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04-07-2020 00:02
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:... future generations of Iraqi's will not have all artifacts available to them because terrorists like yourself enjoy robbing future generations of their history ...
A unique take on pulling down Saddam's statues.

So unique in fact it has never been uttered before by a single supporter of controversial statues here in the US.

IBdaMann wrote:There is no history that is, by its nature, in need of being deleted and rewritten, ...
Because removing a statue does not delete or rewrite history. They occupy a place of honor in the present day.

You see it's making history to overthrow those who were once in power. Here Lenin falls in the Ukraine:


Into the Night wrote:
Robert E Lee was not a traitor. He wasn't fighting for white supremacy either.
Oh? Was he fighting for equality? Because the south was an active system of white supremacy.

You love to just say things without supporting them. Lee was disloyal to the United States and fought against it. That makes him a traitor.

IBdaMann wrote:
How was Robert E. Lee scum?
Confederate, Anit-Abolitionist and a man who fought to preserve slavery who's slaves said of him "the worst man I ever see."
Edited on 04-07-2020 00:12
04-07-2020 00:17
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote: A unique take on pulling down Saddam's statues.

I find it humorous, although I'm not surprised, that you believe I must be the only person who thinks that artwork needs to be destroyed if public display is offensive to some people. Only blind Taliban-minded chit have that mindset, of which the Iraqis pictured were. They certainly weren't rational, well-reasoned adults who were thinking of future generations.

tgoebbles wrote: So unique in fact it has never been uttered before by a single supporter of controversial statues here in the US.

Only a moron who thinks he is omniscient would say something as absurd as this.

tgoebbles wrote: Because removing a statue does not delete or rewrite history. They occupy a place of honor in the present day.

Because destroying a statue in pursuit of rewriting history accomplishes exactly that. When a statue no longer belongs in a "place of honor" then it should be moved to a museum for the benefit of future generations so that history is not rewritten.

tgoebbles wrote: Oh? Was he fighting for equality?

He was fighting for Virginia's State sovereignty. Didn't you learn ANYTHING in school?

tgoebbles wrote: Because the south was an active system of white supremacy.

Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... or are you just gibbering again?

You love to just say things without supporting them. Lee was forever loyal to his State and fought to defend it when the Federal government violated Virginia's sovereignty and invaded with military force. That makes Lee a true Virginia hero.[/quote]

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
04-07-2020 00:49
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.

And no I won't be defining the terms of US history for you. The framers of the Confederacy are a far more direct and appropriate source.

Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?
Edited on 04-07-2020 00:52
04-07-2020 02:34
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.

And no I won't be defining the terms of US history for you. The framers of the Confederacy are a far more direct and appropriate source.

Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?


Let me rephrase that.

"In 1991, Ukraine had 5,500 Lenin monuments. " ... and now there are none.

Maybe you think a giant museum should have been constructed to house all 5500 monuments which were removed? How many should be saved do you think and where should they go?

Oh and I checked, there are 1,800 Confederate monuments currently on display. (though some have been taken out recently, so maybe that number is a bit high).

Germany has zero Nazi monuments.

Iraq destroyed it's Saddam statues.

It's the "...examples of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, to commit to oblivion the feelings engendered."

Even scum bags have some good ideas now and then.
04-07-2020 03:55
James___
★★★★★
(3170)
tmiddles wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.

And no I won't be defining the terms of US history for you. The framers of the Confederacy are a far more direct and appropriate source.

Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?


Let me rephrase that.

"In 1991, Ukraine had 5,500 Lenin monuments. " ... and now there are none.

Maybe you think a giant museum should have been constructed to house all 5500 monuments which were removed? How many should be saved do you think and where should they go?

Oh and I checked, there are 1,800 Confederate monuments currently on display. (though some have been taken out recently, so maybe that number is a bit high).

Germany has zero Nazi monuments.

Iraq destroyed it's Saddam statues.

It's the "...examples of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, to commit to oblivion the feelings engendered."

Even scum bags have some good ideas now and then.



You know something tmiddles? Neither white or black Americans consider me an American. I hear things like "we're better than you". And to me, that is the basic American attitude. This is something best left to people who are good enough to be considered an American. It's not really my concern.


p.s., George Washington owned slaves. Should his name and his likeness be removed from everything? Francis Scott Key's statue was taken down for that reason. What's happening today is about purging your guys' country, right?

