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13-01-2021 01:41
Spongy Iris
★★★☆☆
(480)
IBdaMann wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote: Dude I'm not interested in having a spelling bee with you about how charts are drawn.

A spelling bee? ... about how charts are drawn?

What a moron. So I was mistaken in assuming that you are even rudimentarily computer-literate.

I understand why you such a grand repository of stupid ideas.

Spongy Iris wrote: NASA estimates the uncertainty ...

No they don't, and you don't speak for them.

NASA manages projects that put things into orbit or into space. Global Warming is not in their purview. In fact, no religion is in their purview. They aren't trying to establish the certainty of Salvation either.

... but let's just keep it simple and focus on how no organization would retain you to be a spokesperson.

Spongy Iris wrote: And I am pretty sure NASA really has ZERO interest in proving global warming.

Your track record is pretty dismal. You tend to be certain of things that are absolutely FALSE, pretty much across the board.

This is another excellent example of your confusion. NASA is a government agency and apparently you didn't know this. NASA is therefore headed by a political appointee and I see that you didn't know this either. The current NASA chief is a warmizombie who unfortunately imposes his religious views onto the organization, just as you clearly would were you the NASA chief. As you intimately know, warmizombies such as yourself are completely intolerant to opposing views, feel compelled to impose WACKY religious views onto others and fear both science and math.

.


Do have a look at the chart I just messaged Duncan.

"Green bars show estimates of the uncertainty in the measurements."

https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.

As for the rest of your comment, your Pal The Parrot calls that Bulverism fallacy.



Edited on 13-01-2021 01:45
13-01-2021 01:58
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
duncan61 wrote: I would like to know what the global average is and what it should be? what do the charts say?


The ONLY people who speak in terms of "what the global average temperature should be" are scientifically illiterate morons who ascribe miraculous supernatural physics-defying superpowers to CO2, and speak as though the earth "would be" a frozen ball of ice" were it not for CO2's magical superpowers cradling the earth in loving warmth that it miraculously generates from nothing.

Duncan, if you recall basic English lessons in tense and mood, what you were doing is referred to as speaking in the subjunctive, i.e. it is specifically an imaginary condition/case.

There is no subjunctive in science.

You have to ask either:

1) What is the earth's average global teperature [present tense], or

2) What will the earth's average global temperature be if [insert some condition that is specifically not the case, e.g. the earth were 40 million km closer to the sun]. This is the conditional and science predicts nature in this way.

Because nature operates as nature operates, the earth is exactly the temperature it should be, and always has been, otherwise it would be defying physics.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 02:08
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
Spongy Iris wrote: [link deleted]


You keep getting ahead of yourself.

First: What are you claiming is the earth's current average global temperature?

Second: What are you claiming is the margin of error?

Third: What is the data that was used to calculate this value to within this margin of error?

Stay focused.

Is there a reason you REFUSE to be honest?


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 02:36
Spongy Iris
★★★☆☆
(480)
IBdaMann wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote: [link deleted]


You keep getting ahead of yourself.

First: What are you claiming is the earth's current average global temperature?

Second: What are you claiming is the margin of error?

Third: What is the data that was used to calculate this value to within this margin of error?

Stay focused.

Is there a reason you REFUSE to be honest?


.


I am not using my own records of global temperature data!

NASA's chart was just provided to answer your questions.



Edited on 13-01-2021 02:36
13-01-2021 03:56
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
Spongy Iris wrote: I am not using my own records of global temperature data!

You are the one who believes in Global Warming.
You are the one who is therefore preaching Global Warming.

What data convinced you, or were you a totally gullible moron who was tricked into joining a cult by being told that a graphic was data?

Spongy Iris wrote:NASA's chart was just provided to answer your questions.

My question cannot be answered with a graphic. My question requires data, perhaps the data used to make your graphic.

You have not answered any of my questions, and you specifically EVADE the question of your claim of the earth's average global temperature or the margin of error thereof. You are intentionally being dishonest, probably as an attempt to disguise the fact that you were a gullible moron who got suckered.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 04:53
Spongy Iris
★★★☆☆
(480)
IBdaMann wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote: I am not using my own records of global temperature data!

You are the one who believes in Global Warming.
You are the one who is therefore preaching Global Warming.

What data convinced you, or were you a totally gullible moron who was tricked into joining a cult by being told that a graphic was data?

