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They Still Say it's going to get Hotter



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16-08-2017 23:33
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:

1) Weather stations are not typically located at airport. Only airport condition weather is usually reported at one if any weather is reported at all. Most of those stations are robots broadcasting on a radio. These stations, if they exist, are usually located near the center of the field, never at the end of a runway. It would interfere with approach instrumentation.
2) Airports are usually located in the countryside. Aircraft need clear approach and takeoff paths. They can make a lot of noise. Few people want to live near one.
3) A major airport is a chunk of land that contains several runways some 2 miles on a side. There is nothing but grass over the bulk of the property. There are no houses, few buildings, no trees, and narrow strips of asphalt or concrete. The airport itself is effectively countryside.
Wake wrote:
Even in a city the upwind side of the city is going to have lower temperatures than the downwind side on a sunny day.

You're guessing again. You don't know what's on the upwind side.

I hope you go see the eclipse in a totality zone. Then you will see just how fast the temperature drops (typically 10-12 deg F) as the Sun is covered by the Moon for two minutes.

No amount of 'greenhouse' gas is going to stop it. No heat island effect is going to keep it from happen9ing.

Wake wrote:
But again - these aren't really pertinent since the the temperature is calculated from the level of energy leaving the earth as read by the infrared satellites.

Satellites are not able to read absolute temperature. No one knows the emissivity of Earth. You really should learn more about the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


Gee, you must have all the answers

I have the answers I need.
Wake wrote:
- I always wondered why the majority of weather reporting systems were owned and operated by the FAA.

They aren't. The majority of weather reporting systems are privately owned. So are the majority of thermometers.

Airport weather monitoring equipment is not owned by the FAA. It is owned by the owner of the airport, typically a city government, county government, or even an individual.
Wake wrote:
One would never for a second suspect that wind velocity, direction and temperature would be important for an aircraft.

Velocity and direction of wind is as simple as a windsock. Several airports also use robots to broadcast this information (ASOS) or even have an operator read the instrument and include it in their briefing to approaching pilots (ATIS). Many airports have nothing more than a windsock. Some don't even have that. You gauge your wind by how the runway looks during approach.

Temperature is not that important to aircraft unless it gets very hot or very cold. Most pilots are already aware of such conditions. Robots typically broadcast the temperature and dewpoint so you can predict any obscuring fog forming. soon.

You actually do not need a weather station on the airport at all. Not even a windsock. It's possible to fly and safely land at an airport with nothing for weather reporting at all.

Wake wrote:
Your stupid ideas that because an airport isn't in a downtown area that Urban Heat Island effects aren't measurable shows again that you haven't a clue and simply shoot off your mouth to hear the noise.

Do I have to bring up pictures of airports again? IBDaMann already did this for you once. Did you forget already?
Wake wrote:
Anyone capable of using the Internet properly would have been able to find scientific papers about the difference in temperatures on the upwind and down in urban centers.

Science isn't papers. The internet isn't the Oracle of Truth.
Wake wrote:
But I'm guessing and you haven't a clue what's going on.

It's obvious you don't. You are blatantly ignoring the truth about aviation, airport weather systems, and the NOAA network.


Man, you simply cannot stop yourself from showing everyone how little knowledge you have can you?

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/weather/asos/

Pick a state - any state moron. Even the ghost state of Wyoming has 32 FAA owned and operated weather stations.

Not owned and operated by the FAA. Owned and operated by the airports.

The URL you referenced just shows which airports have them. If you're going to misinterpret stuff like this, no wonder you can't get history or math right.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:35
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


15 minute resolution isn't good enough. The totality lasts only a couple of minutes along the centerline. Less the further away from the centerline you get.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:37
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


It's like speaking to an idiot child. He says anything to make himself look smart. The most obvious BS flows out of his mouth.

He hasn't a ghost of an idea of why orbital changes in the weather IR satellite would make a difference in the monitored MGT and goes right ahead and tells us that it makes no difference.


Satellites can't measure the mean global temperature. They are incapable of measuring an absolute temperature. What they do measure is not affected significantly by changes in their orbit.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:39
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:

1) Weather stations are not typically located at airport. Only airport condition weather is usually reported at one if any weather is reported at all. Most of those stations are robots broadcasting on a radio. These stations, if they exist, are usually located near the center of the field, never at the end of a runway. It would interfere with approach instrumentation.
2) Airports are usually located in the countryside. Aircraft need clear approach and takeoff paths. They can make a lot of noise. Few people want to live near one.
3) A major airport is a chunk of land that contains several runways some 2 miles on a side. There is nothing but grass over the bulk of the property. There are no houses, few buildings, no trees, and narrow strips of asphalt or concrete. The airport itself is effectively countryside.
Wake wrote:
Even in a city the upwind side of the city is going to have lower temperatures than the downwind side on a sunny day.

You're guessing again. You don't know what's on the upwind side.

I hope you go see the eclipse in a totality zone. Then you will see just how fast the temperature drops (typically 10-12 deg F) as the Sun is covered by the Moon for two minutes.

No amount of 'greenhouse' gas is going to stop it. No heat island effect is going to keep it from happen9ing.

