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One reason for social distancing/isolation



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17-04-2020 00:08
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1069)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Covid-19 isn't any more deadly, than any other seasonal respiratory infection available. Less deadly than most, since the majority of those dying, already had one foot in the grave, before being infected.
Reality by Fiat again there Harvey. You turn a blind eye to the reality shown in the graph below:



How do your reconcile that with the fantasy you've invented about Covid-19?

Just saying stuff, without giving a reason for the conclusions drawn, is the hallmark of the deniers on this forum. It applies to the climate topics as well.

The OOYA made up stuff reminds me of one of my favorite Jack Handy's:

You have yet to define the word "reality". No valid argumentation presented.
17-04-2020 00:54
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Covid-19 isn't any more deadly, than any other seasonal respiratory infection available. Less deadly than most, since the majority of those dying, already had one foot in the grave, before being infected.
Reality by Fiat again there Harvey. You turn a blind eye to the reality shown in the graph below:



How do your reconcile that with the fantasy you've invented about Covid-19?

Just saying stuff, without giving a reason for the conclusions drawn, is the hallmark of the deniers on this forum. It applies to the climate topics as well.

The OOYA made up stuff reminds me of one of my favorite Jack Handy's:



You missed it when Harvey said that he knows enough to not risk infecting his 84 year old mother. He might be concerned that if the pandemic reaches where she lives then she's a possible casualty.

As for if social distancing works, a test right here in the US.
Scott Gottlieb, President Donald Trump's former head of the Food and Drug Administration, expressed concern about the state's numbers.

"South Dakota has become one of the fastest growing hot spots in U.S., even as other parts of nation see their epidemics start to level off or slow.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/south-dakota-gov-noem-who-opposed-stay-home-order-now-n1184851

Edited on 17-04-2020 00:59
17-04-2020 06:33
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Least it's a Hockey-stick graph, Al Gore would be proud of you. Probably just as useful as the IPCC graphs and charts, and just as bogus.
I love it Harvey. You are one cooperative lab rat. So just as the climate related charts and data are dismissed as "bogus" here we have a chart of dead New Yorkers dismissed as "bogus". I'm curious Harvey what do you imagine the motive for this data crime is? Since the chart represents actually dead people (who just died) don't you think it would be difficult to fake it?

Do you have any reason at all to support this fantastic claim of yours?

gfm7175 wrote:[IBdaMann]...did not cite InfoWars as an alternative to Wikipedia. He cited it as an example of a right wing news site, after YOU brought up the matter.
I brought up INFOWARS? Why is there such a convoluted and exotic pathway to what IBD intends with the words he uses? In the topic on Wikipedia being unacceptable IBD present INFOWARS as an alternative. That is indisputable. It's in the topic. Anyone is welcome to read for themselves.
https://www.climate-debate.com/forum/wikipedia-accuracy-d6-e3013.php

gfm7175 wrote:
It's just a flu. You're fear mongering again.
The Spanish flu was a flu. Fear mongering when fear is appropriate is responsible. Fear is appropriate.

gfm7175 wrote:
You have yet to define the word "reality".
Did you need a definition? This was gone over (pointlessly as there is no real confusion on the subject) in talking about the work "fact". So yes I did define it. "reality" is the world or the state of things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional idea of them. So you might look at Covid-19 and say that in comparison with the 2018/2019 flu assortment it is "mild" by comparison and in reality it is far more deadly and dangerous. Just as someone might look at a Coral snake and explain to their friend that it was a King snake and quite harmless when in reality they misidentified it.

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN
Edited on 17-04-2020 07:12
17-04-2020 11:54
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2160)
Some people have severe food allergies, and need to be hospitalized if they consume even a little. Some, just touching can cause a reaction, not as severe. The response to Covid-19, is sort of like banning all foods, than cause severe and deadly allergic reactions. Would it be acceptable to ban all peanut products, shellfish, dairy products, eggs, since some people might die, if exposed? Obviously, banning food items, because some people are afraid of being exposed, has never happened. Well, there was a school in Central Florida, that went peanut-free for a year, because some 'nut' lawyer, wanted his peanut allergy daughter, to have a 'normal' graduation. public school experience. Her medical condition was considered a disability, so he sued, and the school district spent over $100,000 clean, sanitizing the school, removing any peanut related items from the cafeteria. Not sure what the final cost of all the monitoring, extra cleaning, search student's backpacks, peanut sniffing dogs... Basically, that girl, was privately/home schooled, risk free. Just for fun, her dad thought it would be interesting to screw over the whole school district, and disrupt the lives of almost a thousand students, and the staff at one school, for the last year. Was that reasonable, consider they already had been doing a safe alternative?
17-04-2020 12:04
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
HarveyH55 wrote:The response to Covid-19, is sort of like banning all foods, than cause severe and deadly allergic reactions.
If not banning those foods would mean that hospitals would be effectively shut down with the rush of those dying from allergic reactions. In that case we would be banning those foods.