What's even funnier is that I asked two different groups of Christians the same question. I asked members of a white church and a black church if they ever thought of having a potluck dinner with the other church.

Romans 12:10 Love each other like brothers and sisters. Give each other more honor than you want for yourselves.

The looks that both groups gave me were the same. If I wanted to live, I should not be that stupid. The hatred in the eyes of both groups scared me. And that's Christians mind you.
Edited on 04-07-2020 04:52
04-07-2020 08:05
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote: [quote]IBdaMann wrote: Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.

Stupid. So, you mean to tell me that what you meant was "Because the south was an active Slavery and white supremacy of white supremacy"?

Your arguments are still dismissed, it's just that now we are certain that they make no sense and that you aren't contributing any thought to what you are preaching.


tgoebbles wrote: Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?

Absolutely. What is starting to no longer surprise me is your inability to grasp the difference between a human and an inanimate work of art.

tgoebbles wrote: Maybe you think a giant museum should have been constructed to house all 5500 monuments which were removed?

Sure. Why not? Are you afraid the statues will somehow revolt and try to take over?

tgoebbles wrote: How many should be saved do you think and where should they go?

All of them. To one or more museums.

tgoebbles wrote: Oh and I checked, there are 1,800 Confederate monuments currently on display.

There should be a lot more. It was a pivotal point in our history.

It just occurred to me that your slavemasters must have ordered you to believe that Civil War reenactments are racist. Do you think they get together and chant "nigger"-this and "nigger"-that? Do you even know why the Civil was fought? [you don't, do you?]



tgoebbles wrote: Germany has zero Nazi monuments.

German's are guaranteed no freedoms or liberties. They can be jailed for saying something politically incorrect. NAZI symbols have been made illegal, so good luck trying to be a german trying to study WWII history; in Germany, it is requird by law to be rewritten.

tgoebbles wrote: Iraq destroyed it's Saddam statues.

Good luck being a future Iraqi trying to learn the truth about what happened and why. All anyone in Iraq will learn is thoroughly tainted revisionism.

You motivated me to create at tribute to Gen. Robert E. Lee, a true American hero and true Virginia legend.
Attached image:

04-07-2020 13:36
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13293)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.
Not a system. Just your own racism.
tmiddles wrote:
And no I won't be defining the terms of US history for you. The framers of the Confederacy are a far more direct and appropriate source.
No, the racism is from you. You cannot blame others for your racism.
tmiddles wrote:
Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?

Depends on who you ask.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
04-07-2020 13:37
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13293)
tmiddles wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Could you give me the unambiguous definition of "system" that you are using ... .
Slavery and white supremacy.

And no I won't be defining the terms of US history for you. The framers of the Confederacy are a far more direct and appropriate source.

Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic as well?


Let me rephrase that.

"In 1991, Ukraine had 5,500 Lenin monuments. " ... and now there are none.

Maybe you think a giant museum should have been constructed to house all 5500 monuments which were removed? How many should be saved do you think and where should they go?

Oh and I checked, there are 1,800 Confederate monuments currently on display. (though some have been taken out recently, so maybe that number is a bit high).

Germany has zero Nazi monuments.

Iraq destroyed it's Saddam statues.

It's the "...examples of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, to commit to oblivion the feelings engendered."

Even scum bags have some good ideas now and then.

Dude, you don't get to equiate George Washington with Hitler or Lenin.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 04-07-2020 13:38
04-07-2020 16:17
James___
★★★★★
(3170)
This is Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's ad since it is an election year.
While many would like to see him voted out, his might be an election worth watching. His wealth comes from his relationship with China through his wife's family.
If he wins reelection, is this because what people see in the video and hear him talking about is actually what's happening in the video? And it's likely that other Republicans will use this same video or ones just like it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDF8dxzqF8E

I've actually been told my Americans that if I want to have a life, as a disabled Veteran, I don't deserve one in the US. And with what is happening, those people might be right. Things might just be starting to get bad.
04-07-2020 18:00
James___
★★★★★
(3170)
The Dept. of Transportation issued a report before FAA officials and some from Europe took test flights on the Boeing Max 8. While Elaine Chao, the Secretary for the Dept. of Transportation is married to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, the Dept. of Transportation issued a report reminding Americans that we can not trust the US government, the FAA or Boeing.
Her and her husband's wealth comes from the country that makes these airplanes; http://english.comac.cc/news/latest/201901/08/t20190108_6677713.shtml

