Remember me
▼ Content

Reason why companies are not converting to 100% electric, focusing on Porsche


Reason why companies are not converting to 100% electric, focusing on Porsche18-11-2019 14:35
luvioni
☆☆☆☆☆
(6)
https://www.luvioni.com/why-porsche-should-go-fully-electric/
This blog discusses why Porsche and other established car companies are not going fully electric. By seeing why they are not going fully electric and establishing solutions to those very reasons, we made recommendations on how and why Porsche should go electric and how their decisions are contradicting their very purpose.
Attached image:

18-11-2019 18:23
James___
★★★★☆
(1849)
luvioni wrote:
https://www.luvioni.com/why-porsche-should-go-fully-electric/
This blog discusses why Porsche and other established car companies are not going fully electric. By seeing why they are not going fully electric and establishing solutions to those very reasons, we made recommendations on how and why Porsche should go electric and how their decisions are contradicting their very purpose.



There is one good reason why EVs should have limited production numbers. The typical lead battery is 100% recycled. Li-ion batteries are not. Until they are, costs will remain higher and a lot of toxic waste will be going to landfills.
One could also say that the IPCC has made projections on the ozone layer recovering because of what they hope are rising CO2 levels. Kind of why in the EU burning trees is carbon neutral.
Besides, some people like hearing an engine revving, part of the allure.
18-11-2019 22:25
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
luvioni wrote:
https://www.luvioni.com/why-porsche-should-go-fully-electric/
This blog discusses why Porsche and other established car companies are not going fully electric. By seeing why they are not going fully electric and establishing solutions to those very reasons, we made recommendations on how and why Porsche should go electric and how their decisions are contradicting their very purpose.


The purpose of Porsche or any other car company is to sell cars. That means they should manufacture cars that people want to buy.

Not everyone wants an electric car.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 18-11-2019 22:26
19-11-2019 00:34
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1513)
Most people want a car the can understand and depend on. Sports cars are know for power and high performance. Electrics are more of a niche, not likely to dominate the market, without a lot of government subsidy, or carbon taxing. Basically, most people need to be forced into electric cars. Electrics are mainly commuter vehicles, back and forth to work, shopping, around town. Going on a long road trip doesn't make a lot of sense. You can expect to stop for a long recharge, regularly. Uncertain if you find an appropriate place to do so, and how much you'll get charge. Electricity ain't free. You don't see a lot of work trucks, off road vehicles, SUVs in all electric either. Do see much mention of towing capacity of an electric either. An electric might be be mechanically cheaper, but the parts are more expensive. The control electronics are much more complex and computer dependent, more ways to screw up, leave you stranded, and likely expensive to get repair. A lot of newer model gas cars suffer the same fault, get what you paid for, and deserve it. Mainly, you need the right tool for the job, and gas vehicles will always be the better quality tool in most cases.
19-11-2019 19:43
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
The nice thing about the computers in cars though is the FADEC engine. Instead of carburetors, that meter fuel using pressure differences and a few 'guestimates', FADEC uses a computer and sensors mounted all over the engine.

Even in a carburetor, metering is done by pressure differences of air passing through the carburetor (that's why the little venturi inside them). That pressure difference is what sucks fuel out of the bowl and introduces it at the low pressure point in the thing, misting the fuel. Fine, but there are a few problems with such a design.

The first is the central point of the introduction of fuel. As that misted fuel travels down the induction system to the cylinders, it comes out of suspension and sticks to the walls of the tubing. Instead of getting a nice clean mist, cylinders get mostly mist, but also droplets of fuel. These won't burn nearly as well, and a lot of unburned fuel is simply ejected out the exhaust system. Worse, the high temperatures of the burn created NOx gases. The nitrogen in the air has combined with some of the oxygen. Also, oxygen has had energy shoved into it from the temperatures, creating ozone. These three components produce smog, which became a real big problem during the 60's and early 70's, until EGR system were introduced, reducing the NOx component.