Wake wrote:
But again - these aren't really pertinent since the the temperature is calculated from the level of energy leaving the earth as read by the infrared satellites.

Satellites are not able to read absolute temperature. No one knows the emissivity of Earth. You really should learn more about the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


Gee, you must have all the answers

I have the answers I need.
Wake wrote:
- I always wondered why the majority of weather reporting systems were owned and operated by the FAA.

They aren't. The majority of weather reporting systems are privately owned. So are the majority of thermometers.

Airport weather monitoring equipment is not owned by the FAA. It is owned by the owner of the airport, typically a city government, county government, or even an individual.
Wake wrote:
One would never for a second suspect that wind velocity, direction and temperature would be important for an aircraft.

Velocity and direction of wind is as simple as a windsock. Several airports also use robots to broadcast this information (ASOS) or even have an operator read the instrument and include it in their briefing to approaching pilots (ATIS). Many airports have nothing more than a windsock. Some don't even have that. You gauge your wind by how the runway looks during approach.

Temperature is not that important to aircraft unless it gets very hot or very cold. Most pilots are already aware of such conditions. Robots typically broadcast the temperature and dewpoint so you can predict any obscuring fog forming. soon.

You actually do not need a weather station on the airport at all. Not even a windsock. It's possible to fly and safely land at an airport with nothing for weather reporting at all.

Wake wrote:
Your stupid ideas that because an airport isn't in a downtown area that Urban Heat Island effects aren't measurable shows again that you haven't a clue and simply shoot off your mouth to hear the noise.

Do I have to bring up pictures of airports again? IBDaMann already did this for you once. Did you forget already?
Wake wrote:
Anyone capable of using the Internet properly would have been able to find scientific papers about the difference in temperatures on the upwind and down in urban centers.

Science isn't papers. The internet isn't the Oracle of Truth.
Wake wrote:
But I'm guessing and you haven't a clue what's going on.

It's obvious you don't. You are blatantly ignoring the truth about aviation, airport weather systems, and the NOAA network.


Man, you simply cannot stop yourself from showing everyone how little knowledge you have can you?

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/weather/asos/

Pick a state - any state moron. Even the ghost state of Wyoming has 32 FAA owned and operated weather stations.

Not owned and operated by the FAA. Owned and operated by the airports.

The URL you referenced just shows which airports have them. If you're going to misinterpret stuff like this, no wonder you can't get history or math right.


I wondered why it said: "The Automated Surface Observing System, or ASOS, is an array of instruments for observing temperature, precipitation, wind, sky cover, visibility, and pressure. It was developed as a joint effort between the National Weather Service (NWS), Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), and Department of Defense (DOD)."

That has "privately owned" written all over it.

As I said, I recognized your problem a long time ago. While trying to ignore it as usual for your kind you keep shoving it in the face of straight people.
16-08-2017 23:43
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:

1) Weather stations are not typically located at airport. Only airport condition weather is usually reported at one if any weather is reported at all. Most of those stations are robots broadcasting on a radio. These stations, if they exist, are usually located near the center of the field, never at the end of a runway. It would interfere with approach instrumentation.
2) Airports are usually located in the countryside. Aircraft need clear approach and takeoff paths. They can make a lot of noise. Few people want to live near one.
3) A major airport is a chunk of land that contains several runways some 2 miles on a side. There is nothing but grass over the bulk of the property. There are no houses, few buildings, no trees, and narrow strips of asphalt or concrete. The airport itself is effectively countryside.
Wake wrote:
Even in a city the upwind side of the city is going to have lower temperatures than the downwind side on a sunny day.

You're guessing again. You don't know what's on the upwind side.

I hope you go see the eclipse in a totality zone. Then you will see just how fast the temperature drops (typically 10-12 deg F) as the Sun is covered by the Moon for two minutes.

No amount of 'greenhouse' gas is going to stop it. No heat island effect is going to keep it from happen9ing.

Wake wrote:
But again - these aren't really pertinent since the the temperature is calculated from the level of energy leaving the earth as read by the infrared satellites.

Satellites are not able to read absolute temperature. No one knows the emissivity of Earth. You really should learn more about the Stefan-Boltzmann law.


Gee, you must have all the answers

I have the answers I need.
Wake wrote:
- I always wondered why the majority of weather reporting systems were owned and operated by the FAA.

They aren't. The majority of weather reporting systems are privately owned. So are the majority of thermometers.

Airport weather monitoring equipment is not owned by the FAA. It is owned by the owner of the airport, typically a city government, county government, or even an individual.
Wake wrote:
One would never for a second suspect that wind velocity, direction and temperature would be important for an aircraft.

Velocity and direction of wind is as simple as a windsock. Several airports also use robots to broadcast this information (ASOS) or even have an operator read the instrument and include it in their briefing to approaching pilots (ATIS). Many airports have nothing more than a windsock. Some don't even have that. You gauge your wind by how the runway looks during approach.

Temperature is not that important to aircraft unless it gets very hot or very cold. Most pilots are already aware of such conditions. Robots typically broadcast the temperature and dewpoint so you can predict any obscuring fog forming. soon.

You actually do not need a weather station on the airport at all. Not even a windsock. It's possible to fly and safely land at an airport with nothing for weather reporting at all.

