The Complexity of Climate Change

keepit wrote:
IM a BM,
I don't think printing money increases the national debt. I know that dollar bills used say they were a promise to pay but they don't say that any more i don't think. They say "note" but what does that mean that the govt has to pay?

Im a BM wrote: Correct. It was not considered as adding $6T to the national debt when the Treasury printed an extra $6T to keep the economy afloat under Pres. Bush.

Im a BM wrote: If you read the text carefully, you will see that treasury "notes" are meant to be exchanged for "lawful money". They are not considered "lawful money" in their own right.

Im a BM wrote:
It is not clear to me that there is any kind of "debt crisis" of immediate enough concern to warrant "desperate measures".

keepit wrote: ibd, Your post is inaccurate. The national debt took off while reagan was president,

keepit wrote: and again while Bush was president,

keepit wrote: Clinton got the budget deficit under control

keepit wrote: and so did obama.

keepit wrote: Also, the dollar bill says that it is legal tender and that it is a note.

keepit wrote: That means that a creditor must accept it as payment of a debt. I really don't know the practical meaning or function of the word (note) here.

keepit wrote: Money is just a convenience for exchanging goods and services.

keepit wrote: Regardless of how valuable it is, it is legitimate for paying debts.

keepit wrote: The dollar has great credibility in the world.

keepit wrote: It's the interest on the debt that is the problem since it is compounding.

keepit wrote: I wouldn't blame the democratic congress for bushes debt.

keepit wrote: He ordered the war and then congress had to pay for it.

keepit wrote:
Gas,
The problem may come home to roost some day. However, many economists are saying that as long as the debt stays close to 120% of gdp then it can go on like it is.
A household budget is different than a federal budget in that the govt can print money and the household can't.

keepit wrote: [ibd] You always resort to semantics when you have nothing else.

keepit wrote:
ibd,
Your post is inaccurate.

keepit wrote:
The national debt took off while reagan was president, and again while Bush was president, and then lately. Clinton got the budget deficit under control and so did obama.

keepit wrote:
Also, the dollar bill says that it is legal tender and that it is a note.

keepit wrote:
That means that a creditor must accept it as payment of a debt. I really don't know the practical meaning or function of the word (note) here.

keepit wrote:
Money is just a convenience for exchanging goods and services.

keepit wrote:
Regardless of how valuable it is, it is legitimate for paying debts.

keepit wrote:
The dollar has great credibility in the world.

keepit wrote:
You know about credibility ibd.

keepit wrote:
It's the interest on the debt that is the problem since it is compounding.

keepit wrote:
I wouldn't blame the democratic congress for bushes debt.

keepit wrote:
He ordered the war and then congress had to pay for it.

GasGuzzler wrote:

Im a BM wrote:
It is not clear to me that there is any kind of "debt crisis" of immediate enough concern to warrant "desperate measures".

Do you have children, Robert? What would you advise your kid to do if if he earned a yearly salary of 100k and spent every dime of it, every year AND put another 38,000 on the credit card? Then the kid claims there's nothing wrong and vows to do it again next year and again and again and again.
But then one day his credit card doesn't work anymore and he wants to borrow 38k from you.

Would you lend him your money? Hell no. Does ANYONE run a household budget this way without a huge crash and burn at some point? Hell no. Why should our federal government be any different?

keepit wrote:
Gas,
The problem may come home to roost some day. However, many economists are saying that as long as the debt stays close to 120% of gdp then it can go on like it is.
A household budget is different than a federal budget in that the govt can print money and the household can't.

keepit wrote:
im a bm,
Re: lawful money.
If the dollars aren't lawful money, what is?

keepit wrote:
ibd ,
false.
You always resort to semantics when you have nothing else.

keepit wrote:
itn,
Re: your statement regarding the iraq war. Another semantic dispute here - the iraq war was not declared by congress. Bush ordered it (whatever you want to call it). I was there and it seemed like a war Then the congress authorized the money and the national debt grew.

Re: inflation and wealth. There's a lot of wealth being created. It's hard to keep account of it. For example intellectual property. Also, the value of computer improvements and their value in the future. In other words there are things that are created that have deflationary effects.

keepit wrote: I should have said i was talking about the first iraq war which was initiated by Bush and then approved by congress.

keepit wrote: You say the govt can't print its way out of problems butt the govt has been printing its way out of problems for decades.

keepit wrote: The average rate of inflation has been very low.

keepit wrote: The economy needs a certain amount of inflation,

keepit wrote: ... although not the rate of the last 10 or 20 months.

keepit wrote: You say "the current depression".

keepit wrote: I don't think there's a current depression.

keepit wrote: The economy is fine

keepit wrote: ... and we're recovering from the recent spurt of inflation.

keepit wrote: I didn't equate the debt to inflation.

keepit wrote:
ibd,
Sorry you misunderstood me when i said "the first irag war under george hw bush.
I didn't know about any other war with irag that involved the us.