Carburetors couldn't handle all engine conditions, such as sudden accelerations, moist air entering the induction system at around 40-50 deg F (common around here!) which was cooled by that misted fuel into temperatures perfect for icing in the carburetor, plugging it. This was compensated for by bring hoses up from muffs around the exhaust system to heat the air, but that wasn't available until the car warmed up.

FADEC cars meter fuel by measuring air directly. and also measure air temperature directly. There is no carburetor, so there is no heat muff needed from the exhaust to prevent icing. The throttle is now electric, so no cables to snap. It can handle a much wider range of fuels and driving conditions. Primary metering is done by a mass airflow sensor somewhere near the entrance to that system. Pressure stubs even out airflow (not really possible with the carburetors) and thus allow more accurate metering. Better fuel mileage, and if something goes wrong, the computer itself has enough sensors to tell you pretty much exactly what. Get an ODBC2 reader and you will find it an excellent diagnostic tool. It will tell if you a cylinder is dead and which one, tell you if primary or secondary metering is screwed up, tell you if you left your gas cap off, and do a lot to prevent detonation (pinging) even with pretty crappy fuels.

Despite their seeming complexity, the computer itself is pretty reliable. The sensors too are simple and pretty rugged. Most are fairly easy to replace if one croaks. The computer will tell you which one, and do it's level best to run the engine without it if it can, though of course,not as well.

Passenger jets have had FADEC on their engines for many years. Now the computer is ultra cheap. It's an excellent replacement for that carburetor system offering better fuel mileage, a cleaner exhaust, a more reliable car, and a better range of fuel octanes you can use.

FADEC does not require ethanol for the fuel moderator. It is the rather useless and expensive catalytic converter that requires that, and those are mandated by the EPA (I think someone there has invested in palladium futures). FADEC does not require catalytic converters.

Now we have computers being installed that provide GPS, more accurate instrumentation, and more reliable LED lighting for interior and exterior lighting. No more replacing burned out headlights and bulbs! Some of these system are providing semi-automatic driving modes too, making driving safer, especially on long trips. You DO have to still drive the car, and these systems aren't perfect. Cruise control is better able to follow other traffic now, and steering assist still tries to do the wrong thing, but it's easily overpowered simply by driving like usual.

Fully automatic systems are dangerous, and it's only a matter of time before such manufacturers are sued out of existence. Tesla uses a semi-automatic system, but marketed the thing as a fully automatic system. Too many people treated it as fully automatic.

Other systems are vastly improved as well. No more hydraulic steering systems, that leaked and needed to be filled with fluid and made an oily mess in the bottom of the engine compartment. It's electric power steering now. Much cleaner.

Keyless entry and ignition systems prevent you from locking your keys in the car anymore.

Automatic headlight dimming at night means fewer drivers blinded by inattentive idiots not dimming their lights.

Proximity sensors that help you check your blind spots. Tire pressure sensors that tell you when your tire pressure is low. Sensors in your oil pan to tell you to add a quart. Tone sensors on each wheel to better handle traction in snow and ice, even when braking.

'Bullet' style headlights that 'turn into' the direction you are turning the car, better lighting up what you're turning into.

Nicer entertainment systems built in, reducing the need to install aftermarket stereos to get your tunes and news. These systems offer XM radio now as well, letting you choose stations dedicated to what you want to listen to no matter what State you are in as you drive.

Yes, the car has improved a lot. Yes, there are more computers. Yes, there is more complexity due to the increased number of things your car does. Like anything, there are manufactures that make things poorly and sell it for cheap. They are the problem...not the computers themselves.
05-12-2019 01:14
Xadoman
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
Keyless entry and ignition systems prevent you from locking your keys in the car anymore.


The bad thing is that you can drive away without keys at all. Happened to me once.