Wake wrote:
Your stupid ideas that because an airport isn't in a downtown area that Urban Heat Island effects aren't measurable shows again that you haven't a clue and simply shoot off your mouth to hear the noise.

Do I have to bring up pictures of airports again? IBDaMann already did this for you once. Did you forget already?
Wake wrote:
Anyone capable of using the Internet properly would have been able to find scientific papers about the difference in temperatures on the upwind and down in urban centers.

Science isn't papers. The internet isn't the Oracle of Truth.
Wake wrote:
But I'm guessing and you haven't a clue what's going on.

It's obvious you don't. You are blatantly ignoring the truth about aviation, airport weather systems, and the NOAA network.


Man, you simply cannot stop yourself from showing everyone how little knowledge you have can you?

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/weather/asos/

Pick a state - any state moron. Even the ghost state of Wyoming has 32 FAA owned and operated weather stations.

Not owned and operated by the FAA. Owned and operated by the airports.

The URL you referenced just shows which airports have them. If you're going to misinterpret stuff like this, no wonder you can't get history or math right.


I wondered why it said: "The Automated Surface Observing System, or ASOS, is an array of instruments for observing temperature, precipitation, wind, sky cover, visibility, and pressure. It was developed as a joint effort between the National Weather Service (NWS), Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), and Department of Defense (DOD)."

That has "privately owned" written all over it.

As I said, I recognized your problem a long time ago. While trying to ignore it as usual for your kind you keep shoving it in the face of straight people.


The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:43
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


15 minute resolution isn't good enough. The totality lasts only a couple of minutes along the centerline. Less the further away from the centerline you get.


Hey stupid - you said that the temperature cooled by 20 degrees in an eclipse. The total eclipse only lasts 8 seconds but the major eclipse lasts 4 hours. Unless you changing your mind and now telling us that the air reheats instantly after a total eclipse.
16-08-2017 23:45
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?
16-08-2017 23:48
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Satellites can't measure the mean global temperature. They are incapable of measuring an absolute temperature. What they do measure is not affected significantly by changes in their orbit.


And again the "thing" tells us about how little science he knows. And where was the references for that science again?
16-08-2017 23:49
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


15 minute resolution isn't good enough. The totality lasts only a couple of minutes along the centerline. Less the further away from the centerline you get.


Hey stupid - you said that the temperature cooled by 20 degrees in an eclipse.

Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun.
Wake wrote:
The total eclipse only lasts 8 seconds

WRONG. Totality lasts somewhat over 2 minutes (if you are near the centerline of the eclipse).
Wake wrote:
but the major eclipse lasts 4 hours.

WRONG. The partial phases are over and done with in a bit over 2 hours.
Wake wrote:
Unless you changing your mind and now telling us that the air reheats instantly after a total eclipse.

Warmth returns pretty fast. Maybe you should go experience it for yourself instead of making up arguments from randU.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:52
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


The Parrot Killer
16-08-2017 23:53
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Satellites can't measure the mean global temperature. They are incapable of measuring an absolute temperature. What they do measure is not affected significantly by changes in their orbit.


And again the "thing" tells us about how little science he knows. And where was the references for that science again?


You are not discussing science. Neither am I. I am discussing the limitations of instrumentation on board satellites.


The Parrot Killer
17-08-2017 00:02
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1325)
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


Oh, I misread that. 10-15 degree drop in 2 minutes you say? In that case I'll bet you the entire Iowa corn fed cow!

No way the temps drop 10 degrees, with 65+ dewpoints and clear skies.
17-08-2017 00:03
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.
17-08-2017 00:06
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


"In the U.S. it's more common to have airports be run my a governmental agency associated with a city or county.

For example, SFO is part of the City and County of San Francisco and the policy is set by the Airport Commission.

Washington National and Dulles International are owned and operated by the Metropolitan Washington Airports Authority, which also operates the freeway and toll road that connects Dulles to the Capitol Beltway.

http://mwaa.com/263.htm"
Edited on 17-08-2017 00:08
17-08-2017 00:36
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.


I'm a pilot, mechanic, and have been for most of my life dumbass.

Airports buy these things, coordinate the installation of them, and operate and maintain them. The FAA's only role is to make sure it works when they are done installing it. These devices are manufactured by private companies (not the FAA or any other government agency) and installed according to FAA regulations. The National Weather Service operates the network for these things. The FCC verifies the radio portion is legit. The FAA verifies the instruments are accurate enough (they check it from time to time), and that the system is out of the way of aircraft (meaning not near the end of a runway, among other things).

Just like aircraft. Designed and built by private companies (or individuals like me), then certified by the FAA, and flown by FAA certified pilots (like me).

The taxiway and runway lights, the approach lights, the ramp lighting, the runways, the taxiways, are built and/or installed and maintained by the airport.


The Parrot Killer
17-08-2017 00:37
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


"In the U.S. it's more common to have airports be run my a governmental agency associated with a city or county.

I already said this, stupid. Pay attention.


The Parrot Killer
17-08-2017 00:44
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.


I'm a pilot, mechanic, and have been for most of my life dumbass.