Spongy Iris wrote:NASA's chart was just provided to answer your questions.

My question cannot be answered with a graphic. My question requires data, perhaps the data used to make your graphic.

You have not answered any of my questions, and you specifically EVADE the question of your claim of the earth's average global temperature or the margin of error thereof. You are intentionally being dishonest, probably as an attempt to disguise the fact that you were a gullible moron who got suckered.

.


I don't need to reinvent the wheel.

The graphic was generated from data.

Your questions were answered.


13-01-2021 05:04
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
Spongy's fervent fundamentalist religious beliefs have sure turned this discussion into a shit show... I'm still quite entertained though, so keep it up Spongy!
13-01-2021 05:14
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
Spongy Iris wrote: I don't need to reinvent the wheel.

Irrelevant, random saying.

Spongy Iris wrote:The graphic was generated from data.

Finally you acknowledge that the graphic was generated from data instead of the graphc BEING the data.

So now provide the data that was used to make the graphic. It's the only way to show that the person who generated the graphic didn't get it totally wrong. Until then the operating assumption, whenever the data is not provided, is that the graphic is fraudulent misinformation and that the creator is lying.

Spongy Iris wrote:Your questions were answered.

No questions were answered and no data has ever been provided.

Therefore the graphic is dismissed as "bogus" until receipt of the supporting data.


You are one sad gullible dupe of a moron.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 05:19
duncan61
★★★☆☆
(919)
IBDM before you went in to another rant did you not stop to consider I was posing a question as all I every hear or see is:ITS WARMING:.But not one person on this forum has ever said from what origional temperature.Spongy I hope the bad guys do not push you of the forum as has been done to so many before you.I have a question why does your chart stop at 2000.Is the data not available for the last 20 years.Its not shown as it will show a leveling or decline which is why Hudson bay has frozen solid for the last 3 years.East Anglia keeps very good records of all the temperature readings across britain and there are thousands and all linked together to a super computer that can get an average every second however that is just britain not the whole globe.I will share the NASA situation.There is a team dedicated to getting government grants for projects.Scenario 1 Its all good the planets not warming we are all going to live forever can we have 3 billion dollars for climate research.Scenario 2 the planets warming out of control we are all going to die we have to colonise other nice planets can we have 3 billion dollars.Think about it
13-01-2021 06:13
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
duncan61 wrote: IBDM before you went in to another rant did you not stop to consider

Duncan, did you not stop to consider just how helpful it would be if you would quote the text in question to which you are responding?

I can't answer a question when I don't know what it's about.

duncan61 wrote: I was posing a question as all I every hear or see is:ITS WARMING:.But not one person on this forum has ever said from what origional temperature.

Duncan, go back and re-read my explanation and let me know what parts you don't understand. If you understand it all then your question is stupid because you understand what I wrote. If there is some part you don't understand then ask specifically about that. I'm happy to answer any and all of your questions if you will cut to the chase and just ask your question clearly.

If you are talking about my treatise on the subjunctive, you can go back to whomever told you that the earth "should" be some other temperature than it is and call him a fuuking moron because the earth is exactly the temperature it should be.

If you are looking for someone on this site to tell you what the earth's temperature "should" be then you are being naive. Nobody knows the earth's emissivity so the earth's theoretical average temperature cannot be calculated by anyone ... so nobody on this planet knows. This effectively precludes anyone on this site from knowing what the earth's temperature "should be."

Also, as has been mentioned many times, no one/group is able to measure the earth's current average global temperature to within any usable margin of error because the earth does not have a grid of many hundreds of millions of calibrated, evenly-spaced and synchronized thermometers at every kilometer of altitude starting with "ground level" and every kilometer of depth beginning at sea-level. We just don't have it so we just can't measure it ... to any usable accuracy. This therefore precludes anyone on this site from being able to answer your question.

duncan61 wrote: Spongy I hope the bad guys do not push you of the forum as has been done to so many before you.

You certainly like to blame the victim, don't you? Should women get stiff fines and lengthy jail sentences for being raped?

The people that leave this site are dishonest warmizombies (I know, redundant) who came here to preach their religion and gave up trying to convert others ... so they moved on to other sites to preach there. How is that somehow my fault? Why am I a bad guy for not being gullible, as say you have been? Is there a certain gullibility quotient required to be a "good guy"? How much science and mathematics must one deny in order to be a "good guy"?