It will take China more than 10 years to compete with Boeing, Airbus, says CEO of Dassault Systemes
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/28/dassault-systemes-ceo-china-aviation-competing-with-boeing-airbus.html

Yep, Senator McConnell and his wife could help show where we can trust China but we can't trust the US. The Dept. of Transportation report did cause Boeing stock to drop. This is a conflict of interest.
And as Harvey55 states, China builds high quality items that the US can't compete with because of their cost effectiveness.
And both China and the Republican party teaches obedience. The sad part is that Joe Biden likes China. His son unfortunately had to resign from the board of a Chinese company https://nypost.com/2020/04/15/hunter-biden-still-listed-as-board-member-of-chinese-company-report/ in which he had a 10% interest in. Oops, turns out he didn't.
If there's a sufficient backlash, people might have to choose between China and the US. Trump is for decreasing trade with China. And it's possible the protests might do more to help him than how he handled the pandemic. We'll just have to wait and see how America votes in November.
Will videos like McConnell's have the same effect on people's emotions?
Edited on 04-07-2020 18:06
05-07-2020 00:17
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:[what] "system"...
Slavery and white supremacy.
...So, you mean to tell me ...they make no sense...
What you fail to realize is that this current conflict is all about you IBD, and everyone "kicking back" and unconcerned about celebrations of white supremacy.

The Civil War was a war fought because of slavery in the south. There are no heroes of the confederacy because it was a vile and inhuman cause. I know you'll say it was something else but the confederates themselves contradict you.

That YOU have no grasp on this is entirely the issue. That's why we have a problem in this county. If these old statues were relics from A-holes of the past we wouldn't have an issue at all. They would already be gone.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: Do you find the fall of Lenin's statue to be tragic....museum should have been constructed to house all 5500 monuments?
Absolutely....Sure. Why not?
Why not? Same reason there aren't statues of Hitler. Get an education about things before you form an opinion. Lenin was a monster and he killed millions in the Ukraine. No statue of his "greatness" teaches history, it teaches a lie about history.
Lenin's HOLODOMOR killed 6 million in the Ukraine

Here is the formula so you can comprehend:
Statue = I want a child to aspire to be this person

IBdaMann wrote:you to believe that Civil War reenactments are racist.
No I don't. They don't teach white supremacy that I'm aware.

IBdaMann wrote:Do you even know why the Civil was fought? you don't, do you?
It was fought to prevent the unconstitutional succession of Southern States and the motive for that succession was the preservation of slavery. So short answer = slavery.

We have already been over this: link

Into the Night wrote:
Dude, you don't get to equiate George Washington with Hitler or Lenin.
And I did not. I equated Robert E Lee to them. A man who fought for slavery and white supremacy and who was described by his slaves as "the worst man I ever see."

George Washington was a leader 100 years earlier before the pivotal moment of reform had come. I can understand how someone would fault him for not championing progress that did not yet have adequate support, but I don't agree. He did not fight for women's suffrage either. But most importantly he did not fight for evil. For his time he was progressive: "Washington made the decision to free all his slaves in his 1799 will - the only slave-holding Founding Father to do so."

We should judge our past and be fair and open minded about it. We should think about it a lot, keep arguing about it as a country.
05-07-2020 05:09
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote: What you fail to realize is that this current conflict is all about you IBD, and everyone "kicking back" and unconcerned about celebrations of white supremacy.

This "conflict" is about people not recognizing the fictitious?

tgoebbles wrote:The Civil War was a war fought because of slavery in the south.

Nope. Only a completely uneducated dolt would say something that absurd.

The Civil War was fought because the Union launched a military incursion into the Confederate states who were not attacking them (they were peacefully seceeding) but who nonetheless picked up arms to defend themselves.

Slavery had nothing to do with why the war was fought.

tgoebbles wrote: There are no heroes of the confederacy because it was a vile and inhuman cause.

That's a really stupid thing to say. State sovereignty is the principle by which we live today, and the Confederacy defended that ideal for us all. It was the northern states that had been violating the sovereignty of the Confederate states through the Federal government before the war and who clearly did so by attacking militarily to start the war. What was established by the Civil War was the Hotel California principle whereby you can check in, i.e. become a State of the Union, ... but you can never leave.

Slavery had nothing to do with why the war was fought. Crack open a book.

tgoebbles wrote: Lenin was a monster and he killed millions in the Ukraine.