Airports buy these things, coordinate the installation of them, and operate and maintain them. The FAA's only role is to make sure it works when they are done installing it. These devices are manufactured by private companies (not the FAA or any other government agency) and installed according to FAA regulations. The National Weather Service operates the network for these things. The FCC verifies the radio portion is legit. The FAA verifies the instruments are accurate enough (they check it from time to time), and that the system is out of the way of aircraft (meaning not near the end of a runway, among other things).

Just like aircraft. Designed and built by private companies (or individuals like me), then certified by the FAA, and flown by FAA certified pilots (like me).

The taxiway and runway lights, the approach lights, the ramp lighting, the runways, the taxiways, are built and/or installed and maintained by the airport.


You have also been a dumbass all your life. Apparently you don't remember President Reagan firing 10,000 striking Air Controllers.

Almost all major commercial airports are owned by local governments and manned and everything specified by FAA personnel.
17-08-2017 01:27
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.


I'm a pilot, mechanic, and have been for most of my life dumbass.

Airports buy these things, coordinate the installation of them, and operate and maintain them. The FAA's only role is to make sure it works when they are done installing it. These devices are manufactured by private companies (not the FAA or any other government agency) and installed according to FAA regulations. The National Weather Service operates the network for these things. The FCC verifies the radio portion is legit. The FAA verifies the instruments are accurate enough (they check it from time to time), and that the system is out of the way of aircraft (meaning not near the end of a runway, among other things).

Just like aircraft. Designed and built by private companies (or individuals like me), then certified by the FAA, and flown by FAA certified pilots (like me).

The taxiway and runway lights, the approach lights, the ramp lighting, the runways, the taxiways, are built and/or installed and maintained by the airport.


You have also been a dumbass all your life.

You are really out to insult people because of your Bulverist attitude, aren't you?
Wake wrote:
Apparently you don't remember President Reagan firing 10,000 striking Air Controllers.

Of course I do. In my opinion, they deserved it.
Wake wrote:
Almost all major commercial airports are owned by local governments

Almost? I would say all major commercial airports are owned by local governments. I don't know of any privately held major airport.

Other airports are privately owned (we have a rather nice one just south of my home airport). My home airport is owned by the city government.
Wake wrote:
and manned and everything specified by FAA personnel.

Nope. No FAA personnel are at SeaTac other than the control tower. There are none at my home airport, or the privately owned one just south of me.The guys in the control tower at nearby Renton field are hired by the city of Renton. My airport has no control tower at all.

Everyone else at SeaTac are hired by private vendors located there, the airlines, TSA, Customs, or the Port of Seattle.

The airport must conform to FAA regulations (Part 139 and related AC's), that describe how the airport is going to install and maintain it's lighting, signage, equipment, etc. The Port of Seattle does the actual maintenance, including the ATIS system there.

My airport has ASOS. The city bought that and installed it according to FAA regulations. They maintain it. It is a robot, though, and breaks from time to time. Most of us just use the windsock. They're pretty reliable. The city also maintains the instrument approach system there including the antennas, strobes, transmitters, and marker beacon. The use the fire department to maintain the main airport beacon (they have the ladders).

The private airport has no conditions monitoring equipment at all except for a windsock (sewn together by the wife of the owner no less!).

An airport east of there has no windsock or anything. It's runway lights and taxiway lights are homemade. It is privately owned, with contribution money coming from the city there.


The Parrot Killer
20-08-2017 08:03
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1325)
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.
Attached image:


Edited on 20-08-2017 08:07
20-08-2017 18:22
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.


As I said, if you play with pigs all you get is muddy. When talking to an idiot don't expect to hear anything but pure ignorance.
21-08-2017 07:11
litesong
★★★★★
(2297)
[b]Wake wrote:...if you play with pigs all you get is muddy.

Many pigs are clean. All old sick silly sleepy sleezy slimy steenkin' filthy vile reprobate rooting (& rotting) racist pukey proud pig AGW denier liar whiners are as muddy as "old sick silly sleepy sleezy slimy steenkin' filthy vile reprobate rooting (& rotting) racist pukey proud pig AGW denier liar whiner wake-me-up".
22-08-2017 18:35
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.


I was at the total eclipse. Where I was at, the thermometer went from 93 to 76. Some people put sweaters on.

The temperature difference is from normal Sun output to total coverage. This takes about an hour. During totality itself, we lost about 5 deg F of that.

People on the wet side of the mountains here experience similar differences in temperature.

Carbon dioxide prevented none of it. Water vapor prevented none of it.


The Parrot Killer
22-08-2017 18:36
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.


As I said, if you play with pigs all you get is muddy. When talking to an idiot don't expect to hear anything but pure ignorance.


It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.


The Parrot Killer
22-08-2017 18:45
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.


As I said, if you play with pigs all you get is muddy. When talking to an idiot don't expect to hear anything but pure ignorance.


It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.


Well your lying BS ain't getting you anywhere. If it takes 5 hours of night for the temperature to drop 20 degrees you aren't going to convince anyone that it dropped that much when total eclipse is only seconds long and near full coverage on 3 minutes or so. The rest of the eclipse gives little more coverage of the sun than partial cloud cover would. And that doesn't drop the temperature remarkably.