I realize you believe that there is false information being put forward. That a lot of people in New York have not actually died and the graph I shared is "bogus".

But accepting for a moment, for the sake of argument, that the information presented is accurate, then absent an effective response hospitals would be overloaded with Covid-19 patients and the ability to deal with other illnesses would be impacted.

You should watch a documentary of smallpox if you haven't. I hadn't until a few weeks ago. Holy crap. This pandemic stuff is serious business.

"The single biggest threat to man's continued dominance on this planet is the virus," the Nobel Prize-winning biologist Joshua Lederberg once wrote.
17-04-2020 13:18
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7263)
tmiddles wrote:If not banning those foods would mean that hospitals would be effectively shut down with the rush of those dying from allergic reactions. In that case we would be banning those foods.

So the answer is "no, we should not ban peanuts and we should not disrupt the lives of everyone over there being a weak flu season."


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-04-2020 15:02
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
IBdaMann wrote:
...a weak flu season....
what do you base that assesment on?
17-04-2020 17:39
HarveyH55
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(2160)
tmiddles wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
...a weak flu season....
what do you base that assesment on?


Just look up the respiratory infection death totals, for an average cold an flu season...

Yeah, it's worst than 'normal', but not as bad as other pandemics. China gave some bad information, a week or so late. Most people don't trust China, and a virus research lab a few miles down the road, from ground zero, many believed it was an escaped bio-weapon virus. Expecting the worst, the spared no expense. We are pretty confident, it's just a normal cold virus. Trump released his plan to re-open the economy. restrictions to start relaxing, as each state feels comfortable. Jacksonville beaches are open today. Public boat ramps are opening in some counties. As are some parks. They are going to keep the social distancing, and a few other precautions in place for a while. Pretty sure the stay at home order is going to be lifted in a week or two, and we ain't going to do that again, anytime soon.

It was over-hyped to begin with. Some misinformation, and excessive caution. The slow restart on the economy, is mostly to keep things calm and orderly. Also, not to admit that we got put through all this, over basically nothing. I'm guessing, but the testing that was done, to save time and expense, was just for coronavirus, and not specific to Covid-19. There are a lot of coronaviruses, more common in animals, than people. My cat might have had one recently (eye-snot, sneezing). Humans do have to coronaviruses in the common cold category, of respiratory infections. Many of the 'positives', were coronavirus, but not necessarily Covid-19.

We can only hope, but recovery should be quick and smooth. Trump will have an easy win in November, as the democrats will be too ashamed to mention any of this, from there paranoid, germophobic foolishness. Biden should make it a complete mess, and pick Michigan's governor as his running mate, if she passes the hair-sniff-test...
18-04-2020 05:01
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Just look up the respiratory infection death totals, for an average cold an flu season...

Yeah, it's worst than 'normal', but not as bad as other pandemics. .


Ok let's look:


Yep way way way worse than "normal"

What do you mean by other pandemics? Smallpox? The black death?
18-04-2020 05:12
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
Harvey,
It's the infection rate that's causing the large and growing number of deaths. It's not the case fatality rate. It's the fatality rate for just living in dangerous places.
This thing is more contagious than you think. The difference is subtle but real.

Harvey, You said that covid is a just a normal cold virus. What world do you live in? This isn't normal. How far wrong can a person be?
Edited on 18-04-2020 05:17
18-04-2020 05:25
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2160)
keepit wrote:
Harvey,
It's the infection rate that's causing the large and growing number of deaths. It's not the case fatality rate. It's the fatality rate for just living in dangerous places.
This thing is more contagious than you think. The difference is subtle but real.


We can't even come close to actually guess on the infection rate, since that is a function of the number of test results. Testing has been very limited, to a very specific group. The number of tests being given, and processed, has been increasing rapidly as well. Is it the virus spreading, or the testing spreading to more people?