How many Ukranians were killed by Lenin's statues?

tgoebbles wrote:Here is the formula so you can comprehend:
Statue = I want a child to aspire to be this person

Nope. You are an uneducated moron.

Statue = testament that the personage thus depicted was prominent and is probably worth being studied

tgoebbles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:you to believe that Civil War reenactments are racist.
No I don't. They don't teach white supremacy that I'm aware.

... nor did the actual Civil War.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
05-07-2020 11:19
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:The Civil War was fought because...
We have already been over this: link

IBdaMann wrote:How many Ukranians were killed by Lenin's statues?...Statue = testament that the personage thus depicted was prominent and is probably worth being studied
Statues are a message. They make an assertion that the subject matter of the statue represents the beliefs, values and identity of where the statue stands.

There are no statues with inscriptions describing what a horrible person is immortalized in bronze above.

Go watch the movie RED DAWN (I know you love it) and imagine that there was enough time to erect several hundred statues of Mexican Colonel Ernesto Bella
and Russian General Bratchenko there in Calumet, Colorado.Later, after WWIII ends, and Colorado has managed to free itself of the invaders, what do you think happens to those statues? Is a museum erected to preserve them?

No, of course not.

I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.

It's funny too that your argument hinges on "preserving history" when you admit that all that a statues tells us is to look elsewhere in studying the person depicted.
IBdaMann wrote:Statue = testament that the personage thus depicted was prominent and is probably worth being studied

And what have we learned? Robert E Lee had buttons and a beard. Now it's time for a history book.
Edited on 05-07-2020 11:29
05-07-2020 20:50
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13293)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:The Civil War was fought because...
We have already been over this: link

IBdaMann wrote:How many Ukranians were killed by Lenin's statues?...Statue = testament that the personage thus depicted was prominent and is probably worth being studied
Statues are a message. They make an assertion that the subject matter of the statue represents the beliefs, values and identity of where the statue stands.

There are no statues with inscriptions describing what a horrible person is immortalized in bronze above.

Go watch the movie RED DAWN (I know you love it) and imagine that there was enough time to erect several hundred statues of Mexican Colonel Ernesto Bella
and Russian General Bratchenko there in Calumet, Colorado.Later, after WWIII ends, and Colorado has managed to free itself of the invaders, what do you think happens to those statues? Is a museum erected to preserve them?

No, of course not.

I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.

It's funny too that your argument hinges on "preserving history" when you admit that all that a statues tells us is to look elsewhere in studying the person depicted.
IBdaMann wrote:Statue = testament that the personage thus depicted was prominent and is probably worth being studied

And what have we learned? Robert E Lee had buttons and a beard. Now it's time for a history book.


And if you vandalize one, it's at least ten years in jail.
Vandalism is NOT peaceful protest.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
05-07-2020 23:58
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
Into the Night wrote:
And if you vandalize one, it's at least ten years in jail.
Vandalism is NOT peaceful protest.


I don't think so:
"By offense type, the median time served was 13.4 years for murder, 2.2 years for violent crimes excluding murder, "

"Under Penal Code 594(b)(1), a felony conviction for vandalism can be punished by up to three years in county jail. A misdemeanor conviction for vandalism can be punished by up to one year in county jail. Under section 594(b)(1), the court may also impose a $10,000 fine."

I'm sure had the Boston Tea Party vandals been caught the brits would have punished them. But not commensurate with murder.

Vandalism is not assault.
06-07-2020 00:06
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote: We have already been over this:

This is a Category 1 violation of Local Ordinance § TMID.
The Civil War was fought because the North invaded. Period.

tgoebbles wrote: [EVASION deleted]

How many Ukranians were killed by Lenin's statues?

tgoebbles wrote: Statues are a message.

We've been over this. Statues are a testament to prominence and signal that said personage should be studied. If it is inappropriate to display such art in public places then it should be moved to a museum, not destroyed, unless it is a statue that killed Ukranians. How many of those are there?

tgoebbles wrote: They make an assertion that the subject matter of the statue represents the beliefs, values and identity of where the statue stands.

Then it should be moved to a museum, not destroyed, unless it has killed people. How many of those are there?

So we arrive at the important question you need to answer:

Why is it such an imperative to you that humanity forget history that we would never want to repeat?

Are you in favor of destroying all Aztec art, artifacts and relics?


tgoebbles wrote: I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.