Tell us more about how you're a commercial pilot. You have as much chance of convincing anyone of that as that the temperature dropped 20 degrees in a couple of minutes.
22-08-2017 19:29
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1325)
ITM wrote;
It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.

Not intentionally holding any info...what do you say is important and missing?
If you say it dropped 17 degrees during the eclipse, fine. I just want to know what is so different about the sun disappearing behind the horizon from the sun disappearing behind the moon. I cant seem to find that kind of diurnal drop in temp on an other normal evening in the US. I'd also like to know your eclipse viewing location to look at the conditions record.
22-08-2017 19:37
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITM wrote;
It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.

Not intentionally holding any info...what do you say is important and missing?
If you say it dropped 17 degrees during the eclipse, fine. I just want to know what is so different about the sun disappearing behind the horizon from the sun disappearing behind the moon. I cant seem to find that kind of diurnal drop in temp on an other normal evening in the US. I'd also like to know your eclipse viewing location to look at the conditions record.


Don't argue with someone that really knows about flying - that makes him really smart.
22-08-2017 20:00
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1325)
Not arguing...just want to learn. I've never observed a temp drop like that aside from a sharp cold front. Just want to know why a moon passage is so much colder.
22-08-2017 20:06
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
GasGuzzler wrote:
Not arguing...just want to learn. I've never observed a temp drop like that aside from a sharp cold front. Just want to know why a moon passage is so much colder.


When you have a reason to have a good imagination anything is possible.
22-08-2017 21:21
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.


I'm a pilot, mechanic, and have been for most of my life dumbass.

Airports buy these things, coordinate the installation of them, and operate and maintain them. The FAA's only role is to make sure it works when they are done installing it. These devices are manufactured by private companies (not the FAA or any other government agency) and installed according to FAA regulations. The National Weather Service operates the network for these things. The FCC verifies the radio portion is legit. The FAA verifies the instruments are accurate enough (they check it from time to time), and that the system is out of the way of aircraft (meaning not near the end of a runway, among other things).

Just like aircraft. Designed and built by private companies (or individuals like me), then certified by the FAA, and flown by FAA certified pilots (like me).

The taxiway and runway lights, the approach lights, the ramp lighting, the runways, the taxiways, are built and/or installed and maintained by the airport.


That makes no difference dumbass - while the airports are usually constructed and owned by local or state governments virtually all airport proper personnel are FAA employees. That was how Reagan could fire 10,000 striking air controllers in one fell swoop when their strike closed down the entire commercial air industry.

After four years in the Air Force there was a three year period when I maintained commercial aircraft electronics while between scientific jobs. So I don't give a damn if you think that as a mechanic you know something about it.

Aren't you the one that told me that Arpanet wasn't the Internet? And that IP wasn't IP?
23-08-2017 00:06
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


This is old but been busy and just now getting back to it...
ITN...most nights here with calm wind takes 1/2 the night or more for temp drop of 10-15F. You say temps drop 10-15F in just minutes during eclipse. REALLY need an explanation on this. ....please. Remember, you said dew points/ humidity don't matter.

Here's last night for example.


As I said, if you play with pigs all you get is muddy. When talking to an idiot don't expect to hear anything but pure ignorance.


It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.


Well your lying BS ain't getting you anywhere.

Apparently you missed it completely. He is providing no difference of temperatures, only the evening temperatures. He is also failing to take into account the weather.
Wake wrote:
If it takes 5 hours of night for the temperature to drop 20 degrees

It doesn't.
Wake wrote:
you aren't going to convince anyone that it dropped that much when total eclipse is only seconds long and near full coverage on 3 minutes or so.

The solar eclipse cycle takes about two and a half hours to run. From first contact to totality takes about an hour and 15 minutes (assuming something near the 45th parallel. The cycle is slightly longer at the equator and slightly shorter at the poles. The temperature drop is over an hour, although several degrees will be lost when totality itself arrives.

Wake wrote:
The rest of the eclipse gives little more coverage of the sun than partial cloud cover would. And that doesn't drop the temperature remarkably.

It sounds like you haven't experienced a total eclipse. I have.
Wake wrote:
Tell us more about how you're a commercial pilot.

I'm not. I never claimed I was.

For what it's worth to you (credentials really mean nothing on forums anyway, but you seem fascinated by them) I hold a private pilot instrument land rating, a mechanics rating, a complex endorsement, a high power endorsement, a weight shift endorsement, a tailwheel endorsement, and a type certifications for 707, 727, 737, 757, 767 and Jetstar aircraft. That is usually used to test them I don't do much testing on Jetstars anymore.


I also hold a Amateur license, a General Radiotelegraph operators license with a radar endorsement, a class C pyrotechnician's license.
Wake wrote:
You have as much chance of convincing anyone of that as that the temperature dropped 20 degrees in a couple of minutes.

About five degree in a couple of minutes. 10 to 15 degrees during the eclipse cycle, if you are in the path of totality (less, if you are only in a partial eclipse area, especially if you see more than 70% coverage).


The Parrot Killer
23-08-2017 00:37
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITM wrote;
It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.

Not intentionally holding any info..

I guessed that. You don't make a habit of intentionally hiding information like a lot of people here do.
GasGuzzler wrote:
what do you say is important and missing?

