Search would be an extremely profitable

No. It would not.
Are billboards profitable? Hmmm, yep! guess what, they have actual overhead and no cookies at all. Search is one of the easiest ways to make money online.

Into the Night wrote:
If you don't like Google there are other search engines out there.
What I don't like is lack of regulation. That applies to the entire market. Facebook is even worse.

The argument "if you don't like go somewhere else" avoids the actual discussion: Should we be making the rules and if so which ones?

Here's where you say everything an anarchist would say and call it capitalism.

HarveyH55 wrote:One way or or another, you have to pay-to-play.

So a private company creates a file on you Harvey. They record your SSN, and every personal detail about you they can find. They buy and trade your information with other companies to make your file more detailed and thorough. They don't protect the information and it's easily stolen. They sell your file to anyone will to pay. If you want the file deleted tough luck, they own it not you.

We can decide what rights we have in society. I don't want a file kept on me, I should be able to opt out. Better yet I think anyone should have to opt in.
18-10-2019 16:26
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1508)
tmiddles wrote:
VernerHornung wrote:I've been avoiding the Trump threads because they give me heartburn.
I can honestly say Trump is the most traumatic thing to happen in my own life! Granted I've been pretty lucky not to have real trauma in the past but still, for a politician to make life such a nightmare is astounding. I think the worst is yet to come sadly. I should go watch Bob Roberts again, that was a great film.

Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Search would be an extremely profitable

No. It would not.
Are billboards profitable? Hmmm, yep! guess what, they have actual overhead and no cookies at all. Search is one of the easiest ways to make money online.

Into the Night wrote:
If you don't like Google there are other search engines out there.
What I don't like is lack of regulation. That applies to the entire market. Facebook is even worse.

The argument "if you don't like go somewhere else" avoids the actual discussion: Should we be making the rules and if so which ones?

Here's where you say everything an anarchist would say and call it capitalism.

HarveyH55 wrote:One way or or another, you have to pay-to-play.

So a private company creates a file on you Harvey. They record your SSN, and every personal detail about you they can find. They buy and trade your information with other companies to make your file more detailed and thorough. They don't protect the information and it's easily stolen. They sell your file to anyone will to pay. If you want the file deleted tough luck, they own it not you.

We can decide what rights we have in society. I don't want a file kept on me, I should be able to opt out. Better yet I think anyone should have to opt in.


You don't get to opt out, since you agreed to it, when you used their service, shopped at their webstore. This isn't a new concept, been around, before the internet. They use to mail out surveys, for which you get something 'free' for filling it out. There were 'sweepstakes' and contests. They at least got your name, address, and phone number, and permission to use that information as the pleased. Which usually was more junk mail, telemarketers, who paid for your information. It's not so much pulling the info out of the phone book, the value is in their list, is of people, who are known to respond, and the types of thing you respond to, or buy. On the internet, people give up a lot of marketing information. Social media is really just a goldmine for marketing and social research, and it's free. The DNA ancestor sites, are good too, people pay to learn their heredity, pay for too, which they sell to other people, who might be related. They sell to research, and law enforcement as well.
01-11-2019 13:31
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★☆
(1545)
HarveyH55 wrote:
You don't get to opt out, since you agreed to it,
This line of thinking validates indentured servitude and a whole host of things which are illegal.

The argument here is that we should change the laws.
01-11-2019 15:55
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5192)
tmiddles wrote:The argument here is that we should change the laws.

No, the argument here is that if you willingly agree to something then you should honor your agreement.

Conclusion: we should NOT change laws to enable the dishonest to weasel out of their valid, legal contracts and debts.

.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

When the alt-physics birds sing about "indivisible bodies," we've got pure BS. - VernerHornung

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
01-11-2019 18:09
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Only the democrats give away 'free' stuff, and even then, it's not really free, is it? A web presence costs money, the more traffic on your site, the more you have to pay to support it. People are cheap, they don't voluntarily pay for anything, more than they need to. One way or or another, you have to pay-to-play.


Well said. The promise of free stuff is a lie. None of it is free. This is also the promise of Utopia made by socialists and the lie behind it. The Utopia turns out to be a prison.


The Parrot Killer
01-11-2019 18:25
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10174)
tmiddles wrote:
VernerHornung wrote:I've been avoiding the Trump threads because they give me heartburn.
I can honestly say Trump is the most traumatic thing to happen in my own life!

TDS a real problem, eh?

tmiddles wrote:
Granted I've been pretty lucky not to have real trauma in the past

Paradox. You just described your worse trauma. Which is it, dude?
tmiddles wrote:
but still, for a politician to make life such a nightmare is astounding.

Why is your life a nightmare? Have you been messing with drugs or something?
tmiddles wrote:
I think the worst is yet to come sadly.

...such as? The worst of what? What's the skin off your nose about any of it?
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Search would be an extremely profitable

No. It would not.
Are billboards profitable? Hmmm, yep! guess what, they have actual overhead and no cookies at all. Search is one of the easiest ways to make money online.

Contextomy fallacy. Pay attention to the conversation.

tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
If you don't like Google there are other search engines out there.
What I don't like is lack of regulation. That applies to the entire market. Facebook is even worse.

Then don't use them. No one is forcing you to use either of them.
tmiddles wrote:
The argument "if you don't like go somewhere else" avoids the actual discussion:

No. It IS the discussion.
tmiddles wrote:
Should we be making the rules and if so which ones?

YOU don't get to dictate markets. You are not the king.
tmiddles wrote:
Here's where you say everything an anarchist would say and call it capitalism.

Extreme argument fallacy. You are also conflating governmental structures (or the lack of them) with an economic system.
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:One way or or another, you have to pay-to-play.

So a private company creates a file on you Harvey.

You mean like a personnel record? Perhaps a file at Amazon because you joined Amazon Prime voluntarily?
tmiddles wrote:
They record your SSN, and every personal detail about you they can find.

Amazon does have my SSN, but that's because I worked for them at one point. They are already under a variety of laws not to divulge that information except to the federal government as required by law.
tmiddles wrote:
They buy and trade your information with other companies to make your file more detailed and thorough. They don't protect the information and it's easily stolen. They sell your file to anyone will to pay. If you want the file deleted tough luck, they own it not you.

Did you know that Amazon is liable for any damages of information that is stolen? Beyond that, the thief is liable for the damages caused by his theft. We already have laws about that.
tmiddles wrote:
We can decide what rights we have in society.

We already do.
tmiddles wrote:
I don't want a file kept on me,
I should be able to opt out.

Then don't work anywhere, don't use the internet, don't use a bank, don't file your taxes or use any government service, don't drive a car or fly an airplane, never travel outside the United States, never own a home or rent an apartment, never buy or use a cell phone, never participate in any club, go find an isolated spot in the woods, never vote, and never tell anyone your name.
tmiddles wrote:
Better yet I think anyone should have to opt in.

You already do. You do whenever you participate in any of the things I just listed.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 01-11-2019 18:26
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