You are a moron. The world agrees with me and you stand alone ... with your BLM buddies of course. I take it you have never visited a NAZI war museum. The former concentration camp at Dachau has been converted to a haunting museum intended to allow visitors to immerse themselves in exactly what prisoners experienced. The execution cage in the courtyard was not torn down, it was left there so that no one can forget and no one can deny. [Note: the execution cage was a small cage made of chain-link. Guards surpised prisoners they didn't like, injected them with a lethal dose of poison and threw them into cage. All the other prisoners in the courtyard were free to walk by and pay their last respects while the victim was still alive in the cage, waiting for the poison to take effect, which the other prisoners would get to watch happen as a warning to not piss off the guards]

Inside the museum hangs a huge picture of a large group photo at an Oktoberfest celebration in Munich in which Hitler participated and was pictured. That photo was not torn down; it remains so that no one can forget and no one can deny.

The world and humanity stands against you. You are a cancer to human civilation.

tgoebbles wrote: It's funny too that your argument hinges on "preserving history"

I won't even ask why you find that amusing.

tgoebbles wrote: .. when you admit that all that a statues tells us is to look elsewhere in studying the person depicted.

What part of "testament to prominence that cannot be denied, indication that person should be studied" do you not fully grasp?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 00:34
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
The Civil War was fought because the North invaded. Period.
Nope. We have thoroughly debated the topic.link

IBdaMann wrote:Why is it such an imperative to you that humanity forget history that we would never want to repeat?
Destroying statues is making history which will also not be forgotten.

(above: Hungarians spit on the head of a destroyed statue of Stalin, 1956) Because history isn't recorded in statues it's recorded in books, photos and video. But you know that.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.
...The world agrees with me and you stand alone ... you have never visited a NAZI war museum....
GERMANY ??? Hahaha Your example of a country that agrees with you and not me is Germany? Are you drinking again IBD? You know we JUST went over that. Germany as you said:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Germany has zero Nazi monuments.
German's are guaranteed no freedoms or liberties. They can be jailed for saying something politically incorrect. NAZI symbols have been made illegal, so good luck trying to be a german trying to study WWII history; in Germany, it is required by law to be rewritten.

I would LOVE IT if we had a similar museum of the Confederacy. With photos of the slaves beaten nearly to death. Maybe an interactive exhibit where you can hear from Lee's slaves about how horrible he was.

We are hopefully moving toward having that! Maybe you and I actually agree and we'll both donate.

We already have The Legacy Museum
Edited on 06-07-2020 00:41
06-07-2020 01:04
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote: The Civil War was fought because the North invaded. Period.
Nope. We have thoroughly debated the topic.

Well, there was not much debate, just your refusal to learn. You believe that there were slaves picking cotton in the fields and a Civil War broke out.

You think the South somehow attacked the North to fight for slavery, not that they fought simply to defend themselves when the North busted in with canon blazing.

We're done. You're a moron ... but you knew that.

Do you have a double standard when it comes to Aztec art? Are you of the position that it should somehow be protected?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 01:16
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
Well, there was not much debate,
We went through it all IBD. link You're simply repeating yourself.


Edited on 06-07-2020 01:26
06-07-2020 02:26
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgeobbles wrote: We went through it all IBD.

I did. You ignored.

Cat-1 violation of Local Ordinance § TMID

.
Attached image:

06-07-2020 02:38
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: We went through it all IBD.
I did. You ignored.
There is nothing you had to say on the subject of what started the civil war I did not rebut. link
06-07-2020 03:26
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: We went through it all IBD.
I did. You ignored.
There is nothing you had to say on the subject of what started the civil war I did not rebut. link


"Nuh-uh" is not a rebuttal. Were you taught otherwise?

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 03:52
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
When people allow others to do their thinking for them, stupidity becomes the common denominator.

In this video, BLM protestors are obeying orders from their DNC slavemasters to blockade a freeway, at night, without reflective gear, without any lights and without conferring with the police. Sheer geniuses!

Stupid BLMers. Don't let others do your thinking for you, especially when they don't care about you.

.
Edited on 06-07-2020 03:53
06-07-2020 04:08
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: We went through it all IBD.
I did. You ignored.
There is nothing you had to say on the subject of what started the civil war I did not rebut. link


"Nuh-uh" is not a rebuttal. Were you taught otherwise?

.
one of the many many posts in which this subject was thoroughly covered:
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
Back then, slavery was normal, legal, and completely accepted.


As I showed it had been outlawed everywhere else in the western world. The US South was the last hold out.