Daytime temperatures, to show a temperature difference, and nearby weather as well as the weather at the site.
GasGuzzler wrote:
If you say it dropped 17 degrees during the eclipse, fine. I just want to know what is so different about the sun disappearing behind the horizon from the sun disappearing behind the moon.

The speed of power loss. Passing through the terminator (evening to sunset to night) takes a lot longer than the speed of the moon's shadow during an eclipse.

In the path of totality, it becomes dimmer and dimmer (like the Sun going behind a thick cloud, but with well define shadows still visible and the same white-yellow color, not gray tinged, until the shadow itself arrives. Then it's like turning off the lights. Some stars are visible, it is nighttime, but with a 'sunset' looking sky all around you, and a weird looking thing in the sky in place of the Moon.

Coming out of eclipse, you will see a shimmer like a white diamond lit from behind glittering, then the light comes back just as if someone turned on a dimmer switch. The temperature immediate rises a few degrees, and continues to rise as the eclipse wanes.

Even in partial areas, people notice the temperature drop as the eclipse passes.
GasGuzzler wrote:
I cant seem to find that kind of diurnal drop in temp on an other normal evening in the US.

It takes longer to move through the day/night terminator than it does for an eclipse shadow to arrive.
GasGuzzler wrote:
I'd also like to know your eclipse viewing location to look at the conditions record.

Madras, OR. There is an ASOS at that airport, but it's numbers are reported to the flight weather service only every fifteen minutes. It does not report to NOAA and has no internal log of readings (only of time in service). The nearest NOAA weather forecasting station is in Pendleton, OR. The nearest NOAA instrumentation is located in Prineville, OR., which was in the totality path (although more briefly than Madras).

It might be easier to find stuff for Salem, OR., located on the wet side of the mountains. It is closer to major cities. Portland and Seattle also experience a temperature drop, although not as pronounced as in the path of totality.


The Parrot Killer
23-08-2017 00:37
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITM wrote;
It is obvious you didn't notice something very important missing from his numbers.

Not intentionally holding any info...what do you say is important and missing?
If you say it dropped 17 degrees during the eclipse, fine. I just want to know what is so different about the sun disappearing behind the horizon from the sun disappearing behind the moon. I cant seem to find that kind of diurnal drop in temp on an other normal evening in the US. I'd also like to know your eclipse viewing location to look at the conditions record.


Don't argue with someone that really knows about flying - that makes him really smart.


Heh. You think us piluts R smart, huh?


The Parrot Killer
23-08-2017 00:50
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
The systems are privately owned, dumbass. They were developed by these agencies, they do not own them or operate them.


And yet another statement that everyone should take your word for. But I just showed you the reference for who owns and operates them.

And your reference was ..... where again?


No, you didn't. You showed an FAA page describing what airports have what equipment.

The airports own and operate that equipment, just like they own and maintain their runways, lighting systems, webcams, and even the toilet in the pilot lounge.


In other words you have no references and want everyone to believe you so badly you'll cry if we don't.


I'm a pilot, mechanic, and have been for most of my life dumbass.

Airports buy these things, coordinate the installation of them, and operate and maintain them. The FAA's only role is to make sure it works when they are done installing it. These devices are manufactured by private companies (not the FAA or any other government agency) and installed according to FAA regulations. The National Weather Service operates the network for these things. The FCC verifies the radio portion is legit. The FAA verifies the instruments are accurate enough (they check it from time to time), and that the system is out of the way of aircraft (meaning not near the end of a runway, among other things).

Just like aircraft. Designed and built by private companies (or individuals like me), then certified by the FAA, and flown by FAA certified pilots (like me).

The taxiway and runway lights, the approach lights, the ramp lighting, the runways, the taxiways, are built and/or installed and maintained by the airport.


That makes no difference dumbass

I already told you that dumbass. Pay attention.
Wake wrote:
- while the airports are usually constructed and owned by local or state governments virtually all airport proper personnel are FAA employees.

Nope. Outside of a few ATC operators, airport personnel are privately hired (by the vendors and airlines) TSA (part of the Dept of Homeland Security, not the FAA), and the city or county workers that clean and maintain the terminal, the runway and taxi surfaces, the grass, the lighting, and pretty much anything else like that.
Wake wrote:
That was how Reagan could fire 10,000 striking air controllers in one fell swoop when their strike closed down the entire commercial air industry.

ATC personnel are a VERY small percentage of the people that work at an airport. Most airports have no ATC on site at all. There is no control tower. The only thing the ATC folks at SeaTac airport do is ground control and local airspace control (what is immediately around the airport itself). They do not handle departure, arrival, or en route traffic. The City of Renton also has a tower, but that one is not owned or operated by the FAA. He's just FAA certified (like a pilot).

Wake wrote:
After four years in the Air Force there was a three year period when I maintained commercial aircraft electronics while between scientific jobs. So I don't give a damn if you think that as a mechanic you know something about it.

I don't believe you. You know too little about aircraft or electronics. There is also no such thing as a 'scientific' job.
Wake wrote:
Aren't you the one that told me that Arpanet wasn't the Internet? And that IP wasn't IP?

You want to go down misinterpreting that bit of confusion again?


