Remember me
▼ Content

Salt Tolerant Vegetation


Salt Tolerant Vegetation05-01-2020 00:03
James___
★★★★★
(2179)
This is just for fun because we know salt kills. And GMO isn't organic.
To consider a world with over 7 Billion people, organic might be a little too expensive and this opens the door for GMO.
All that means is that the plant/tree isn't found in the natural world. It was genetically modified. And many people when given the choice between going hungry and GMO will choose to have dinner.
Many plants have been cross pollinated. GMO is essentially artificially changing the DNA. RNA doesn't allow for complex attributes that DNA allows for. At present,
no scientist can explain the existence of DNA. Natural variation does allow for it.
And in equatorial countries in the Middle East and Africa, salt tolerant agriculture might become a source of income and political stability. It could also help to push back the Sahara desert.
And for something like this, a better solar panel won't work. What might work is direct solar radiation and vacuum. Vacuum decreases the temperature at which water evaporates. And that's what would make Mediterranean Africa and the Middle East places where such innovation might allow for agricultural production instead of desert.
And if ya'all are wondering, if we look at what we couldn't do 100 years ago, this is considering something on a much simpler level. And economics would determine the scale to which it is done.

https://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/salt-tolerant-plants-for-the-south-carolina-coast/
05-01-2020 21:45
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
James___ wrote:And GMO isn't organic.

All food is organic.



.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 01:49
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
IBdaMann wrote:
James___ wrote:And GMO isn't organic.

All food is organic.
.
sigh.... Dictionary again
06-01-2020 03:17
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
tmiddles wrote: sigh.... Dictionary again

sigh ... intentional ambiguity just to kill discussions.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 03:31
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: sigh.... Dictionary again

sigh ... intentional ambiguity just to kill discussions.
Not at all everyone here including you knows what James meant. You're just Trolling as usual. Like when you and ITN pretend not to know what fossil fuels are. Just another day of you guys jousting with the dictionary.

organic [ awr-gan-ik ]
pertaining to, involving, or grown with fertilizers or pesticides of animal or vegetable origin, as distinguished from manufactured chemicals:
organic farming; organic fruits.
06-01-2020 03:39
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1602)
I think Jimmy was referring to the over-priced 'organically' foods at the grocery store, which often come from the same farms as normal food. 'Organic' really means wormy, blemished, small, misshapen, basically, they have to sell to the canneries, for very little money, and feel lucky to get that.
06-01-2020 03:52
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
tmiddles wrote: Not at all

Yes, absolutely.

tmiddles wrote: everyone here including you knows what James meant.

You don't know what anyone, including yourself, means. You are allergic to defining your terms in a forum of ideas where words are all we have ... because you don't want to advertise that you don't have any ideas.

You're just Trolling as usual, intent on shutting down the discussion, like when you pretend to "know" of fossils that can be burned as fuel. There's a clear political motivation behind your refusal to use the correct term "hydrocarbons."

[hint: dishonesty]


or·gan·ic
/ôrˈɡanik/

adjective
relating to or derived from living matter. "organic soils"


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 04:04
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
IBdaMann wrote:You are allergic to defining your terms...
They were the terms used by someone else, and not you, and I provided the correct dictionary definition (#11 according to dictionary.com) to coincide with what they were communicating. You don't get to redefine words for the world or other people. Sorry, that's not how words work.
06-01-2020 04:28
James___
★★★★★
(2179)
HarveyH55 wrote:
I think Jimmy was referring to the over-priced 'organically' foods at the grocery store, which often come from the same farms as normal food. 'Organic' really means wormy, blemished, small, misshapen, basically, they have to sell to the canneries, for very little money, and feel lucky to get that.



I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food. It's not natural. Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.
As for your comments about what is organic for the store, what you stated is an opinion.
06-01-2020 05:29
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
James___ wrote: I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food. It's not natural. Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.

How is modified DNA not natural? I realize that such DNA is arbitrary instead of random, but DNA is by definition, natural.

.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 05:42
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
IBdaMann wrote:
James___ wrote: I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food. It's not natural. Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.

How is modified DNA not natural? I realize that such DNA is arbitrary instead of random, but DNA is by definition, natural.
IBD is clearly in "let me waste their time" mode tonight James. Not even trying to hide it.
06-01-2020 16:58
James___
★★★★★
(2179)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
James___ wrote: I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food. It's not natural. Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.

How is modified DNA not natural? I realize that such DNA is arbitrary instead of random, but DNA is by definition, natural.
IBD is clearly in "let me waste their time" mode tonight James. Not even trying to hide it.



