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It will be Very Hot and very Wet--We've exceeded 415ppm of Carbon Dioxide for the first Time since th


It will be Very Hot and very Wet--We've exceeded 415ppm of Carbon Dioxide for the first Time since the Pli16-05-2019 11:55
Tai Hai Chen
★★★★☆
(1061)
https://www.juancole.com/2019/05/415-co2-pliocene.html
16-05-2019 19:38
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Basically what they are saying is that the co2 levels are higher than they have been since the early days of the ice age. Co2 could not prevent the ice age, nor can it end the ice age. Unless the ice age ends, it can not get as hot as they predict.
16-05-2019 20:28
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
Basically what they are saying is that the co2 levels are higher than they have been since the early days of the ice age. Co2 could not prevent the ice age, nor can it end the ice age. Unless the ice age ends, it can not get as hot as they predict.


Predicting the temperature of the Earth is pointless. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth. Talking about ice ages is pointless. It has nothing to do with weather today.

You ARE correct that CO2 has no capability to warm the Earth.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 21:02
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(4612)
Into the Night wrote:Predicting the temperature of the Earth is pointless. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth.

... but we can measure the temperature anomalies and just not mention the lack of any margin of error.








Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
16-05-2019 21:02
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
No one is trying to predict the weather, only climate. SCIENTIST can actually figure things like that out despite your lack of belief in anything other than your religion.
16-05-2019 21:06
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(4612)
dehammer wrote: No one is trying to predict the weather, only climate.

You have never defined "Climate," much less in any formal manner such that science can be applied to it. Your statement here is meaningless.

dehammer wrote: SCIENTIST can actually figure things like that out despite your lack of belief in anything other than your religion.

Scientists are not able to work with undefined terms. Religious clergy, on the other hand, make their living off them.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
16-05-2019 21:12
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1173)
I don't understand the graph, it doesn't look like a Hockey-stick, and there is no margin of error listed.



I guess a professor of history is qualified to give accurate date of a time when there were thermometers yet. Wonder what books he got the CO2 readings from, don't recall any written language that far back. Gee, I have an AA degree, wonder if that qualifies me as a potential Climate Scientist, entitled to some generous grant money...

It is interesting how the red on the graph is almost a sine wave, the black line, guess would be the average, is almost linear, instead of hockey-stick logarithmic. Does that mean we've been slowing down on our global CO2 production, since the Al Gore movie? Least the author was generous, and gave us another 1,000 years, instead of 81 we got left from the IPCC...
16-05-2019 21:20
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Climate is the average range of weather for a given time for a given area. Global climate is the average range of weather for entire global, usually over several years.

When they determine temperature of the earth SCIENTIST use multiple proxies from the entire global to show what the temperature has been in the past.

Of course since this is contrary to your religious belief, im sure you will tell me its impossible for them to know anything about the earth 10000 years ago since the earth was only created 5000 years ago.
16-05-2019 21:41
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1173)
Different religions have different beliefs. But God already knows how the book ends. He created fossil fuels for us to burn, I'm sure it's in the book some place... Or maybe it's the stuff the devil use to keep it nice and hot, in HELL.
16-05-2019 21:45
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(4612)
HarveyH55 wrote:
I don't understand the graph, it doesn't look like a Hockey-stick, and there is no margin of error listed.



You are right to question this graph. There are some obvious problems with it right off the bat:

1. All charts intended to generate fear and panic over atmospheric CO2 levels need to start tracking as of 21 February 1848, when history began.



2. Not only is there no margin of error listed but, as you might very well expect, the supposed dataset used to make the chart is kept secret. Of course we all presume the dataset exists. Absolutely. Oh sure. No doubt whatsoever. We can't expect the good people who make the charts to do our homework for us!

3. Did you notice the red squiggle? Did you notice how the amplitude doesn't vary? It's the same sine wave over the length of the black regression line. I think I'm going to have to call BS on this one.