But seriously, how much jail time should a woman get for being raped? Are you thinking a five-year minimum? What's your ballpark figure?

duncan61 wrote: I have a question why does your chart stop at 2000.Is the data not available for the last 20 years.Its not shown as it will show a leveling or decline which is why Hudson bay has frozen solid for the last 3 years.

Duncan, you are inviting ridicule. Surely you must have picked up by now that Spongy Iris has no data. He was targetted by warmizombies because he's so brain-dead that he must have vowed absolute obedience if only they would do all his thinking for him. He is absolutely pathetic and he doesn't know anything, much less any science, math, logic or have any cognitive skills that would allow him to do any critical reasoning.

He was handed a graphic that was thrown together in somebody's mother's basement by someone munching Pringles and slamming Mtn Dew and was ordered to believe that it is "The Data." Of course Spongy Iris didn't question anything. Instead, he made a bee-line to this site to preach the good word of Global Warming and to show us all the clear and irrefutable "evidence."

There is no hope for Spongy Iris ... but you still have time to save yourself.

duncan61 wrote: East Anglia keeps very good records of all the temperature readings across britain and there are thousands and all linked together to a super computer that can get an average every second

Really? I claim that this is just a myth, like Bigfoot, UFOs, Loch Ness monster, space aliens and rapidly vanishing Greenland ice that will be gone eight years ago and it's rate of disappearance is still accelerating!

The Met Office uses the same weather forecasting sources as the US and the East Anglia supercomputer Climate model is a fairy tale.

duncan61 wrote: I will share the NASA situation.There is a team dedicated to getting government grants for projects.Scenario 1 Its all good the planets not warming we are all going to live forever can we have 3 billion dollars for climate research.Scenario 2 the planets warming out of control we are all going to die we have to colonise other nice planets can we have 3 billion dollars.Think about it

This does not apply to Climate Change. In this case, it is a political agenda of our leaders and will become a top-down mandate. Congress will simply pad the budgets of EVERY government agency with "Climate Change" funding and then will tally it all up for a grand total that we need to borrow from China and then spend like drunken sailors on shore leave, doling it out to all Democrat-favored friends and families.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 06:17
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1967)
duncan61 wrote:
I have a question why does your chart stop at 2000.Is the data not available for the last 20 years


I've been lurking this thread from the beginning. I must say congrats to the "top 3 trolls" (who actually know their shit) for not completely losing it. However, If I see "data" used one more time like there actually is any, I'm going to bash my own head in.

Can I just say something real quick? Thanks.

YOU CANNOT MEASURE THE TEMPERATURE OF THE EARTH! UNTIL YOU CAN , THERE IS NO FUKING DATA!!!



Thank you. Appreciate your time.


Showing up with a gun at all is just weird and gross.--tmiddles
Edited on 13-01-2021 06:28
13-01-2021 06:40
GasGuzzlerProfile picture★★★★☆
(1967)
IBdaMann wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Why not net-zero peanut butter?


Don't even THINK about it.


Don't worry, my comment was in jest, of course, if perhaps in poor taste.

This is my drug of choice: Peanut Butter Chicken

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_JKUrGIyB4

.


Where do you find this shit??!! Skippy is a food group to me, but peanut butter chicken?

Oh HELL no!!



Showing up with a gun at all is just weird and gross.--tmiddles
13-01-2021 07:09
duncan61
★★★☆☆
(919)
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.
I went to this link and my interpetation is it has been conceded that it stopped warming and started cooling and no one can explain it except to say cooling is normal for warming.Wonder when it will start warming again
13-01-2021 07:23
Spongy Iris
★★★☆☆
(480)
duncan61 wrote:
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.
I went to this link and my interpetation is it has been conceded that it stopped warming and started cooling and no one can explain it except to say cooling is normal for warming.Wonder when it will start warming again


This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center



This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.



You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.



Edited on 13-01-2021 07:24
13-01-2021 07:29
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
duncan61 wrote:I went to this link ...

... which was your first mistake.

duncan61 wrote: ... and my interpetation is

... that when you read the very first line: "According to the vast majority of climate scientists, the planet is heating up" that you immediately realized that "According to the vast majority of Christians, God created everything and Jesus died so that we may live" as well as "According to the vast majority of Marxists, capitalism is the root of all evil" and also "According to the vast majority of rugby players, rugby is the best sport ev-AH" ...

