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How Do You Know When Climate Has Been Affected?


How Do You Know When Climate Has Been Affected?17-05-2019 19:09
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
I normally ask this question on every board I frequent and on this board I seem to be overdue, and then I was nudged by a discussion on another board.

So there I was, taking jabs at warmizombies on ProBoards when one of them reponded in that ever-so-educated English that we have come to expect from warmizombies:

sigurdur wrote: I know, don't "believe" mankind has an effect on climate change.

I am neither a dunce nor poor at economics.


That last comment of his pertains to my jabs at how economically illiterate Marxists are.

So, the question to all those believers in a global "Climate" ... who are forever screaming that "Climate is always changing!" ... how do you know when Climate has changed?

If the answer is that you really don't know, then the follow-on question is "Why do you believe that Climate is always changing?"


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-05-2019 19:49
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1230)
I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.

I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon. However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

Does that answer your question?
17-05-2019 20:00
HarveyH55
★★★☆☆
(807)
Because every year, it runs a little different. Sometimes it's kind of rough going, other years it's really mild. Sometimes you get some really extreme changes, that you remember for decades, and hope to never have to endure ever again. I know Florida's climate has changed quite a bit over the past 20 years, the winters barely get down to freezing, not even close to a hard freeze, which is great for killing off some of the bugs (damn lovebugs). Summers haven't gotten as hot either. It kind of getting to be like, what I hope 'Global Warming' really means, little to no winter cold, basically the same summer weather. Getting rid of the extreme winter cold, would change the yearly average temperature to appear there is warming, but not in bad, catastrophic way. Really, doesn't matter though, we can adapt to any climate, who cares if it changes, it's just a new challenge to overcome.
17-05-2019 20:15
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
GasGuzzler wrote:
I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.

This is just passing the buck. How does the <list authority here> know the climate has changed? What constitutes a 'change'? Passing the buck to the news media as the authority fails to answer the question.
GasGuzzler wrote:
I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon. However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

This is a circular argument that fails to answer the question. You are essentially saying that climate change is climate change.
GasGuzzler wrote:
Does that answer your question?

No, it doesn't answer his question. Neither does any of it define 'climate change' at all.


The Parrot Killer
17-05-2019 20:18
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
HarveyH55 wrote:
Because every year, it runs a little different. Sometimes it's kind of rough going, other years it's really mild. Sometimes you get some really extreme changes, that you remember for decades, and hope to never have to endure ever again. I know Florida's climate has changed quite a bit over the past 20 years, the winters barely get down to freezing, not even close to a hard freeze, which is great for killing off some of the bugs (damn lovebugs). Summers haven't gotten as hot either. It kind of getting to be like, what I hope 'Global Warming' really means, little to no winter cold, basically the same summer weather. Getting rid of the extreme winter cold, would change the yearly average temperature to appear there is warming, but not in bad, catastrophic way. Really, doesn't matter though, we can adapt to any climate, who cares if it changes, it's just a new challenge to overcome.


You have described variances in weather in Florida. How do you know the climate has changed? What constitutes a 'change' in climate? When is the moment this occurs?


The Parrot Killer
17-05-2019 20:20
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.

I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

You bet.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-05-2019 20:26
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
Into the Night wrote: I't answer his question. Neither does any of it define 'climate change' at all.

You have to remember that the question is supposed to be answered by those who believe in a Global Climate that is changing. I don't think GasGuzzler fits that bill.

On the other hand, this forum has some Climate believers from whom I'd be greatly interested in hearing their answers.


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
17-05-2019 21:45
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
IBdaMann wrote:


... how do you know when Climate has changed?
The question I always finds shuts them down is to ask them what the baseline for determining what the change should be.

They frequently will say before the industrial revolutions, where as I return, "you mean the little ice age when the temperature fell 3°C in half a century, and people were freezing to death, and crops fell from the sudden loss in climate?"

Very seldom do I get a response.

Usually, they will quote the hockey stick graph and I will show them graphs that show the mwp was in every continent except maybe middle Canada and northern central USA.
Edited on 17-05-2019 21:46
17-05-2019 22:07
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1230)
GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.


IBdaMann wrote: I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

The looming disaster is no laughing matter.
GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

IBdaMann wrote: It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

Almost a certainty. Using mutation proxy data, top scientists in Europe have linked warmer temperatures to a 97% increased rate in mutations. The expert scientific consensus is that zombies may be the least of our worries as more and more heat gets trapped in our atmosphere. I believe them.

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

IBdaMann wrote: They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

These brave souls are performing dangerous work. They really should wear life jackets while on the Arctic ice.
GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

IBdaMann wrote: You bet.

Happy to help. Let me know if I can answer any further questions.
Edited on 17-05-2019 22:31
17-05-2019 23:10
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1230)
GasGuzzler wrote:
[quote]GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.


IBdaMann wrote: I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

The looming disaster is no laughing matter.
GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

IBdaMann wrote: It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

Almost a certainty. Using several mutation proxy data studies, top scientists in Europe have linked warmer temperatures to a 97% increased rate of mutations. The expert scientific consensus is that zombies may be the least of our worries as more and more heat gets trapped in our atmosphere. I believe them.

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

IBdaMann wrote: They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

These brave souls are performing dangerous work. They really should wear life jackets while on the Arctic ice.
GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

IBdaMann wrote: You bet.