4. Who owns (made) this chart? Is it the NOAA Earth System Research Laboratory in Boulder, Colorado or is it the Scripps Institute of Oceanography in San Diego, California? Whose permission do you need to reproduce it for commercial purposes? ... or were the little graphic icons just thrown onto an obvious fabrication for which there really is no data so as to create the impression of authority? Hmmm....

5. Why are CO2 charts always of measurements taken at Mauna Loa, a volcano that spews out CO2? Aren't scientists supposed to avoid egregiously skewing their data? A rational person has to assume that the earth's average CO2 levels are FAR lower than what is being reported at Mauna Loa.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
16-05-2019 21:47
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
No one is trying to predict the weather,
Sure they are. It's the Englishman's favorite topic. See your local weather channel or website. Also see the FAA flight service center website and maritime service websites. They're pretty good about predicting weather pretty accurately 24 hours out. It's like watching waves on the sea and predicting when they will reach shore.
dehammer wrote:
only climate.
Undefined use of the word. Void argument fallacy. Which climate do you think anyone is predicting?
dehammer wrote:
SCIENTIST can actually figure things like that out
Science isn't scientists. Science is a set of falsifiable theories.
dehammer wrote:
despite your lack of belief in anything other than your religion.

Science isn't a religion. Neither is math. The Church of Global Warming, on the other hand, IS a fundamentalist style religion.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 21:57
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1173)
You'd think CO2 monitoring stations would be every where. CO2 the cause of all evil, death and destruction, you'd figure everyone would want to keep a close watch. Really surprised that there aren't monitoring stations on the consumer level. Thought about building my own, but a sensor that could reasonably hand the job, out doors, is around $500. Little pricey, for a random number generator. It real is odd, that we seldom hear about other stations, or how their numbers compare. I'd guess that Mauna Loa stays relatively stable and predictable, where the others, jump around quite a bit, generally give lower readings. Basically, barely support the cause, on a good day, which is very often.
16-05-2019 21:59
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
HarveyH55 wrote:
I don't understand the graph, it doesn't look like a Hockey-stick, and there is no margin of error listed.


Very good. This graph is produced by the Mauna Loa observatory on the Big Island of Hawaii. It represents what Mauna Loa is reporting, not anything like a global CO2 content.
HarveyH55 wrote:
I guess a professor of history is qualified to give accurate date of a time when there were thermometers yet.

They do know the dates the modern thermometers was invented, and they know the dates the scales they use were invented.

Of course, observing things like freezing lakes, ponds, or when water boils at sea level give you an idea of temperature at those points in time.
HarveyH55 wrote:
Wonder what books he got the CO2 readings from, don't recall any written language that far back. Gee, I have an AA degree, wonder if that qualifies me as a potential Climate Scientist, entitled to some generous grant money...

Go matriculate now at your local university offering such a degree. You too can spend your money on them and get a Holy Blessing to preach in the Church of Global Warming.
HarveyH55 wrote:
It is interesting how the red on the graph is almost a sine wave,

The effects of vegetation becoming active and dormant for that hemisphere through the seasons.
HarveyH55 wrote:
the black line, guess would be the average, is almost linear, instead of hockey-stick logarithmic.

If it's an average, it's not data. Statistical math cannot use cooked data.

Another problem with the Mauna Loa data is the mysterious LACK of anomalies despite varying volcanic activity in the area from time to time. You should see that in the data. Where is it?

Obviously Mauna Loa is cooking their data. It's utterly useless.

HarveyH55 wrote:
Does that mean we've been slowing down on our global CO2 production, since the Al Gore movie? Least the author was generous, and gave us another 1,000 years, instead of 81 we got left from the IPCC...

Who knows? It's not possible to measure the CO2 concentration of Earth. There are not enough stations, and Mauna Loa is obviously cooking their data. In addition, CO2 is not uniformly distributed in the atmosphere. It comes down to the margin of error thing again.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 22:06
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
Climate is the average range of weather for a given time for a given area.
How long a time? From when to when? How big an area? Is it fixed in size? Are there definable boundaries for this area?
dehammer wrote:
Global climate is the average range of weather for entire global, usually over several years.
There is no such thing as global weather, so there is no such thing as global climate.
dehammer wrote:
When they determine temperature of the earth SCIENTIST use multiple proxies from the entire global to show what the temperature has been in the past.