Carburetors couldn't handle all engine conditions


I have an old car that has a carburettor and I smell gasoline every time when I drive it. The smell is pretty bad. I wanted to buy a new carburettor but original items are no longer available. I would like to fit an injection system in the future.
I also work a lot with chainsaws and the petrol smell with regular gasoline was too much for me. Fortunately it is possible to use alkylate gasoline that solves the problem.
05-12-2019 18:27
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
Xadoman wrote:
Keyless entry and ignition systems prevent you from locking your keys in the car anymore.


The bad thing is that you can drive away without keys at all. Happened to me once.

Since 'keyless' cars require the use of a fob, I have to wonder how you could drive away without the 'key'.
Xadoman wrote:
Carburetors couldn't handle all engine conditions


I have an old car that has a carburettor and I smell gasoline every time when I drive it. The smell is pretty bad. I wanted to buy a new carburettor but original items are no longer available. I would like to fit an injection system in the future.

Be prepared to install the high pressure plumbing, a new induction system, a pneumatic accumulator, and of course the sensors and the injector itself.
Xadoman wrote:
I also work a lot with chainsaws and the petrol smell with regular gasoline was too much for me. Fortunately it is possible to use alkylate gasoline that solves the problem.

Well, if you want to spend the extra money for it. Fine.


The Parrot Killer
05-12-2019 22:35
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1513)
I drove a truck for a while, that didn't require a key. It had a toggle switch, and a push button under the dash...

Brother had one that used a screwdriver instead of a key, but it was kind of tricky to figure out.
06-12-2019 04:27
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
HarveyH55 wrote:
I drove a truck for a while, that didn't require a key. It had a toggle switch, and a push button under the dash...

Brother had one that used a screwdriver instead of a key, but it was kind of tricky to figure out.


Ah. So the truck didn't use a key of any kind. Yes, that would be a problem.


The Parrot Killer
06-12-2019 04:42
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(5225)
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
I drove a truck for a while, that didn't require a key. It had a toggle switch, and a push button under the dash...

Brother had one that used a screwdriver instead of a key, but it was kind of tricky to figure out.


Ah. So the truck didn't use a key of any kind. Yes, that would be a problem.

Military tactical platforms, i.e. vehicles and aircraft, don't use keys.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

When the alt-physics birds sing about "indivisible bodies," we've got pure BS. - VernerHornung

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-12-2019 05:38
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
IBdaMann wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
I drove a truck for a while, that didn't require a key. It had a toggle switch, and a push button under the dash...

Brother had one that used a screwdriver instead of a key, but it was kind of tricky to figure out.


Ah. So the truck didn't use a key of any kind. Yes, that would be a problem.

Military tactical platforms, i.e. vehicles and aircraft, don't use keys.


True. I was referring to the 'keyless' ignition systems found in modern cars. They actually have a 'key' in the form of a fob.


The Parrot Killer
06-12-2019 07:06
keepit
★★★☆☆
(783)
Harvey,
Try driving an electric car. It actually feels better than gas powered.
06-12-2019 11:45
Xadoman
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
Since 'keyless' cars require the use of a fob, I have to wonder how you could drive away without the 'key'.


I went to change my trousers while the car was idleing. I forgot the "key" into the pocket of the old trousers. Fortunately I was not far from home when I wanted to start the car again.


Well, if you want to spend the extra money for it. Fine.


You can not get health back no matter how much money you have.
06-12-2019 18:03
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
keepit wrote:
Harvey,
Try driving an electric car. It actually feels better than gas powered.


They are smooth driving, but they have limited range. It simply takes too long to refuel them. They suck at any cross country driving. They are really good only as a commuting car (if you don't mind the expense).


The Parrot Killer
06-12-2019 18:09
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
Xadoman wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Since 'keyless' cars require the use of a fob, I have to wonder how you could drive away without the 'key'.


I went to change my trousers while the car was idleing. I forgot the "key" into the pocket of the old trousers. Fortunately I was not far from home when I wanted to start the car again.