The Parrot Killer
23-08-2017 01:38
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote: The usual nonsense


The AIRLINES CAN HIRE WHOMEVER THEY WANT. THEY DO NOT OPERATE THE AIRPORT.
23-08-2017 02:55
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote: The usual nonsense


The AIRLINES CAN HIRE WHOMEVER THEY WANT. THEY DO NOT OPERATE THE AIRPORT.


They are part what operates an airport. Who do you think those baggage handler guys down there on the tarmac work for? NONE of the gates could even accept an airplane without airline employees operating it and the related services around it.

Who do you think operates the fuel truck? Not the airline. Not the city. Those are private companies (another vendor).

Who do you think repairs the aircraft? Not always the airlines. Private vendors like Goodrich hire those mechanics.

An airline mechanic may do some quick fix like change a tire or unstop the toilet before departure (you have to a certified mechanic to unstop a toilet on an airplane! You have to STUDY for it!).

Who do you think operates the pond? The city or county.

Who do you think changes the light bulbs on a runway light? The city or county.

Who runs those food and bookstores in the terminals? Private vendors.

Who fixes the escalators and elevators when they break? Who inspects them? A private company.

Who waxes the floors, cleans the windows, and hands the key to the control tower to the ATC folks? The city or county.

Who cleans the snow and ice off the runway in winter? The city or county. Who runs the deicing stations? A private vendor.

NONE of these folks are employed by the FAA.

Who runs the TSA? The Dept of Homeland Security, NOT the FAA.

Who investigates an airplane crash? The National Transportation Safety Board (the same department that investigates train crashes).

Do you have any idea how many people it takes to run a modern commercial airport??

Let's take a smaller example, a general aviation airport (most airports).

No ATC. No control tower. No FAA employees at all.

Same sort that cut the grass, clean and maintain the runways and taxiways (and build them), the city or county (or often a private developer).

Who builds the hangars? Private developers. The only involvement of the city or county is to lease the land to them.

Who installs the ramp lighting, paints the runway markings, builds and maintains the fence and gates? The city or county (or private owner if the airport is privately owned).

Who maintains the beacon light? At our airport, it's the local policeman! He likes climbing towers for the exercise.

I have personally climbed up a tower to replace a navigation light myself. They use 107.5 watt clear bulbs, as required by FAA regulations (morons). That tower was a radio tower for a small radio station and was 100 ft high. I was going up to clean and repack the antenna connectors anyway, but the burned out bulb forced me to do earlier than planned.

Of course, an airplane flying that low would probably hit the tree next to the tower, but regulations are regulations.

BTW, an airline cannot hire whomever they want. Pilots, mechanics, and stewardesses all have to be FAA certified. The baggage handling crew (including the guy flagging the airplane into the gate, the gate operator, and the pushcart driver all have to undergo a security clearance check by the department of Homeland Security. (Oddly enough, pilots, mechanics, and stewardesses don't!)


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 23-08-2017 02:59
23-08-2017 06:46
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1325)
ITN wrote;
I was at the total eclipse. Where I was at, the thermometer went from 93 to 76. Some people put sweaters on.


ITN....is 93F a typo? Seems pretty hot for mid morning in Oregon. Want to check out the numbers but want to start accurately.
23-08-2017 17:03
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote: The usual nonsense


The AIRLINES CAN HIRE WHOMEVER THEY WANT. THEY DO NOT OPERATE THE AIRPORT.


They are part what operates an airport. Who do you think those baggage handler guys down there on the tarmac work for? NONE of the gates could even accept an airplane without airline employees operating it and the related services around it.

Who do you think operates the fuel truck? Not the airline. Not the city. Those are private companies (another vendor).

Who do you think repairs the aircraft? Not always the airlines. Private vendors like Goodrich hire those mechanics.

An airline mechanic may do some quick fix like change a tire or unstop the toilet before departure (you have to a certified mechanic to unstop a toilet on an airplane! You have to STUDY for it!).

Who do you think operates the pond? The city or county.

Who do you think changes the light bulbs on a runway light? The city or county.

Who runs those food and bookstores in the terminals? Private vendors.

Who fixes the escalators and elevators when they break? Who inspects them? A private company.

Who waxes the floors, cleans the windows, and hands the key to the control tower to the ATC folks? The city or county.

Who cleans the snow and ice off the runway in winter? The city or county. Who runs the deicing stations? A private vendor.

NONE of these folks are employed by the FAA.

Who runs the TSA? The Dept of Homeland Security, NOT the FAA.

Who investigates an airplane crash? The National Transportation Safety Board (the same department that investigates train crashes).

Do you have any idea how many people it takes to run a modern commercial airport??

Let's take a smaller example, a general aviation airport (most airports).

No ATC. No control tower. No FAA employees at all.

Same sort that cut the grass, clean and maintain the runways and taxiways (and build them), the city or county (or often a private developer).

Who builds the hangars? Private developers. The only involvement of the city or county is to lease the land to them.

Who installs the ramp lighting, paints the runway markings, builds and maintains the fence and gates? The city or county (or private owner if the airport is privately owned).

Who maintains the beacon light? At our airport, it's the local policeman! He likes climbing towers for the exercise.