False authority fallacy. Proxies do not tell you the temperature of anything.
dehammer wrote:
Of course since this is contrary to your religious belief,
Inversion fallacy. You are projecting your religion on others again.
dehammer wrote:
im sure you will tell me its impossible for them to know anything about the earth 10000 years ago
That's right.
dehammer wrote:
since the earth was only created 5000 years ago.

The age of Earth is unknown.

You were not there to observe anything 5000 years ago or 10000 years ago.

Science has no theories about past unobserved events. Such theories are unfalsifiable. They therefore remain the circular arguments that all theories begin as. Such theories can neither be proven True or False....ever.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 22:15
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Once again, your religious beliefs are spotlighting themselves.
16-05-2019 22:18
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Different religions have different beliefs. But God already knows how the book ends. He created fossil fuels for us to burn, I'm sure it's in the book some place... Or maybe it's the stuff the devil use to keep it nice and hot, in HELL.


The very word 'hell' comes from Norse mythology. It was incorporated into Christianity by those familiar with that culture and mythology. Is this a mistranslation of that portion of the Bible that refers to where Satan is bound? Is this a colorful description of the wrath of God upon Satan?

Is the idea that hell is hot a literal reading of what amounts to either a mistranslation, a colorful description., or the intentional corruption of a book of the Bible at some point? Could it be a comparison to what happened to cities of Sodom and Gomorrah?, which were destroyed by fire?

Who knows? These kinds of details the Bible leaves rather vague. Neither does it really matter. The basic message from the Bible is about Jesus Christ and why he came to Earth, and about the costs of not following the laws of God and blessings available to those who do.

Whether you believe in Jesus Christ or not is not the issue here. The topic has turned to the discussion of the Bible itself and is therefore considered a fact at this time.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 22:24
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
HarveyH55 wrote:
You'd think CO2 monitoring stations would be every where. CO2 the cause of all evil, death and destruction, you'd figure everyone would want to keep a close watch. Really surprised that there aren't monitoring stations on the consumer level. Thought about building my own, but a sensor that could reasonably hand the job, out doors, is around $500. Little pricey, for a random number generator. It real is odd, that we seldom hear about other stations, or how their numbers compare. I'd guess that Mauna Loa stays relatively stable and predictable, where the others, jump around quite a bit, generally give lower readings. Basically, barely support the cause, on a good day, which is very often.


It's not an easy instrument to operate, since water vapor also affects the readings. To measure CO2, you MUST eliminate the effects of water vapor. You can't just measure water vapor as an absolute value, since humidity is dependent on air pressure and temperature. A humidity meter produces a percentage value and can determine a 'dew point', or where the water vapor would condense out should the temperature be lowered to a certain value.

Also, it cannot measure where the CO2 came from.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 22:24
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
Once again, your religious beliefs are spotlighting themselves.


And what religious beliefs are you referring to? Void argument fallacy.


The Parrot Killer
16-05-2019 22:46
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Your anti science religion.
16-05-2019 23:22
James___
★★★★☆
(1468)
Into the Night wrote:


The very word 'hell' comes from Norse mythology. It was incorporated into Christianity by those familiar with that culture and mythology. Is this a mistranslation of that portion of the Bible that refers to where Satan is bound? Is this a colorful description of the wrath of God upon Satan?




When you pronounce god helse it sounds like go to hell because Engleske is spoken different than Norske. So when an Englisher says "go to hell" he's actually saying Good Health!
That is so funny it could be true. And when God Helse is said sarcastically then it would sound like the English go to hell. This is hilarious. I mean I've had people tell me that they're handicapped because they're American and now I can understand why. Ya'all just don't know the difference between sarcasm and being wished good health.
And what's even funnier ya'all probably don't know what the real climate threat might be. But at the end of the day what's sad is that you guys probably find nothing interesting. And when there's nothing left to discover, then what? Decay as a society?
17-05-2019 00:50
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
Your anti science religion.