I guess you misunderstand who is was talking to. It's too laborious talking to you.

keepit wrote:
I should have said i was talking about the first iraq war which was initiated by Bush and then approved by congress.

keepit wrote:
The money was taken out of the defense budget. Google it.

keepit wrote:
You say the govt can't print its way out of problems

keepit wrote:
butt the govt has been printing its way out of problems for decades.

keepit wrote:
The average rate of inflation has been very low.

keepit wrote:
The economy needs a certain amount of inflation, although not the rate of the last 10 or 20 months.

keepit wrote:
You say "the current depression". I don't think there's a current depression.

keepit wrote:
The economy is fine

keepit wrote:
and we're recovering from the recent spurt of inflation.

keepit wrote:
It's a great country, just a few superficial problems.

keepit wrote:
I didn't equate the debt to inflation.

keepit wrote:
You're just arguing against your own "filaments". Quit it.

keepit wrote:
Stop nagging.
It was supply chain problems as much as the treasury giving out money. The money helped avoid starvation for poor children. Blame the supply chain, not the treasury.
Blame the covid virus, not fauci (the messenger).

keepit wrote:
ibd,
Sorry you misunderstood me when i said "the first irag war under george hw bush.
I didn't know about any other war with irag that involved the us.

I guess you misunderstand who is was talking to. It's too laborious talking to you.

keepit wrote:
itn,
noone is blaming any one for their own problems, at least not me..

keepit wrote:
Don't let your filaments act up too much.

keepit wrote:
I use google for much of my information.

keepit wrote:
What or who do you use?

Im a BM wrote:

keepit wrote:
ibd,
Sorry you misunderstood me when i said "the first irag war under george hw bush.
I didn't know about any other war with irag that involved the us.

I guess you misunderstand who is was talking to. It's too laborious talking to you.

What's in a name?

A war is a war.

No, a war by any other name is not so hard to sell.

It is not a "war" in Ukraine. It is a "special military operation".

It was not a "war" in Korea. It was a "police action".

All those bombs dropping on Iraq were not a "war", because Congress didn't officially declare it to be one.

He who controls the definition of words rules the world.

And ALWAYS wins the "debate".

I remember vividly the 1980 campaign. Reagan kept harping about the evils of federal deficits. What Carter was doing was going to destroy the economy.

Even as president, while he signed budgets that literally QUADRUPLED the federal deficit (compared to when Carter left office), he paid lip service to an amendment to the Constitution to outlaw deficit spending.

"What I am doing ought to be illegal" was his message.

Maybe he should have just played with semantics.

Hey, this isn't really a WAR.

keepit wrote: Stop nagging.

keepit wrote: It was supply chain problems as much as the treasury giving out money.

keepit wrote: The money helped avoid starvation for poor children.

keepit wrote: Blame the supply chain, not the treasury.

keepit wrote: Blame the covid virus, not fauci (the messenger).

IBdaMann wrote:

keepit wrote: Stop nagging.

Learn what words mean.

keepit wrote: It was supply chain problems as much as the treasury giving out money.

You're full of baloney, keepit.

keepit wrote: The money helped avoid starvation for poor children.

What money is "The Money"?

keepit wrote: Blame the supply chain, not the treasury.

Blame the people who were responsible for seeing to it you received an education; don't blame the supply chain.

keepit wrote: Blame the covid virus, not fauci (the messenger).

Blame your parents, not some virus.

Im a BM wrote: You have gone for days in a row without calling ANYONE a "moron". Are you okay?

IBdaMann wrote:

Im a BM wrote: You have gone for days in a row without calling ANYONE a "moron". Are you okay?

You have been focused more on spamming than on preaching physics violations so the word "moron" hasn't been required to the same extent.

keepit wrote: itn, Look at the dollar index. It's gone up the last couple of years or so. What do you use to gauge the value of the dollar.

sealover wrote:You called keepit a "gullible moron" just YESTERDAY.

keepit wrote:
itn,
Look at the dollar index. It's gone up the last couple of years or so. What do you use to gauge the value of the dollar.

keepit wrote:
no no no itn. You're talking about inflation.

keepit wrote:
Don't forget wages are going up as well.

keepit wrote:
What you're forgetting is the relative value of the dollar compared to the other currencies of the world.