We are only given very limited results, and data, everyday. Basically, new positive results, new hospitalizations, and deaths. We don't know how many tests were given. I'm pretty sure that a hell of a lot of tests have been given, and a very small percentage are coming back positive. Sort of like climate change, just throw some numbers out there, and interpret them to scare.
18-04-2020 05:42
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
You can rationalize all you want. It's highly contagious. And that's the problem. Things would have been much worse if it were not for distancing. Just look at cruise ships, rest homes, New Orleans after mardi gras, and that aircraft carrier etc. It wasn't possible to distance in those instances and look what happened.
18-04-2020 05:45
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Just look up the respiratory infection death totals, for an average cold an flu season...

Yeah, it's worst than 'normal', but not as bad as other pandemics. .


Ok let's look:


Yep way way way worse than "normal"

What do you mean by other pandemics? Smallpox? The black death?



This link has an interactive graph for New York. It also shows that in the last 10 days that have gone from 500 deaths a day to around 200. They're showing a significant downward trend. This is where if they could get everyone to wear masks, then they might be able to start getting things back to normal. If wearing a mask keeps the numbers low then would people be willing to wear one?

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page
Edited on 18-04-2020 05:46
18-04-2020 05:49
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
James,
I don't see why that link shows such a smaller number of deaths per day than the cable news.
I don't think reductions in intubations is quite as significant as as it was. The ER doc are turning some patients on their stomachs and giving them oxygen and cpap rather than intubations/ventilators.
Edited on 18-04-2020 05:57
18-04-2020 07:07
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
keepit wrote:
James,
I don't see why that link shows such a smaller number of deaths per day than the cable news.
I don't think reductions in intubations is quite as significant as as it was. The ER doc are turning some patients on their stomachs and giving them oxygen and cpap rather than intubations/ventilators.



With that information, they list confirmed deaths at about 7,800. Probable deaths are about 4,300. It's possible that the news is combining both totals.
18-04-2020 07:09
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
Thanks.
18-04-2020 18:31
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2160)
Wearing a mask sucks. I was given one at work, because of the county mandate. Fortunately, they didn't require us to actually wear them at work. Tried it on, restricted air-flow, took it off. I do physical work, need to breath freely. I don't have a cough or cold, nothing to spray on others. Mask wouldn't prevent me from getting infected. It's a large warehouse, little over a thousand employees. Some practice the recommended measures, but the vast majority, just do what we normally do. No know positive cases, yet. Even stranger, no rumors, no stories of friends, family,or neighbor, even testing positive. We have people from 4 counties, that I know of, and work closely with. Orange county is a hotspot. Seems like there should have been some stories, of a personal experience. I finding it's about the same around town here too.

Don't think its been asked here, but has anybody on this sight even been tested? Does anybody have a first-hand account, of somebody around them testing positive, being hospitalized, or dying, from Covid-19?

For a contagion, spreading like a California wildfire, I'm no one seems to be smelling the smoke.
18-04-2020 19:55
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(12944)
keepit wrote:
James,
I don't see why that link shows such a smaller number of deaths per day than the cable news.
I don't think reductions in intubations is quite as significant as as it was. The ER doc are turning some patients on their stomachs and giving them oxygen and cpap rather than intubations/ventilators.

Comparing one set of random numbers against another set of random numbers is pointless.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
18-04-2020 19:59
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(12944)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Wearing a mask sucks. I was given one at work, because of the county mandate. Fortunately, they didn't require us to actually wear them at work. Tried it on, restricted air-flow, took it off. I do physical work, need to breath freely. I don't have a cough or cold, nothing to spray on others. Mask wouldn't prevent me from getting infected. It's a large warehouse, little over a thousand employees. Some practice the recommended measures, but the vast majority, just do what we normally do. No know positive cases, yet. Even stranger, no rumors, no stories of friends, family,or neighbor, even testing positive. We have people from 4 counties, that I know of, and work closely with. Orange county is a hotspot. Seems like there should have been some stories, of a personal experience. I finding it's about the same around town here too.

Don't think its been asked here, but has anybody on this sight even been tested? Does anybody have a first-hand account, of somebody around them testing positive, being hospitalized, or dying, from Covid-19?