I would agree racism was accepted then and it's not now.

It's not fair to apply the current attitude about racism to 1870. Slavery however was condemned at that point by everyone decent. "It's time had come"

Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:It's a wonderful thing to see humanity make real progress.

Progress towards your set of values as opposed to some elses? Careful, dude. You are not the king of the world.


I meant ending human slavery was progress. Went out on a limb to assume we're all on the same page there did I?

GasGuzzler wrote:
It was 150 years ago. Can we move on already?


You mean tear some pro-slavery statues down and make a new world? Working on it.

IBdaMann wrote:Explain this "step back." ...

The Union initiated the Civil War, not the Confederacy, ergo, slavery could not be the issue.


I meant the south's choice to attempt to create a state that could perpetuate human slavery longer.

The argument you're making goes like this:
The south wanted to leave the union
The north attacked the south to prevent it

Therefore it was an issue of states rights / freedom

My argument goes like this:
The south could see slavery would be taken away, as it had been in all the rest of the western world
When Lincoln, who was known to personally oppose slavery was elected it was viewed as an immediate threat to slave holders
The south wanted to leave the union, so they could keep having slaves
The north attacked the south to prevent it

Therefore it was an issue of states rights / freedom to have slaves

Into the Night wrote:
'Reparations' was already done. The plantations the slaves worked was given to the former slaves.


Wow! They must have been some rich black southerners! I missed that movie.

Into the Night wrote:this whole line of conversation came about by accusing Trump of racism.


This is again on topic because it's very "Trump" in it's attempt to "Fake news" it's way out of reality. You are making things up and ignoring facts. He's very good at getting away with that and the same methods of confusion are applied to the issue of pollution and the environment.
06-07-2020 07:28
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tgoebbles wrote: one of the many many posts in which this subject was thoroughly covered:

I'll just explain this once.

Slavery existed, but it was not the reason for everything. When a southern woman prepared her famous bread pudding because she was expecting guests, the reason was southern hospitality, not slavery.

Your absurd reasoning is that X is the reason for Y if you can simply connect X with Y through sufficient backward chaining of cause<-->effect. Therefore, by your absurd illogic, the reason for the fighting of the Civil War was not slavery, but the Big Bang. I can show that if the Big Bang had not happened then neither slavery nor the Civil War would have occurred.

Absurd? Of course! The Civil War was fought because the North attacked the South. The North attacked the South because the South was peacfully seceding and the North wasn't going to have any of that.

Once again, the Civil War would not have been fought if the North had not attacked the South, forcing the South to fight to defend themselves. The North did not attack the South over slavery; they attacked because the South tried to secede. The South did not fight for slavery, they fought to stay alive because they were being attacked by the North.

...or we can backward chain and show that the Big Bang is the reason for the Civil War.

You cannot "debunk" this because this is what happened. Regarding the reason for the fighting of the Civil War you have only two choices: A) the North attacked the South or
the Big Bang.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 11:32
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll just explain this once.
rerun. We have been over all of this. You have nothing new to say and I rebutted all of it here link
06-07-2020 15:43
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll just explain this once.
rerun. We have been over all of this.

I just wanted you to make it official.

I have nothing new to say because history does not change. However, each time you point to your previous tipping of your king as a "rebuttal."

Cat-1 violation of Local Ordinance § TMID.

I'll close this one out.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
06-07-2020 19:39
James___
★★★★★
(3170)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll just explain this once.
rerun. We have been over all of this. You have nothing new to say and I rebutted all of it here link



tmiddles, this is the BLM movement. Blacks are now killing black children. This is about inequality, right?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/05/us/atlanta-shootings-secoriea-turner-rayshard-brooks/index.html
06-07-2020 19:40
James___
★★★★★
(3170)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll just explain this once.
rerun. We have been over all of this. You have nothing new to say and I rebutted all of it here link



tmiddles, this is the BLM movement. Blacks are now killing black children. This is about inequality, right?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/05/us/atlanta-shootings-secoriea-turner-rayshard-brooks/index.html


And when we had a black president, he had lunch with a black professor who taught at Harvard and a white police officer. It was considered racist when the white police officer asked the black professor for ID when the black professor was climbing through a window of his home and had no ID.
And if it was a white person crawling in through the professor's window, what would he want a police officer to do? Nothing? How sad the situation really is.
Attached image:


Edited on 06-07-2020 20:27
06-07-2020 20:53
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13293)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll just explain this once.
rerun. We have been over all of this. You have nothing new to say and I rebutted all of it here ...deleted Holy Link...