I have given you the theories you are ignoring. IBdaMann has been kind enough to reproduce the equations for them so you don't even have to Google for them. You call these theories 'anti science religion'??

Inversion fallacy. YOU are the one denying these theories. Not me.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 17-05-2019 00:50
17-05-2019 00:51
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
No, you throw out scientific terms as if it means anything, then ridicules anything that proves that the earth has been around more than 5000 years.
17-05-2019 00:51
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
James___ wrote:
Into the Night wrote:


The very word 'hell' comes from Norse mythology. It was incorporated into Christianity by those familiar with that culture and mythology. Is this a mistranslation of that portion of the Bible that refers to where Satan is bound? Is this a colorful description of the wrath of God upon Satan?




When you pronounce god helse it sounds like go to hell because Engleske is spoken different than Norske. So when an Englisher says "go to hell" he's actually saying Good Health!
That is so funny it could be true. And when God Helse is said sarcastically then it would sound like the English go to hell. This is hilarious. I mean I've had people tell me that they're handicapped because they're American and now I can understand why. Ya'all just don't know the difference between sarcasm and being wished good health.
And what's even funnier ya'all probably don't know what the real climate threat might be. But at the end of the day what's sad is that you guys probably find nothing interesting. And when there's nothing left to discover, then what? Decay as a society?


Which climate do you think is a threat to you?


The Parrot Killer
17-05-2019 00:57
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
No, you throw out scientific terms as if it means anything,

They do. You just discard them.
dehammer wrote:
then ridicules anything that proves that the earth has been around more than 5000 years.

The age of the Earth is unknown. Nothing proves the age of the Earth for any number of years before your lifetime. I don't claim to know the age of the Earth. I really don't care what it is.

YOU are the only one trying to prove the age of the Earth. Circular argument fallacy. You cannot use a circular argument as a proof. Your belief in the age of the Earth is a religion.


The Parrot Killer
17-05-2019 01:34
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
You just discard them.
Only when you misused them, such as trying to use a formula for a black body radiation to determine something that deals with gravity.
17-05-2019 01:58
HarveyH55
★★★★☆
(1173)
James___ wrote:
Into the Night wrote:


The very word 'hell' comes from Norse mythology. It was incorporated into Christianity by those familiar with that culture and mythology. Is this a mistranslation of that portion of the Bible that refers to where Satan is bound? Is this a colorful description of the wrath of God upon Satan?




When you pronounce god helse it sounds like go to hell because Engleske is spoken different than Norske. So when an Englisher says "go to hell" he's actually saying Good Health!
That is so funny it could be true. And when God Helse is said sarcastically then it would sound like the English go to hell. This is hilarious. I mean I've had people tell me that they're handicapped because they're American and now I can understand why. Ya'all just don't know the difference between sarcasm and being wished good health.
And what's even funnier ya'all probably don't know what the real climate threat might be. But at the end of the day what's sad is that you guys probably find nothing interesting. And when there's nothing left to discover, then what? Decay as a society?


The English people are funny in many ways, some not in such a good way...

The only thing threatening about Climatology, is higher taxes, loss of freedoms and liberties, and being forced to buy a shiny new electric car, which I'll probably would be able to repair/maintain myself, and have to pay someone to do the work (hopefully), and getting billed for parts and labor, for things that make no sense at all, but costs a lot of money.