... and you immediately realized that science, math, logic and reason would not be woven into any of the fabric of this article, right?

duncan61 wrote: Wonder when it will start warming again

By now you should be totally aware that all religions have prophesies that are sacrosanct and that do not come with time/date scheduling. You know that the Global Warming prophesy declares that the Great Warming will rise again, and will be heralded by a host of extreme weather forcings.

It's the dogma. You can pick apart any religious dogma for its seeming silliness.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 07:37
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center

There's no data. Look at it. It's a graphic. Yes it CLAIMS to be made from data but you are just a dupe.

Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.

NASA doesn't do this. NASA puts things into orbit. There is no NASA data from which Global Warming charts are made. All such charts/graphics are pure fabrications for the consumption of the gullible and the totally naive.

Spongy Iris wrote: You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

I realize this is what you have been told to believe but nobody has ever measured the earth's average global temperature to any usable accuracy, ever, so no one has ever been able to say if the earth's average global temperature is changing much less in what direction.

At this point you are simply broadcasting just how much of a dupe you are; your posts amount to nothing more than reciting what you have been ordered to regurgitate by the people who do your thinking for you.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 07:44
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
GasGuzzler wrote: Where do you find this shit??!! Skippy is a food group to me, but peanut butter chicken?

Oh HELL no!!

Au contraire mon frere, this may be what you think today, right now. Write it down so you never forget ... then prepare that recipe.

You'll be chirping an entirely different tune afterwards as you scramble to make another batch because you can't get enough.

Do I sound like maybe I was in your shoes when I first saw that video?

Have you ever become addicted to something? I'm just asking.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 08:06
Spongy Iris
★★★☆☆
(480)
IBdaMann wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center

There's no data. Look at it. It's a graphic. Yes it CLAIMS to be made from data but you are just a dupe.

Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.

NASA doesn't do this. NASA puts things into orbit. There is no NASA data from which Global Warming charts are made. All such charts/graphics are pure fabrications for the consumption of the gullible and the totally naive.

Spongy Iris wrote: You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

I realize this is what you have been told to believe but nobody has ever measured the earth's average global temperature to any usable accuracy, ever, so no one has ever been able to say if the earth's average global temperature is changing much less in what direction.

At this point you are simply broadcasting just how much of a dupe you are; your posts amount to nothing more than reciting what you have been ordered to regurgitate by the people who do your thinking for you.


.


"The Truth About Global Temperature Data"

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2016/01/thorough-not-thoroughly-fabricated-the-truth-about-global-temperature-data/%3famp=1


13-01-2021 08:51
duncan61
★★★☆☆
(919)
"The Truth About Global Temperature Data"

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2016/01/thorough-not-thoroughly-fabricated-the-truth-about-global-temperature-data/%3famp=1
Went here as well at least they admit they have to adjust the data.I am impressed senators are going.Hang on a minute what is this warming B.S.As always time will prove all.In 30 years when everything is still the same what will we worry about then.
13-01-2021 09:40
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(14592)
Spongy Iris wrote:
duncan61 wrote:
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.
I went to this link and my interpetation is it has been conceded that it stopped warming and started cooling and no one can explain it except to say cooling is normal for warming.Wonder when it will start warming again


This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center



This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.



You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

There is no data. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth.
Charts of random numbers are meaningless.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
13-01-2021 09:41
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(14592)
Spongy Iris wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center

There's no data. Look at it. It's a graphic. Yes it CLAIMS to be made from data but you are just a dupe.

Spongy Iris wrote: This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.

NASA doesn't do this. NASA puts things into orbit. There is no NASA data from which Global Warming charts are made. All such charts/graphics are pure fabrications for the consumption of the gullible and the totally naive.

Spongy Iris wrote: You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

I realize this is what you have been told to believe but nobody has ever measured the earth's average global temperature to any usable accuracy, ever, so no one has ever been able to say if the earth's average global temperature is changing much less in what direction.

At this point you are simply broadcasting just how much of a dupe you are; your posts amount to nothing more than reciting what you have been ordered to regurgitate by the people who do your thinking for you.


.


"The Truth About Global Temperature Data"

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2016/01/thorough-not-thoroughly-fabricated-the-truth-about-global-temperature-data/%3famp=1

There is no global temperature data. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth. Google is not God.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
13-01-2021 13:57
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
duncan61 wrote:.In 30 years when everything is still the same what will we worry about then.