For a contagion, spreading like a California wildfire, I'm no one seems to be smelling the smoke.


Since the chance of getting infected and hospitalized for Covid-19 is 1 in 30060 (using CDC numbers), I would say it's not likely you will hear such an account here, though it is possible.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
18-04-2020 23:27
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Wearing a mask sucks. I was given one at work, because of the county mandate. Fortunately, they didn't require us to actually wear them at work. Tried it on, restricted air-flow, took it off. I do physical work, need to breath freely. I don't have a cough or cold, nothing to spray on others. Mask wouldn't prevent me from getting infected. It's a large warehouse, little over a thousand employees. Some practice the recommended measures, but the vast majority, just do what we normally do. No know positive cases, yet. Even stranger, no rumors, no stories of friends, family,or neighbor, even testing positive. We have people from 4 counties, that I know of, and work closely with. Orange county is a hotspot. Seems like there should have been some stories, of a personal experience. I finding it's about the same around town here too.

Don't think its been asked here, but has anybody on this sight even been tested? Does anybody have a first-hand account, of somebody around them testing positive, being hospitalized, or dying, from Covid-19?

For a contagion, spreading like a California wildfire, I'm no one seems to be smelling the smoke.


Since the chance of getting infected and hospitalized for Covid-19 is 1 in 30060 (using CDC numbers), I would say it's not likely you will hear such an account here, though it is possible.



Ummm, actually cruise ships and aircraft carriers tell a completely different story. What was it our Honorable President Trump said about 1 Princess cruise line ship that skipped Mexico and was heading back to San Francisco? Don't let it port. It will double the number of coronavirus cases in the US. And as Harvey said, our Honorable President Trump does not lie. One ship can make the US look bad.
Kind of shows if people were given the option of either wear a mask or take 2 to 3 weeks off of work, there wouldn't have been a problem. But prevention requires 2 things. A public that can understand basic cause and effect and information that is accurate.

https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2020-carnival-cruise-coronavirus/

https://thehill.com/policy/international/europe/493352-france-investigating-more-than-1000-coronavirus-cases-on-aircraft
Edited on 18-04-2020 23:29
19-04-2020 00:42
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
Into the Night wrote:
keepit wrote:
... number of deaths per day...intubations ....

Comparing one set of random numbers against another set of random numbers is pointless.
Ah so the number of deaths reported by doctors are "randon numbers" aye ITN? Nothing at all accurate or reliable about them?

Yet in the Data Mine you consider hurricane numbers reported to be accurate and presumably not random. What's the difference?

Into the Night wrote:
1 in 30060 (using CDC numbers)
FALSE! What CDC numbers?

If you are going to cite a source then do so.

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN
Edited on 19-04-2020 00:44
19-04-2020 03:53
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
40,000 deaths divided by 330,000,000 people equals 1 in about 8000 and it is far from over.
The death total has doubled in the last week (20,000 to 40,000). If that doubling time continues for another two weeks there will 160,000 deaths. Distancing has kept it that "low". I don't know what is going to happen if the country reopens in the next month or so, maybe it would be ok in montana and wyoming.
The situation is precarious. Mistakes could be even more terrible.
Edited on 19-04-2020 04:01
19-04-2020 04:14
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
keepit wrote:
40,000 deaths divided by 330,000 equals 1 in about 8000 and it is far from over.
The death total has doubled in the last week (20,000 to 40,000). If that doubling time continues for another month there will 160,000 deaths. Distancing has kept it that "low". I don't know what is going to happen if the country reopens in the next month or so, maybe it would be ok in montana and wyoming.


New York as rural areas too and we're talking about the whole states numbers.
If one were to assume that New York is only unique in it's timing (that there is not some New York gene that is exciting the virus) we have seen, from Just NYC:


The graph here shows:
that over the past 5 years there are roughly 400 flue deaths per week in the entire state. Here we have 2500 per week. So let's say an extra 2000 in a week. New York is 20 million, the country is 328 million. So if what has happened in New York happened across the country we'd have an extra 31,000 more deaths, per week.

Of course now we have TRUMP actively encouraging revolts against the state orders:
trump-s-liberate-tweets-extremists-see-call-arms

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dbU3p78eAg

TRUMPS folks without masks, handing out candy bare handed. It's the jackass in chief in action. Blocking ambulances trying to get to the hospital.