I have personally climbed up a tower to replace a navigation light myself. They use 107.5 watt clear bulbs, as required by FAA regulations (morons). That tower was a radio tower for a small radio station and was 100 ft high. I was going up to clean and repack the antenna connectors anyway, but the burned out bulb forced me to do earlier than planned.

Of course, an airplane flying that low would probably hit the tree next to the tower, but regulations are regulations.

BTW, an airline cannot hire whomever they want. Pilots, mechanics, and stewardesses all have to be FAA certified. The baggage handling crew (including the guy flagging the airplane into the gate, the gate operator, and the pushcart driver all have to undergo a security clearance check by the department of Homeland Security. (Oddly enough, pilots, mechanics, and stewardesses don't!)


There you have it - without a vending machine repairman an airport couldn't operate. Thanks for your lessons in knowledge.
23-08-2017 21:20
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


15 minute resolution isn't good enough. The totality lasts only a couple of minutes along the centerline. Less the further away from the centerline you get.


Hey stupid - you said that the temperature cooled by 20 degrees in an eclipse.

Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun.
Wake wrote:
The total eclipse only lasts 8 seconds

WRONG. Totality lasts somewhat over 2 minutes (if you are near the centerline of the eclipse).
Wake wrote:
but the major eclipse lasts 4 hours.

WRONG. The partial phases are over and done with in a bit over 2 hours.
Wake wrote:
Unless you changing your mind and now telling us that the air reheats instantly after a total eclipse.

Warmth returns pretty fast. Maybe you should go experience it for yourself instead of making up arguments from randU.


I realize that what you are doing is reading from a website somewhere in order to try to show yourself as knowledgable and smart. But the speed of the movement of the Moon's shadow for this eclipse was 2340 mph. That means that in 8 seconds it moved over 150 miles. Depending on the location the shadow of the moon is between 200 and 500 miles wide.

That means that the shadow can move through the absolute eclipse in that 8 seconds. But be sure and tell us that the math is wrong.
Edited on 23-08-2017 21:26
24-08-2017 01:16
Surface Detail
★★★★☆
(1673)
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN wrote;.
Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun


Oh, I misread that. 10-15 degree drop in 2 minutes you say? In that case I'll bet you the entire Iowa corn fed cow!

No way the temps drop 10 degrees, with 65+ dewpoints and clear skies.

Bit late to the party, but the solar eclipse is indeed an excellent illustration of the greenhouse properties of clouds and water vapour. On a clear day with low humidity, the temperature can indeed drop very sharply during an eclipse. This is because most of the IR radiated by the ground goes straight up and into space. On a humid or cloudy day, the temperature drop is much less. This is because some of the IR radiated by the ground is absorbed and then re-radiated by water molecules, so some of it comes back to the ground, thus keeping the ground warmer.
24-08-2017 01:31
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8694)
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Wake wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
ITN Wrote;
If you going to see the eclipse, you are probably going to try to find an area of clear skies. That means the spread between the temperature and the diewpoint are going to be significant. It won't be a factor.

Similar temperature drops and their rate are the same no matter what the humidity is.


I'd be willing to bet an Iowa corn fed 16 oz ribeye that you're wrong on this. No need to argue about it today, looks like we'll have a perfect opportunity to see the proof on Monday. I'll start looking for reporting stations in totality that update every 15 minutes.


15 minute resolution isn't good enough. The totality lasts only a couple of minutes along the centerline. Less the further away from the centerline you get.


Hey stupid - you said that the temperature cooled by 20 degrees in an eclipse.

Nope. I said the temperature drops by 10-15 deg F during totality of an eclipse of the Sun.
Wake wrote:
The total eclipse only lasts 8 seconds

WRONG. Totality lasts somewhat over 2 minutes (if you are near the centerline of the eclipse).
Wake wrote:
but the major eclipse lasts 4 hours.

WRONG. The partial phases are over and done with in a bit over 2 hours.
Wake wrote:
Unless you changing your mind and now telling us that the air reheats instantly after a total eclipse.

Warmth returns pretty fast. Maybe you should go experience it for yourself instead of making up arguments from randU.


I realize that what you are doing is reading from a website somewhere in order to try to show yourself as knowledgable and smart. But the speed of the movement of the Moon's shadow for this eclipse was 2340 mph. That means that in 8 seconds it moved over 150 miles. Depending on the location the shadow of the moon is between 200 and 500 miles wide.

That means that the shadow can move through the absolute eclipse in that 8 seconds. But be sure and tell us that the math is wrong.


The speed of the Moon's shadow varies depend on your latitude.

In Oregon, where I was, that speed was approx. 2400mph.
In South Carolina, that speed was reduced to approx. 1500mph.

The period of totality also varies with latitude. It is longer in the lower latitudes and shorter at the poles.

The widest point of the umbra was 115 mi in diameter. Where I saw it that was only about 60mi in diameter. The penumbra (the partial eclipse area) was almost 10000 mi wide.

Duration of totality at my location was 2min and 8 seconds. Folks further east got to see a longer totality.

At my location the temperature drop was about 17 deg F, as measured by a thermometer in the campsite a couple down from mine.


The Parrot Killer
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