Global Cooling again.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 16:13
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
duncan61 wrote:
"The Truth About Global Temperature Data"

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2016/01/thorough-not-thoroughly-fabricated-the-truth-about-global-temperature-data/%3famp=1
Went here as well at least they admit they have to adjust the data.I am impressed senators are going.Hang on a minute what is this warming B.S.As always time will prove all.In 30 years when everything is still the same what will we worry about then.



Umm, actually in 30 years the US could have some serious problems because something isn't a problem today. In Australia, things could still be pretty much the same.
What you're ignoring is what affects the weather in the northern hemisphere which is a non-issue in the southern hemisphere. It is possible for the US and Europe to keep warming while nothing will change in Australia.
BTW, with vineyards in England, just read the one section the link is to. It's 3 short paragraphs.
http://www.english-wine.com/history.html#domesday

Where it says it took place over several centuries, that would cover the Little Ice Age.
But as to your post and with IBDM and ITN, it's more about ranting against something.
13-01-2021 16:32
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
James___ wrote: Umm, actually in 30 years the US could have some serious problems because something isn't a problem today.

This is precisely the Global Warming fear-mongering template. It starts with a good, solid "doesn't mean," i.e. "Just because it isn't a problem today doesn't mean you aren't condemning all future generations to a slow, torturous death!"

Following sentences will generally include the words "threat," "accelerating," "tipping point," "concern," "alarming," "growing," and others without defining any of them.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
Edited on 13-01-2021 16:33
13-01-2021 17:18
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
IBdaMann wrote:
James___ wrote: Umm, actually in 30 years the US could have some serious problems because something isn't a problem today.

This is precisely the Global Warming fear-mongering template. It starts with a good, solid "doesn't mean," i.e. "Just because it isn't a problem today doesn't mean you aren't condemning all future generations to a slow, torturous death!"

Following sentences will generally include the words "threat," "accelerating," "tipping point," "concern," "alarming," "growing," and others without defining any of them.


.



And you went straight to an emotional argument based on something that you are unhappy about. Ergo, your response was a rant intended to make you the victim. It was about you and your feelings.
https://phys.org/news/2019-08-gulf-stream-seas-hotter-florida.html

If tectonic plate uplift is causing the AMOC to slow, that is one definition of climate change. Unfortunately this is of such a technical nature that between yourself and your friends, it's just not something you'd be capable of discussing.

An example is this information from NOAA and significant hurricanes they list. There is a cluster of significant hurricanes that ended in 2005.
https://www.nhc.noaa.gov/outreach/history/

Or this since 1950, this also agrees with NOAA.
https://ccimgs-2020.s3.amazonaws.com/2020HurricaneSLR/2020HurricaneSLR_Intensity_en_title_lg.jpg


All this might be showing is a surge in the amount of heat being released by the Gulf Stream. And I'm fairly certain that if after 2005 we looked at temperatures in Paris, France, Madrid, Spain, etc. that we would see the climate warming.
The graph does suggest that hurricane intensity in the US is decreasing. I just wonder if they've tracked the velocity of the flow of the Gulf Stream at different latitudes. If so, then it's slowest moving area would be where the most heat should be released from. This is if 1/2mv^2 = momentum whereas ma = force.
But as I mentioned, this is well beyond what you and your friends can discuss.



At the same time, this makes you and your friends like Christians. After all, Christian men have families, were horny and found someone they could have sex with. As Jesus said;
Matthew 6:34;
Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

And your post was in agreement with the teachings of Jesus. And do men like going to church because they were horny? That's a big NOPE!!!
Edited on 13-01-2021 17:48
13-01-2021 17:49
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
Spongy Iris wrote:
duncan61 wrote:
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.
I went to this link and my interpetation is it has been conceded that it stopped warming and started cooling and no one can explain it except to say cooling is normal for warming.Wonder when it will start warming again


This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center



This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.



You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

I'd like to ask the both of you one simple question (that I already know the answer to)...