He is just a monster.
19-04-2020 04:30
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2160)
Your bell curve looks like the curve, social distancing was suppose to flatten out... Didn't work, or was it a lie? Like any new, respiratory infection, the first couple of years, kill a lot of unhealthy people. Just the natural order of the universe. You can try and fight nature, but you will eventual die anyway, limited lifespan. You can uses your time on earth, actually living, or you can hide in your basement, and try to cheat the clock.
19-04-2020 05:33
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Your bell curve looks like the curve, social distancing was suppose to flatten out... Didn't work, or was it a lie? Like any new, respiratory infection, the first couple of years, kill a lot of unhealthy people. Just the natural order of the universe. You can try and fight nature, but you will eventual die anyway, limited lifespan. You can uses your time on earth, actually living, or you can hide in your basement, and try to cheat the clock.


It's a bell curve either way. I think are referring to this:


You have dismissed all the information as bogus haven't you Harvey? Nothing can be known? Is there any data you trust?

You directly indicated the graph I shared on deaths by week in New York was "bogus" so you tell me.

And we have very successfully fought mother nature and a lot fewer people have died as a result.

Humans are very effective in this area:


You should be proud of and confident in this branch of science. It's the best thing to ever happen to us as a species.
19-04-2020 23:18
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(12944)
tmiddles wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Your bell curve looks like the curve, social distancing was suppose to flatten out... Didn't work, or was it a lie? Like any new, respiratory infection, the first couple of years, kill a lot of unhealthy people. Just the natural order of the universe. You can try and fight nature, but you will eventual die anyway, limited lifespan. You can uses your time on earth, actually living, or you can hide in your basement, and try to cheat the clock.


It's a bell curve either way. I think are referring to this:


You have dismissed all the information as bogus haven't you Harvey? Nothing can be known? Is there any data you trust?

You directly indicated the graph I shared on deaths by week in New York was "bogus" so you tell me.

And we have very successfully fought mother nature and a lot fewer people have died as a result.

Humans are very effective in this area:


You should be proud of and confident in this branch of science. It's the best thing to ever happen to us as a species.

This is not science. It's not mathematics either. It's random numbers.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
20-04-2020 02:02
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Least it's a Hockey-stick graph, Al Gore would be proud of you. Probably just as useful as the IPCC graphs and charts, and just as bogus.

Like most health people, I'm not deathly afraid of catching a cold. It's not going to kill me. I know enough not to go visit my 84 y.o. mother, when I'm not feeling well. It's possible to handle a cold, and still be responsible, without hiding in the basement. You been self-isolating so long, it's normal living to you. It's not normal, it's not living, it's paranoia.

I've got it better than most, since I have an essential job, and still get out, in a mostly normal routine. There are some restrictions, and inconveniences, but I can still do plenty of stuff around the house, like getting a head start on hurricane season preparations. Always things to do.



This sounds like paranoia if it's your family. It seems you only care about yourself and your family. That doesn't allow for a discussion, just a waste of time.

I know enough not to go visit my 84 y.o. mother, when I'm not feeling well. It's possible to handle a cold, and still be responsible, without hiding in the basement. You been self-isolating so long, it's normal living to you. It's not normal, it's not living, it's paranoia.

Edited on 20-04-2020 02:11
20-04-2020 03:34
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2160)
James___ wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Least it's a Hockey-stick graph, Al Gore would be proud of you. Probably just as useful as the IPCC graphs and charts, and just as bogus.

Like most health people, I'm not deathly afraid of catching a cold. It's not going to kill me. I know enough not to go visit my 84 y.o. mother, when I'm not feeling well. It's possible to handle a cold, and still be responsible, without hiding in the basement. You been self-isolating so long, it's normal living to you. It's not normal, it's not living, it's paranoia.

I've got it better than most, since I have an essential job, and still get out, in a mostly normal routine. There are some restrictions, and inconveniences, but I can still do plenty of stuff around the house, like getting a head start on hurricane season preparations. Always things to do.



This sounds like paranoia if it's your family. It seems you only care about yourself and your family. That doesn't allow for a discussion, just a waste of time.