Mantra 7...29...4a...15a...

No argument presented. Racism. Bigotry. RQAA. Spam.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 06-07-2020 20:54
06-07-2020 22:20
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
I'll close this one out.
The debate from last year? OK. It was closed out then.

I suspect you sought distraction. You didn't respond to my post:
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:Why is it such an imperative to you that humanity forget history that we would never want to repeat?
Destroying statues is making history which will also not be forgotten.

(above: Hungarians spit on the head of a destroyed statue of Stalin, 1956) Because history isn't recorded in statues it's recorded in books, photos and video. But you know that.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.
...The world agrees with me and you stand alone ... you have never visited a NAZI war museum....
GERMANY ??? Hahaha Your example of a country that agrees with you and not me is Germany? Are you drinking again IBD? You know we JUST went over that. Germany as you said:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Germany has zero Nazi monuments.
German's are guaranteed no freedoms or liberties. They can be jailed for saying something politically incorrect. NAZI symbols have been made illegal, so good luck trying to be a german trying to study WWII history; in Germany, it is required by law to be rewritten.

I would LOVE IT if we had a similar museum of the Confederacy. With photos of the slaves beaten nearly to death. Maybe an interactive exhibit where you can hear from Lee's slaves about how horrible he was.

We are hopefully moving toward having that! Maybe you and I actually agree and we'll both donate.

We already have The Legacy Museum

Edited on 06-07-2020 22:50
06-07-2020 22:44
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1214)
tmiddles wrote:...deleted egregious violation of tmiddles ordinance...

Summarily dismissed.
09-07-2020 00:49
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
You've left this unresponded to IBD. If you won't be responding let me know. ITN and GFM have both indicated they won't be.
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:Why is it such an imperative to you that humanity forget history that we would never want to repeat?
Destroying statues is making history which will also not be forgotten.

(above: Hungarians spit on the head of a destroyed statue of Stalin, 1956) Because history isn't recorded in statues it's recorded in books, photos and video. But you know that.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.
...The world agrees with me and you stand alone ... you have never visited a NAZI war museum....
GERMANY ??? Hahaha Your example of a country that agrees with you and not me is Germany? Are you drinking again IBD? You know we JUST went over that. Germany as you said:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Germany has zero Nazi monuments.
German's are guaranteed no freedoms or liberties. They can be jailed for saying something politically incorrect. NAZI symbols have been made illegal, so good luck trying to be a german trying to study WWII history; in Germany, it is required by law to be rewritten.

I would LOVE IT if we had a similar museum of the Confederacy. With photos of the slaves beaten nearly to death. Maybe an interactive exhibit where you can hear from Lee's slaves about how horrible he was.

We are hopefully moving toward having that! Maybe you and I actually agree and we'll both donate.

We already have The Legacy Museum
09-07-2020 01:16
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13293)
tmiddles wrote:
You've left this unresponded to IBD. If you won't be responding let me know. ITN and GFM have both indicated they won't be.
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:Why is it such an imperative to you that humanity forget history that we would never want to repeat?
Destroying statues is making history which will also not be forgotten.

(above: Hungarians spit on the head of a destroyed statue of Stalin, 1956) Because history isn't recorded in statues it's recorded in books, photos and video. But you know that.

IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote: I challenge you to find a place on earth today or any time in human history that agrees with you that monuments to monsters/usurpers/invaders should stand.
...The world agrees with me and you stand alone ... you have never visited a NAZI war museum....
GERMANY ??? Hahaha Your example of a country that agrees with you and not me is Germany? Are you drinking again IBD? You know we JUST went over that. Germany as you said:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:Germany has zero Nazi monuments.
German's are guaranteed no freedoms or liberties. They can be jailed for saying something politically incorrect. NAZI symbols have been made illegal, so good luck trying to be a german trying to study WWII history; in Germany, it is required by law to be rewritten.

I would LOVE IT if we had a similar museum of the Confederacy. With photos of the slaves beaten nearly to death. Maybe an interactive exhibit where you can hear from Lee's slaves about how horrible he was.

We are hopefully moving toward having that! Maybe you and I actually agree and we'll both donate.