Why do all of these charts (that warmizombies spread around in their efforts to convert unbelievers) label the y-axis as "temperature anomaly", "difference from average temperature", or similar language, rather than simply labeling the y-axis as "average global temperature"?
13-01-2021 18:24
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
Spongy Iris wrote:
duncan61 wrote:
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/upsDownsGlobalWarming.html#:~:text=Since%20around%20the%20time%20of,years%20--%20for%20two%20reasons.
I went to this link and my interpetation is it has been conceded that it stopped warming and started cooling and no one can explain it except to say cooling is normal for warming.Wonder when it will start warming again


This chart goes to 2019. Data from NOAA, NASA and UK Met Hadley Center



This chart goes to 2009. Is just NASA data.



You can see 2009 to 2019 is hotter than 1999 to 2009.

I'd also like to ask Spongy why, assuming that the random numbers on the chart are extremely accurate (they aren't, they are just made up bullshit), am I supposed to find a chart about the "difference from average temperature" from a particular 29 year time period (of which only accounts for 0.00000064% of Earth's existence, if one were to accept radiometric dating as True) to be meaningful in any way?

Maybe if we had the "extremely accurate" numbers from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence, and made a complete historical chart of those numbers, we might find that the increase during this particular 0.00000064% of Earth's existence is actually well within historical fluctuations from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence...

Perspective is important.
Edited on 13-01-2021 18:30
13-01-2021 18:26
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
gfm7175 wrote:Why do all of these charts (that warmizombies spread around in their efforts to convert unbelievers) label the y-axis as "temperature anomaly", "difference from average temperature", or similar language, rather than simply labeling the y-axis as "average global temperature"?

Oh, pick me! Pick me!

The people who create the charts are painfully aware that nobody knows the earth's average global temperature ... but they need a graphic with an upward-pointing arrow indicating Global Warming! ... so they create a new undefined term and add it to their religious dogma ... except that they only use the word "anomaly" on the charts and swap that term out for the preferred "average global temperature" that they know they do not have when preaching the dogma.


Don't be afraid to come to me with the hard stuff.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 18:32
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
gfm7175 wrote: Maybe if we knew these "extremely accurate" numbers from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence, and made a complete historical chart of it, we might find that the increase during this particular 0.00000064% of Earth's existence is actually well within historical fluctuations from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence...


Great point ... assuming there exists any discernible fluctuation beyond an apparent flat line.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 18:44
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
IBdaMann wrote:
gfm7175 wrote: Maybe if we knew these "extremely accurate" numbers from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence, and made a complete historical chart of it, we might find that the increase during this particular 0.00000064% of Earth's existence is actually well within historical fluctuations from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence...


Great point ... assuming there exists any discernible fluctuation beyond an apparent flat line.

.

**thumbs up**
13-01-2021 18:53
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(8114)
James___ wrote: And you went straight to an emotional argument based on something that you are unhappy about.

Whoa there! Easy on the emotional response trigger. Just remain calm and let's talk this out.

James___ wrote: Ergo, your response was a rant intended to make you the victim.

You must be mistaking me for someone else. Did you happen to catch a license plate?

James___ wrote: If tectonic plate uplift is causing the AMOC to slow, that is one definition of climate change.

I need you to be clear. If tectonic plate uplift is NOT causing the AMOC (whatever that is) to "slow" (how fast is it going at the moment?) then is it NOT one definition of Climate Change?

By the way, what is the unambiguous definition of AMOC slowing?

James___ wrote: Unfortunately this is of such a technical nature that between yourself and your friends, it's just not something you'd be capable of discussing.

True. When it gets really technical like the tectonic plate uplift-driven AMOC slowing, we have to use telepathic JSON documents.

James___ wrote: There is a cluster of significant hurricanes that ended in 2005.

Yep. They got new management. They hired a CEO who immediately restructured the entire organization from clusters to bunches. That's why you see such remarkable improvement thereafter.

James___ wrote: At the same time, this makes you and your friends like Christians.

Are you saying that even those of us who are Christian are like Christians, or are you saying that even those of us who are Christians like Christians. Either way it's beginning to sound like crazy talk.

James___ wrote: And your post was in agreement with the teachings of Jesus.

Jesus picked up on it all pretty quickly.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
13-01-2021 19:06
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
gfm7175 wrote:



Maybe if we had the "extremely accurate" numbers from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence, and made a complete historical chart of those numbers, we might find that the increase during this particular 0.00000064% of Earth's existence is actually well within historical fluctuations from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence...

Perspective is important.



And now you've become an extremist.