You keep your trousers beside the car??? I'm starting to think your story is BS.
Xadoman wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Well, if you want to spend the extra money for it. Fine.

You can not get health back no matter how much money you have.

What does that have to do with anything???


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 06-12-2019 18:09
06-12-2019 20:11
Xadoman
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
You keep your trousers beside the car??? I'm starting to think your story is BS.


I drove away with new pants and left the keys to old pants. I stopped the car and went to the shop and when I came back I could not start the car. Then I walked home to get the keys. Simple as that.

What does that have to do with anything???


Using alcylat gasoline is much better for health. Simple as that.
06-12-2019 22:29
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(10253)
Xadoman wrote:
You keep your trousers beside the car??? I'm starting to think your story is BS.


I drove away with new pants and left the keys to old pants. I stopped the car and went to the shop and when I came back I could not start the car. Then I walked home to get the keys. Simple as that.

Not quite so simple as that.

Fobs have very limited range. You have to be standing next to the car with the fob before it will run or even allow the doors to unlock.

I'm going to have to call BS on this one.


Xadoman wrote:
What does that have to do with anything???


Using alcylat gasoline is much better for health. Simple as that.

Circular argument fallacy. Explain why. Don't use Holy Links to some marketing site. Explain why yourself.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 06-12-2019 22:30
06-12-2019 23:21
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1513)
keepit wrote:
Harvey,
Try driving an electric car. It actually feels better than gas powered.


I've never paid more than $2500 for a vehicle... Probably couldn't buy a battery for that.

I drive an electric pallet jack at work, occasionally a forklift. Think I'd prefer a gas vehicle. The batteries are lead/acid, but probably similar in some ways. When the battery starts getting low, they get slow. When it gets real low, functions fail. At about 12%, they stop functioning altogether. It's a big warehouse, sometimes a long trip. The night shift usually don't change the batteries, just grab another piece of equipment. It's a slow crawl to the battery room sometimes. since a decent piece of equipment is hard to find, unless it's got a dead battery.
06-12-2019 23:29
Xadoman
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
Not quite so simple as that.

Fobs have very limited range. You have to be standing next to the car with the fob before it will run or even allow the doors to unlock.

I'm going to have to call BS on this one.


The car was already running. I let it idleing because it was a hot day and climate control was on. I went to my house to change clothes. I came back to the car, drove away and unintentionally let my fob/key to the pocket of my previous pants. I did not notice a text on the instrument panel that " key not detected or smth". I drove approximately 2,5 miles , went to the shop and when I came back I could not start the car. I pushed the button atleast ten times or something, I was truly puzzled back then( 3 years ago) that what was wrong with the car. It was brand new. It took a little time before I understood( i noticed the text on the instrument panel) that I have left the keys at home.

Circular argument fallacy. Explain why. Don't use Holy Links to some marketing site. Explain why yourself.


Because it is destilled and is much much much more pure of some harmful ingredients than regular gasoline. It also does not contain ehtanol that is known to screw up the carb membranes of the chaisaws. You can practically saw indoors with alcylat gasoline. Almost no smell from exhaust gases. One day my neighbour was working with his chainsaw and even he was approximately 100-150 meters away I could still smell the exhaust gases of his chainsaw.




Join the debate Reason why companies are not converting to 100% electric, focusing on Porsche:

Remember me

Related content
ThreadsRepliesLast post
Electric Vehicles?528-09-2019 20:00
Hybrid cars vs electric cars6512-09-2019 01:43
Is reason for climate change correct?4830-08-2019 03:14
Why we won't approach the real reason behind climate change.6819-08-2019 07:18
Wind power is the earliest way to generate power, but there's a reason it stopped being used.1226-04-2019 02:48
▲ Top of page
Public Poll
Who is leading the renewable energy race?

US

EU

China

Japan

India

Brazil

Other

Don't know


Thanks for supporting Climate-Debate.com.
Copyright © 2009-2019 Climate-Debate.com | About | Contact