The kids that were born, and raise on this Climatology crap, are adults now, they vote, some will run for public office, attracting the votes of other clueless, brainwashed youths. Each time we get a democrat president, we lose a little more. Obama sold mass transit trains, though not as 'Green' as the Warmest demand, diesel, and CO2 producers. Even though the mas-transit bus system Clinton sold us, doesn't get the ridership promised, actual many run empty most of the time. The Florida people fought both the light-rail, and bullet ObamaTrains, but the government still managed to get both passed. Fortunately, we dodge the bullet train, by electing a new governor, but it was too late on the light-rail. He narrowly avoided the high-speed rail. The bus service is highly subsidized, and so is SunRail. SunRail's ridership fell sharply, after the first few months, not many repeat customers. SunRail is accident prone as well, usual some sort of accident almost weekly, not sure about the death toll, but there have been quite a few undeniable fatalities. Apparently, standing on the tracks, and snapping a 'selfie' while the train approaches, is a social media thing as well. I don't do social media, but imagine there must be some FaceBook page, or website, that hosts these final photos, as well as the many other silly 'challenges' they think up, in which people are seriously hurt, or die.

Mostly, the threat, is that we are constantly losing, piece by piece. The diesel mass transit, will eventual be scrapped, and new 'Green' versions required. Still a waste of energy and resources, since too few make use of them.
17-05-2019 02:15
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
You just discard them.
Only when you misused them, such as trying to use a formula for a black body radiation to determine something that deals with gravity.


I never did that. You are lying again. Do you see a term for gravity in the Stefan-Boltzmann law equation?

radiance = SBconstant * emissivity * temperature ^ 4


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 17-05-2019 02:17
17-05-2019 02:19
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
HarveyH55 wrote:
The English people are funny in many ways, some not in such a good way...


Heh.They say the same thing about Americans.

The grass is always browner on the other side of the Pond, I suppose.


The Parrot Killer
17-05-2019 02:33
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Into the Night wrote:
dehammer wrote:
You just discard them.
Only when you misused them, such as trying to use a formula for a black body radiation to determine something that deals with gravity.


I never did that. You are lying again. Do you see a term for gravity in the Stefan-Boltzmann law equation?

radiance = SBconstant * emissivity * temperature ^ 4
YET you tried to use it as proof that my invention would not work.
17-05-2019 09:56
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
dehammer wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
dehammer wrote:
You just discard them.
Only when you misused them, such as trying to use a formula for a black body radiation to determine something that deals with gravity.


I never did that. You are lying again. Do you see a term for gravity in the Stefan-Boltzmann law equation?

radiance = SBconstant * emissivity * temperature ^ 4
YET you tried to use it as proof that my invention would not work.


Never did that either. I used the 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics to show why your invention wouldn't work.


The Parrot Killer
18-05-2019 13:29
paramount99
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
IBdaMann wrote:
Into the Night wrote:Predicting the temperature of the Earth is pointless. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth.

... but we can measure the temperature anomalies and just not mention the lack of any margin of error.







1880 to 2019 graphs measure nothing that comprises anything supportive of global warming trends or indeed fears.
874AD to 1204AD have equally very interesting periods of climate change - but are themselves insignificant in terms of global warming fears today.
These are simply tiny specs in the much larger, grand order of things...
18-05-2019 19:28
Into the Night
★★★★★
(9226)
paramount99 wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
Into the Night wrote:Predicting the temperature of the Earth is pointless. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth.

... but we can measure the temperature anomalies and just not mention the lack of any margin of error.







1880 to 2019 graphs measure nothing that comprises anything supportive of global warming trends or indeed fears.
874AD to 1204AD have equally very interesting periods of climate change - but are themselves insignificant in terms of global warming fears today.
These are simply tiny specs in the much larger, grand order of things...


They are actually random numbers. They are completely fake. It is not possible to measure the temperature of the Earth. We simply don't have enough thermometers, and satellites are incapable of measuring an absolute temperature since the emissivity of Earth is unknown and likewise cannot be measured.

Anyone claiming the Earth is warming, cooling, or just staying the same is making it up. There is no data.

We DO know that CO2 has no capability to warm the Earth. We also know that no gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth. We also know that our Sun has been a remarkably consistent star over the time that we've observed it. We also know the Earth is unevenly heated, producing our weather and it's many variations.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 18-05-2019 19:34




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