You have shown that if asked to consider more than today, then we have to consider everything in the past. If we consider the past 800,000 years, the Little Ice Age was one of the warmer periods. But you know nothing of history.
What I posted was about vineyards in England and significant hurricanes in the US. Neither one matters to you. This is because you do not understand geology and the thermohaline circulation.
I think it is as I said, what you guys are posting are rants and nothing more.

@gfm, is very possible I could move out of the US. With a population of over 328,000,000, people need to stand out. That's because it's the greatest country in the world which has the greatest people in the world. Quality of life really has no meaning.
Edited on 13-01-2021 19:17
13-01-2021 22:37
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
James___ wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
Maybe if we had the "extremely accurate" numbers from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence, and made a complete historical chart of those numbers, we might find that the increase during this particular 0.00000064% of Earth's existence is actually well within historical fluctuations from the other 99.99999936% of Earth's existence...

Perspective is important.


And now you've become an extremist.

You have shown that if asked to consider more than today, then we have to consider everything in the past.

The question that I have introduced in my prior post is this: Why is the 30* year time period from 1961-1990 (*I made a minor error in that post by using 29 instead of 30, since I didn't count both 1961 and 1990 as full years) any more significant than any other 30 year time period throughout the history of Earth's existence?

Within the context of my prior post, there very well could be a 30 year time period within that data in which Earth's temperature is decreasing instead of increasing. I could then cherry pick that data, claim that Earth is dangerously cooling, and scream that Global Cooling is going to kill us all in ten years.

The point I'm making is that, even IF the chart's information was extremely accurate (it is not, as it is just made up numbers), it is not logical (nor scientific) to cherry pick "1961-1990" out of all of Earth's existence and then act as if the average temperature of Earth during that specific time frame is where Earth's temperature "should be", and that a 40 year long upward-trending deviation from that cherry picked baseline is somehow a "bad" thing or somehow something that is "of concern".

It is a complete disregard of the rest of Earth's history and how the average temperature during that 30 year time frame compares to the average temperature of any other 30 year time frame (or any other time frame length). In fact, as IBD mentioned, looking at a chart of Earth's average temperature over the complete course of Earth's history might not show any discernible fluctuations at all (iow, it might show an apparent "flat line").

Of course, no such data actually exists because no such measurements of Earth's temperature actually exist. That's why these charts always refer to "anomalies" from the "average temperature of [insert time period here]" instead of simply referencing the average temperatures themselves (and disclosing the methodology behind those numbers).

James___ wrote:
If we consider the past 800,000 years, the Little Ice Age was one of the warmer periods. But you know nothing of history.

Was it now?? You were there 800,000 years ago to witness it? Damn you sure are an old fart!!


James___ wrote:
What I posted was about vineyards in England and significant hurricanes in the US. Neither one matters to you. This is because you do not understand geology and the thermohaline circulation.
I think it is as I said, what you guys are posting are rants and nothing more.

No, we are attempting to educate people about these topics. Unfortunately, people such as you and Spongy are unwilling to become educated about them. Your loss.

James___ wrote:
@gfm, is very possible I could move out of the US. With a population of over 328,000,000, people need to stand out. That's because it's the greatest country in the world which has the greatest people in the world. Quality of life really has no meaning.

You're gonna have to speak English if you expect me to respond. I do not speak Jabberwocky, nor do I speak Liberal.
Edited on 13-01-2021 22:39
13-01-2021 22:51
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
gfm7175 wrote:


James___ wrote:
If we consider the past 800,000 years, the Little Ice Age was one of the warmer periods. But you know nothing of history.

Was it now?? You were there 800,000 years ago to witness it? Damn you sure are an old fart!!





Did you watch Jesus die on the cross? That was 2,000 years ago. Do you accept that he was crucified? Why? Because someone recorded history? That's not it. It must be word of mouth.
At the same time, hurricanes in the US and vineyards in England are a part of recorded history. It's just a shame that no book mentions Jesus' name, what he did or why he did it. Just nothing.
At the same time, recorded history tells us when cathedrals were built. They also say when there were no vineyards in England and when there were hurricanes in the US. Still, have no understanding why a church matters. There is no book that explains that. Satisfied? I refute recorded history.

p.s., I could say that I believe in Jesus because only a "true" "God" could have a son like that, but then there are Christians who say otherwise. It's not about what's written but is understanding what it means.
As for me, faith doesn't matter. Christians kept me from having a family because I'm a disabled Veteran who served my country. And this means that I have no need to like what you say, but I will allow for the Constitution which allows you to say it.

gfm, if you say "believe in Jesus", then why is today the only day that matters?
For what he said, it was to people who have nothing. He was trying to make them feel better. That's called empathy. He felt for those people. If he had sympathy he would have felt sorry for them.
Edited on 13-01-2021 23:31
13-01-2021 23:34
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1614)
James___ wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:


James___ wrote:
If we consider the past 800,000 years, the Little Ice Age was one of the warmer periods. But you know nothing of history.