What should I be doing in my spare time? Visit some nursing homes, an sit down and talk to some elderly people, I've never met before, scare the crap out of them? knocks doors around my neighborhood, get to know the neighbors better? The state has us ordered to stay home. The county, has a curfew, and requires masks in public. No criminal penalties, so guess it doesn't matter. I care enough to follow the mandates (mostly), and not putting others at risk (most of the time). Still got my full time job, business is good.
20-04-2020 05:31
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
HarveyH55 wrote:
James___ wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Least it's a Hockey-stick graph, Al Gore would be proud of you. Probably just as useful as the IPCC graphs and charts, and just as bogus.

Like most health people, I'm not deathly afraid of catching a cold. It's not going to kill me. I know enough not to go visit my 84 y.o. mother, when I'm not feeling well. It's possible to handle a cold, and still be responsible, without hiding in the basement. You been self-isolating so long, it's normal living to you. It's not normal, it's not living, it's paranoia.

I've got it better than most, since I have an essential job, and still get out, in a mostly normal routine. There are some restrictions, and inconveniences, but I can still do plenty of stuff around the house, like getting a head start on hurricane season preparations. Always things to do.



This sounds like paranoia if it's your family. It seems you only care about yourself and your family. That doesn't allow for a discussion, just a waste of time.


What should I be doing in my spare time? Visit some nursing homes, an sit down and talk to some elderly people, I've never met before, scare the crap out of them? knocks doors around my neighborhood, get to know the neighbors better? The state has us ordered to stay home. The county, has a curfew, and requires masks in public. No criminal penalties, so guess it doesn't matter. I care enough to follow the mandates (mostly), and not putting others at risk (most of the time). Still got my full time job, business is good.



You can post anything you like and you do. I just read on Yahoo where a lot of Americans don't know how many states are included in the NYC metropolitan area. Too many people were saying "they didn't give me the answer".

So what is President Trump and his national emergency? The checks being mailed out has his name on them and not the Secretary of the Treasury.
Please stick to this 1, lone item. Is President Trump lying about coronavirus being a national emergency? Either he is or he isn't. And I will give you the option of saying that President Trump is stupid.
20-04-2020 09:28
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:...Humans are very effective in this area:

You should be proud of and confident in this branch of science. It's the best thing to ever happen to us as a species.

This is not science. It's not mathematics either. It's random numbers.

ITN you are claiming the chart of small pox and other disease cases from 1920 to 2017 shown above, identified sources including World Health Organization and the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation, consists of "random numbers"?
21-04-2020 05:34
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(12944)
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
tmiddles wrote:...Humans are very effective in this area:

You should be proud of and confident in this branch of science. It's the best thing to ever happen to us as a species.

This is not science. It's not mathematics either. It's random numbers.

ITN you are claiming the chart of small pox and other disease cases from 1920 to 2017 shown above, identified sources including World Health Organization and the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation, consists of "random numbers"?

Yup.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
21-04-2020 07:00
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7263)
tmiddles wrote:This is not science. It's not mathematics either. It's random numbers.

ITN you are claiming the chart of small pox and other disease cases from 1920 to 2017 shown above, identified sources including World Health Organization and the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation, consists of "random numbers"?[/quote]
... and that you are naive and gullible.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
21-04-2020 10:10
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3316)
Into the Night wrote:
Yup.
Care to elaborate?

Is there something that is NOT "Random Numbers" you could contrast it with?

Your example of Moana Loa Data from your Data Mine thread perhaps? ITN's DATA MINE thread where he presents Moana Loa CO2 record as an example to follow
Those are presumably NOT random numbers?

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/random-number
random number
noun Statistics.
a number chosen by a random sampling, as from a table (random number table) or generated by a computer.

https://www.emathzone.com/tutorials/basic-statistics/examples-of-random-numbers.html
"Example:
Assume that a fair die is to be rolled ten times. Without rolling the die, obtain the possible outcomes using random digits."

I fail to see how a doctor recording the number of patients diagnosed with a disease in a given year fits that definition.

Are these also collections of "random numbers"?
DJIA
US Census
Your checking account balance
the nutritional information on a gallon of Milk

IBD I take it from your vague comment you agree with ITN? (though I'm not sure what ITN is thinking)

"Good tests kill flawed theories; we remain alive to guess again." - Karl Popper
ITN/IBD Fraud exposed:  The 2nd LTD add on claiming radiance from cooler bodies can't be absorbed Max Planck debunks, they can't explain:net-thermal-radiation-you-in-a-room-as-a-reference & Proof: no data is valid for IBD or ITN
21-04-2020 10:32
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7263)
tmiddles wrote:
Into the Night wrote: Yup.