Ever watch Fiddler on the Roof? Paul Michael Glaser played Perchik? ibdm reminds me of his character. The Communist Party was logical. It evenly distributes the wealth while empowering workers. In reality, people who think they know how to run a country should be given absolute power.
In this instance ibdm might have made a mistake. Or you could say that he appeals to people who want a simple, very basic logic to believe in. How do you think sects get started?
06-01-2020 18:46
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
tmiddles wrote: IBD is clearly in "let me waste their time" mode tonight James. Not even trying to hide it.

Question: How do you know when tmiddles is trying to derail a thread and to disrupt a conversation?

Answer: He posts.


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 18:58
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
James___ wrote:In this instance ibdm might have made a mistake. Or you could say that he appeals to people who want a simple, very basic logic to believe in. How do you think sects get started?

It is interesting that you liken me to a religious preacher or to a Marxist. You are characterizing me as pushing an ideology.

What ideology do you claim I advocate besides that of individual liberty?

What beliefs do you claim I am pushing (that are not supported by science and hence, have no rational basis) ?


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-01-2020 19:37
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11013)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: sigh.... Dictionary again

sigh ... intentional ambiguity just to kill discussions.
Not at all everyone here including you knows what James meant.

Apparently YOU don't.
tmiddles wrote:
You're just Trolling as usual.

Inversion fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
Like when you and ITN pretend not to know what fossil fuels are.

There are no fossils fuels. Fossils don't burn.
tmiddles wrote:
Just another day of you guys jousting with the dictionary.

You keep referring to the dictionary like it some sort of god to you. Dictionaries don't define words.


The Parrot Killer
06-01-2020 19:46
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11013)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:You are allergic to defining your terms...
They were the terms used by someone else,

You don't to speak for everyone. You only get to speak for you. Define the terms you use. You do not have to define them for everyone else.
tmiddles wrote:
and not you,

You are using words that have not been defined.
tmiddles wrote:
and I provided the correct dictionary definition

Dictionaries don't define words. False authority fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
(#11 according to dictionary.com)

They don't define words either.
tmiddles wrote:
to coincide with what they were communicating.

Never did. You just want to derail the threads.
tmiddles wrote:
You don't get to redefine words for the world or other people.

You aren't defining your words. Buzzword fallacy. Void argument fallacy.
tmiddles wrote:
Sorry, that's not how words work.

Words don't work. Not even the word 'work' works. Words just are. Define the terms you use.

Define 'climate change'. Define 'global warming'. Define 'pollution'. Since you seem to have a problem with the word 'organic', define 'organic'. Chemistry defines 'organic chemistry' as that chemistry relating to carbon compounds (other than simple salts).

All food is organic.


The Parrot Killer
06-01-2020 19:51
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11013)
James___ wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
I think Jimmy was referring to the over-priced 'organically' foods at the grocery store, which often come from the same farms as normal food. 'Organic' really means wormy, blemished, small, misshapen, basically, they have to sell to the canneries, for very little money, and feel lucky to get that.



I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food.

All farmed food is engineered. That's what farming and ranching is.
James___ wrote:
It's not natural.

It's completely natural. No farmer or rancher can violate physical laws.
James___ wrote:
Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.

Ever hear of sex?
James___ wrote:
As for your comments about what is organic for the store, what you stated is an opinion.

'Organic' products in the stores have specific requirements to meet to be labeled 'organic'. Among them, you have to use real shit to fertilize the fields instead of sanitary fertilizers. Oh, 'organic'' costs quite a bit more too.


The Parrot Killer
07-01-2020 03:40
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1602)
Into the Night wrote:
James___ wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
I think Jimmy was referring to the over-priced 'organically' foods at the grocery store, which often come from the same farms as normal food. 'Organic' really means wormy, blemished, small, misshapen, basically, they have to sell to the canneries, for very little money, and feel lucky to get that.



I wasn't. Some people won't touch engineered food.

All farmed food is engineered. That's what farming and ranching is.
James___ wrote:
It's not natural.

It's completely natural. No farmer or rancher can violate physical laws.
James___ wrote:
Some people don't care for gene splicing which modifies DNA.

Ever hear of sex?
James___ wrote:
As for your comments about what is organic for the store, what you stated is an opinion.

'Organic' products in the stores have specific requirements to meet to be labeled 'organic'. Among them, you have to use real shit to fertilize the fields instead of sanitary fertilizers. Oh, 'organic'' costs quite a bit more too.