Was it now?? You were there 800,000 years ago to witness it? Damn you sure are an old fart!!





Did you watch Jesus die on the cross?

No, I didn't.

James___ wrote:
That was 2,000 years ago.

Roughly 2,000 years ago, yes.

James___ wrote:
Do you accept that he was crucified?

Yes.

James___ wrote:
Why? Because someone recorded history? That's not it. It must be word of mouth.

More-so because I accept The Bible as a True on a faith basis.

James___ wrote:
... deleted James-babbling...
13-01-2021 23:42
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
gfm7175 wrote:
James___ wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:


James___ wrote:
If we consider the past 800,000 years, the Little Ice Age was one of the warmer periods. But you know nothing of history.

Was it now?? You were there 800,000 years ago to witness it? Damn you sure are an old fart!!





Did you watch Jesus die on the cross?

No, I didn't.

James___ wrote:
That was 2,000 years ago.

Roughly 2,000 years ago, yes.

James___ wrote:
Do you accept that he was crucified?

Yes.

James___ wrote:
Why? Because someone recorded history? That's not it. It must be word of mouth.

More-so because I accept The Bible as a True on a faith basis.

James___ wrote:
... deleted James-babbling...



james-babbling is either personal or because of emotion. I am not challenging your faith. At the same time, I am bad and you are good. It is a challenge.
With Matthew 6:34;
Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

People who have nothing have what?

With Mathew 6:19;
Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Again, people have what? And then he said;
Matthew 19:24;
Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.".

You don't get it, do you? It's not your wealth that matters. It's about answering to the person next to you. After all, you won't be alone in Heaven.
Edited on 13-01-2021 23:43
14-01-2021 00:03
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
@gfm, in Heaven, would you forgive me for the life we have here? You would be in the Kingdom of Heaven. Yet we would not be brothers. Our life here doesn't matter. What if I think this life matters? What then? Would it change in Heaven? Would that life matter more because you're not there?
Or would it be because I'm not there? Does faith in God divide or unite? Does believing in the Great Spirit mean someone got it wrong or that they pursue their faith in a different way?

p.s., for me personally, I understand quantum physics as well as astrophysics and the Bible. At the same time, I need a life. When I can demonstrate cold fusion, I'll probably walk away from everything. Am kind of jealous of the Amish. They can limit the access that the modern world has in their lives.

Edited on 14-01-2021 00:25
14-01-2021 00:52
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
When I was homeless, an Amish guy heard me ask the question to another person, saved is "past tense". That means it has already happened.
When the Amish guy served me my dinner, he said, I hope I am saved.
I saw him again and got even with him. I told him I wonder if he knows how lucky he is.
He gave me the same smile that he gave me when he said that he hoped that he was saved.
He's thankful for his life. I never meant to test him but did. He has faith.
I was homeless yet my words mattered to him just as if I was of his flock. Him serving me never made me less than him. And what I said, it never challenged him and yet my response allowed him to be thankful for the life he had. He let me know that he had a good life. Kind of why I'm jealous of the Amish.
14-01-2021 01:22
Xadoman
★★☆☆☆
(387)
Actually the earth is cooling very very slowly because the distance between earth and sun is increasing( although very slowly). Also the magma chamber inside the earth is supposed to cool down very very slowly. So overall things are getting cooler not warmer.
14-01-2021 01:31
James___
★★★★★
(3800)
Xadoman wrote:
Actually the earth is cooling very very slowly because the distance between earth and sun is increasing( although very slowly). Also the magma chamber inside the earth is supposed to cool down very very slowly. So overall things are getting cooler not warmer.



Xadoman,
Please, let's not get into glacial periods. If the greater extent of the inter-glacial period has ended, how would you explain that to someone?
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