Care to elaborate?


He has elaborated many times. Many, many times. How will one more time be any different? Are you claiming that you will somehow pay atention this time? Have you since learned any statistical math?


I didn't think so.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
21-04-2020 21:10
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(12944)
tmiddles wrote:
...deleted Mantras 29...38b...25g...4c...
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/random-number
random number
noun Statistics.
a number chosen by a random sampling, as from a table (random number table) or generated by a computer.

Not statistics. Dictionaries do not define words. No dictionary owns any word. Mantra 4b.
tmiddles wrote:
https://www.emathzone.com/tutorials/basic-statistics/examples-of-random-numbers.html
"Example:
Assume that a fair die is to be rolled ten times. Without rolling the die, obtain the possible outcomes using random digits."

Contrived paradox. I have already discussed this with you. Mantras 25f...29
tmiddles wrote:
I fail to see how a doctor recording the number of patients diagnosed with a disease in a given year fits that definition.

Because it isn't a chart of doctors recording the number of patients diagnosed. Mantras 25g...4d
tmiddles wrote:
...deleted Mantras 16c...29...2...29...


No argument presented. RQAA.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
22-04-2020 17:59
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1069)
James___ wrote:
This link has an interactive graph for New York. It also shows that in the last 10 days that have gone from 500 deaths a day to around 200. They're showing a significant downward trend. This is where if they could get everyone to wear masks, then they might be able to start getting things back to normal. If wearing a mask keeps the numbers low then would people be willing to wear one?

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page

Masks do not stop a virus. Virions are smaller than the size of particulates that an N95 mask will filter out.
22-04-2020 18:16
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
gfm7175 wrote:
James___ wrote:
This link has an interactive graph for New York. It also shows that in the last 10 days that have gone from 500 deaths a day to around 200. They're showing a significant downward trend. This is where if they could get everyone to wear masks, then they might be able to start getting things back to normal. If wearing a mask keeps the numbers low then would people be willing to wear one?

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page

Masks do not stop a virus. Virions are smaller than the size of particulates that an N95 mask will filter out.



And yet every time I've had surgery, all medical personnel in the operating room are wearing masks to reduce the risk of exposing the patient to germs they might have. After all, they work in a hospital and are constantly exposed to a myriad number of bacteria or viruses. But shutting down the economy works for me. It's actually helping me


What is it everyone is discussing? What are they saying? Can't they see what they do? Or as Harvey55 says, he doesn't care who he gets sick as long as it's not HIS family. Kind of why shutting down the economy was necessary. People wouldn't wear a mask for a month to keep life as normal as possible. I mean restaurants could've stayed open if the tables weren't next to each other. Movie theatres could've stayed open and just limited the seating. But that's inconvenient, right? Sadly Americans are an all or nothing people.
Either republican or Democrat but no middle ground. Like between North and South Korea with their DMZ. And yet coming out of this, I will have opportunities to have a better life while for many Americans which includes small business owners, it could take years to recover from this.
Edited on 22-04-2020 18:46
22-04-2020 18:47
gfm7175Profile picture★★★★☆
(1069)
James___ wrote:
gfm7175 wrote:
James___ wrote:
This link has an interactive graph for New York. It also shows that in the last 10 days that have gone from 500 deaths a day to around 200. They're showing a significant downward trend. This is where if they could get everyone to wear masks, then they might be able to start getting things back to normal. If wearing a mask keeps the numbers low then would people be willing to wear one?

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page

Masks do not stop a virus. Virions are smaller than the size of particulates that an N95 mask will filter out.



And yet every time I've had surgery, all medical personnel in the operating room are wearing masks to reduce the risk of exposing the patient to germs they might have. After all, they work in a hospital and are constantly exposed to a myriad number of bacteria or viruses. But shutting down the economy works for me. It's actually helping me

It's not helping you at all, dude. Printing money out of thin air is not a good thing.

Virions are considerably smaller than the particulate size that masks are rated for. Masks will not stop a virus.
22-04-2020 18:54
keepit
★★★★☆
(1607)
The mask are designed to stop the droplets that contain the virus.
22-04-2020 19:02
James___
★★★★★
(2948)
keepit wrote:
The mask are designed to stop the droplets that contain the virus.



Most people don't get this, Thanks for explaining it.
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