We already have


RQAA. Answer the questions put to you:

1) What are the unambiguous definitions of Global Warming, Climate
Change and Greenhouse Effect that neither violate nor deny physics?
[Status: Unanswered]
2) Why should any rational adult believe in either Global Warming,
Climate Change or Greenhouse Effect? [Status: Unanswered]
3) How can I unambiguously demonstrate to my children thermal energy
flowing from cooler to warmer? [Status: Unanswered]
4) How can I know the temperature of a large, unspecified volume,
e.g. Denver, to within, say, 10degF with only one temperature
measurement, e.g. the Denver airport? [Status: Unanswered]
5) What are the unambiguous definitions of "race," "negro," "black
people," "white people," "brown people," "white supremacy," "white
nationalsim," "white nationalist," "white supremacist," "black
supremacist" and "racist"? [Status: Unanswered]
6) Is there an official list of races? [Status: Unanswered]
- 6a) How do I determine my own race or that of my children? [Status: Unanswered]
7) Why should any rational adult believe that there is a problem of
racism in the United States? [Status: Unanswered]
8) Why should law abiding citizens be rendered defenseless before
rampant violent crime? [Status: Unanswered]
9) Where in the 1st Amendment is "hate" prohibited such that, if
shown, a prosecutor can throw someone in jail for having had that
emotion/thought? [Status: Unanswered]
10) Why do you claim that an atmosphere only makes a planet's or
moon's solid surface hotter since you are fully aware that no place at
the bottom of earth's atmosphere ever reaches anywhere close to the
daytime temperatures of the moon's atmosphereless solid surface?
[Status: Unanswered]
11) If we were to discover that Lisa Gherardini was actually a shitty
person, would that justify Black Lives Matter storming the Louvre to
destroy the Mona Lisa? [Status: Unanswered]
12) Why should we destroy artifacts and relics pertaining to history
that we never want to forget or repeat? [Status: Unanswered]
13) The Aztecs committed genocide of many other tribes and practiced
human sacrifice; should their artwork and artifacts be destroyed?
[Status: Unanswered]
14) Why would you or anyone pretend to be a judge of what history is
to be revised or destroyed? [Status: Unanswered]
15) In what substantive/meaningful way do the platforms of Black Lives
Matter, ANTIFA, The National Organization of Women, the DNC, Communist
Party USA and Socialist Party USA ... differ? [Status: Unanswered]


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 09-07-2020 01:17
09-07-2020 01:33
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
Into the Night wrote:Answer the questions put to you:...
ITN you are abusing the board and repeatedly posting the same demands. I have answered you each time: NO I will not be responding to the scattered list of questions.

I have answered your question so stop asking.
09-07-2020 03:32
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tmiddles wrote:I have answered your question so stop asking.

Now you are pulling a "Subduction Zone."

At what point did you believe that not answering the questions equated to having answered the questions?

At what point did you believe that we would believe that not answering the questions would equate to you having answered the questions?

Anyway, I keep the status of each question with each question at the end of each questio, kind of like of the people for the people by the people. "Subduction Zoning" won't work. Anyone can simply check the official list to see which ones you have answered and which ones you have not.

The funny thing is that you could have answered them all long ago, but you REFUSE. I think the reason you won't is obvious ... just as obvious as the LAME excuse you are about to make.


Enjoy!

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
09-07-2020 03:35
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
At what point did you believe that not answering the questions equated to having answered the questions?


You're simply Trolling IBD.

I won't be doing any homework for you, obeying your commands, and I won't be answering your scattered list of questions you, ITN and GFM continue to post.

I have answered you and the answer is NO.

You are abusing the board and you should stop.
Edited on 09-07-2020 03:37
09-07-2020 03:52
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
Boy, did tgoebbles walk into that one or what?

IBdaMann wrote:I think the reason you won't is obvious ... just as obvious as the LAME excuse you are about to make.



tgoebbles wrote: You're simply Trolling IBD. I won't be doing any homework for you, obeying your commands or answering your scattered list of questions.

What's with the sudden obsession with the word "scattered"?

tgoebbles wrote:I have answered you and the answer is NO.

I think we all get that much, and a whole lot more.

Have a great day!

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
09-07-2020 04:04
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3374)
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:I have answered you and the answer is NO.

I think we all get that much,...
Great! Glad we got that settled.
09-07-2020 04:12
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7463)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
tmiddles wrote:I have answered you and the answer is NO.
I think we all get that much,...
Great! Glad we got that settled.

Yep, it was settled when we informed you that we cannot move forward in any open topic until those questions are answered.

.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
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