It's still just a label, a brand, which can represent quite a few farms. Could you send a product sample to a lab, and definitively prove it wasn't organic? There are 'organic' farms, since it's cheaper, without chemicals. The quality and yield isn't ideal, but they can charge higher prices to make up for it. I've no proof, but seems like somebody would have seen a way to profit, of the rejects from the chemical farms, that look very similar to 'organic' farmed. Farmers usually sell bulk, and buyers usually do business with several farms. The product gets sorted, labeled, and packaged, shipped to the next buyer. Could also go through several of these, before the stores. Would be surprise a few stores rebrand as well, rather than dispose of farm product, because they don't look perfect.
07-01-2020 09:19
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
HarveyH55 wrote:
The product gets sorted, labeled, and packaged, shipped to the next buyer. Could also go through several of these, before the stores. Would be surprise a few stores rebrand as well, rather than dispose of farm product, because they don't look perfect.

Testing for pestcides and genetic manipulation is very doable. US agriculture has a problem now with Europe rejecting frankenfoods.
07-01-2020 17:57
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11013)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
The product gets sorted, labeled, and packaged, shipped to the next buyer. Could also go through several of these, before the stores. Would be surprise a few stores rebrand as well, rather than dispose of farm product, because they don't look perfect.

Testing for pestcides and genetic manipulation is very doable. US agriculture has a problem now with Europe rejecting frankenfoods.


Fake news. Europe themselves have been genetically modifying crops and using pesticides.


The Parrot Killer
08-01-2020 00:41
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(2038)
Into the Night wrote:
Fake news.
Well you just called Fox News Fake News so to you all news is fake.

Also, news flash, I never care what you have to say ITN. Your posts are always unwelcome.
08-01-2020 01:13
James___
★★★★★
(2179)
Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
The product gets sorted, labeled, and packaged, shipped to the next buyer. Could also go through several of these, before the stores. Would be surprise a few stores rebrand as well, rather than dispose of farm product, because they don't look perfect.

Testing for pestcides and genetic manipulation is very doable. US agriculture has a problem now with Europe rejecting frankenfoods.


Fake news. Europe themselves have been genetically modifying crops and using pesticides.


It can work for people too. Just look at President Trump.
08-01-2020 18:20
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(11013)
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Fake news.
Well you just called Fox News Fake News so to you all news is fake.

Lie. Compositional error fallacy. I never said all news articles are fake news.
tmiddles wrote:
Also, news flash, I never care what you have to say ITN.
Your posts are always unwelcome.

Bulverism fallacy.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 08-01-2020 18:21
08-01-2020 18:52
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5682)
tmiddles wrote:Also, news flash, I never care what you have to say ITN. Your posts are always unwelcome.

This was established the moment he questioned what you claim to "know."


.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
08-01-2020 22:27
James___
★★★★★
(2179)
James___ wrote:
This is just for fun because we know salt kills. And GMO isn't organic.
To consider a world with over 7 Billion people, organic might be a little too expensive and this opens the door for GMO.
All that means is that the plant/tree isn't found in the natural world. It was genetically modified. And many people when given the choice between going hungry and GMO will choose to have dinner.
Many plants have been cross pollinated. GMO is essentially artificially changing the DNA. RNA doesn't allow for complex attributes that DNA allows for. At present,
no scientist can explain the existence of DNA. Natural variation does allow for it.
And in equatorial countries in the Middle East and Africa, salt tolerant agriculture might become a source of income and political stability. It could also help to push back the Sahara desert.
And for something like this, a better solar panel won't work. What might work is direct solar radiation and vacuum. Vacuum decreases the temperature at which water evaporates. And that's what would make Mediterranean Africa and the Middle East places where such innovation might allow for agricultural production instead of desert.
And if ya'all are wondering, if we look at what we couldn't do 100 years ago, this is considering something on a much simpler level. And economics would determine the scale to which it is done.

https://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/salt-tolerant-plants-for-the-south-carolina-coast/



A link to some papers/discussion about halophytes. It might be making a better solar panel might be needed. This si because of the power requirements when considering the volume of water that would need to be desalinated.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biological-sciences/halophyte

This brings up something to consider, can electrolysis keep Na and Cl separate in salt water so that drains can be placed by the anode and cathode similar to how hydrogen is generated? When salt dissolves in water, the Na and Cl become separated. Could make for an interesting chemistry experiment.

https://www.dummies.com/education/science/chemistry/ions-atoms-with-an-electrical-charge/




Join the debate Salt Tolerant Vegetation:

Remember me

▲ Top of page
Public Poll
Who is leading the renewable energy race?

US

EU

China

Japan

India

Brazil

Other

Don't know


Thanks for supporting Climate-Debate.com.
Copyright © 2009-2020 Climate-Debate.com | About | Contact