Happy to help. Let me know if I can answer any further questions.
Edited on 17-05-2019 23:11
18-05-2019 05:11
HarveyH55
★★★☆☆
(807)
Into the Night wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
Because every year, it runs a little different. Sometimes it's kind of rough going, other years it's really mild. Sometimes you get some really extreme changes, that you remember for decades, and hope to never have to endure ever again. I know Florida's climate has changed quite a bit over the past 20 years, the winters barely get down to freezing, not even close to a hard freeze, which is great for killing off some of the bugs (damn lovebugs). Summers haven't gotten as hot either. It kind of getting to be like, what I hope 'Global Warming' really means, little to no winter cold, basically the same summer weather. Getting rid of the extreme winter cold, would change the yearly average temperature to appear there is warming, but not in bad, catastrophic way. Really, doesn't matter though, we can adapt to any climate, who cares if it changes, it's just a new challenge to overcome.


You have described variances in weather in Florida. How do you know the climate has changed? What constitutes a 'change' in climate? When is the moment this occurs?


We haven't had the harsh extremes in nearly two decades now. Of course, I'm only going by personal experience, for the 31 years I've lived here, and haven't bother looking further back. I've seen the damage the freezing weather use to do to orange groves around here, acres of tree killed by it. Been a long time, since I've seen anything even remotely like that. Lot fewer orange groves these days, though. Guess affordable housing, and strip malls are more profitable...
18-05-2019 05:58
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
No one is denying that the climate warmed since the bottom of the little ice age, but that doesn't mean its man made.
18-05-2019 07:07
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
dehammer wrote:
No one is denying that the climate warmed since the bottom of the little ice age, but that doesn't mean its man made.

Which climate warmed? There is no such thing as a global climate.


The Parrot Killer
18-05-2019 12:52
paramount99
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
GasGuzzler wrote:
I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.

Truly: you cannot believe they have no reason to lie to you? Surely? Tell me you are having a laugh with us? Or on the other hand: do you ever question anything for yourself?

I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon. However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

See how you have been bullied into believing this rubbish?!? You are almost fearful - and they have done this to you. You must learn to question things you see or hear!

Does that answer your question?


It answers nothing...
18-05-2019 12:58
paramount99
☆☆☆☆☆
(39)
GasGuzzler wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.


IBdaMann wrote: I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

The looming disaster is no laughing matter.
GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

IBdaMann wrote: It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

Almost a certainty. Using mutation proxy data, top scientists in Europe have linked warmer temperatures to a 97% increased rate in mutations. The expert scientific consensus is that zombies may be the least of our worries as more and more heat gets trapped in our atmosphere. I believe them.

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

IBdaMann wrote: They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

These brave souls are performing dangerous work. They really should wear life jackets while on the Arctic ice.
GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

IBdaMann wrote: You bet.

Happy to help. Let me know if I can answer any further questions.



And then there was darkness... And soon the eclipse had passed!
18-05-2019 16:42
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
dehammer wrote:
No one is denying that the climate warmed since the bottom of the little ice age, but that doesn't mean its man made.

Question: When you use the word "climate" do you mean "average global temperature"?

i.e. "climate" = a temperature ?


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
18-05-2019 16:52
GasGuzzler
★★★★☆
(1230)
paramount99 wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.


IBdaMann wrote: I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

The looming disaster is no laughing matter.
GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

IBdaMann wrote: It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

Almost a certainty. Using mutation proxy data, top scientists in Europe have linked warmer temperatures to a 97% increased rate in mutations. The expert scientific consensus is that zombies may be the least of our worries as more and more heat gets trapped in our atmosphere. I believe them.

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

IBdaMann wrote: They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

These brave souls are performing dangerous work. They really should wear life jackets while on the Arctic ice.
GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

IBdaMann wrote: You bet.

Happy to help. Let me know if I can answer any further questions.



And then there was darkness... And soon the eclipse had passed!


Hey, do you have any idea how hard it is to type that shit? The whole time I'm thinking wow, I need need a high five in the face!
18-05-2019 19:41
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
GasGuzzler wrote:
paramount99 wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:
GasGuzzler wrote:I know the global climate is changing because every time I turn on the news they tell me about a climate disaster somewhere across the globe. They have no reason to lie to us. I believe them.


IBdaMann wrote: I genuinely appreciate your omission of smileys.

The looming disaster is no laughing matter.
GasGuzzler wrote: I'm still waiting for the effects of climate change where I live, but I'm certain it is coming soon.

IBdaMann wrote: It will undoubtedly be catastrophic. Do you think zombies will be involved?

Almost a certainty. Using mutation proxy data, top scientists in Europe have linked warmer temperatures to a 97% increased rate in mutations. The expert scientific consensus is that zombies may be the least of our worries as more and more heat gets trapped in our atmosphere. I believe them.

GasGuzzler wrote: However, I know for sure the Arctic Circle is where the effects of climate change are being felt the most because so much research is concentrated there.

IBdaMann wrote: They are studying the Arctic while it's still there. Any day now it will all be melted away so we have to get the research in while we can.

These brave souls are performing dangerous work. They really should wear life jackets while on the Arctic ice.
GasGuzzler wrote:Does that answer your question?

IBdaMann wrote: You bet.

Happy to help. Let me know if I can answer any further questions.



And then there was darkness... And soon the eclipse had passed!


Hey, do you have any idea how hard it is to type that shit? The whole time I'm thinking wow, I need need a high five in the face!

Parody comedy is hard to write, isn't it? I'll give you that high five. Face hurt yet?



The Parrot Killer
Edited on 18-05-2019 19:42
20-05-2019 22:11
Wake
★★★★★
(4026)
IBdaMann wrote:
I normally ask this question on every board I frequent and on this board I seem to be overdue, and then I was nudged by a discussion on another board.

So there I was, taking jabs at warmizombies on ProBoards when one of them reponded in that ever-so-educated English that we have come to expect from warmizombies:

sigurdur wrote: I know, don't "believe" mankind has an effect on climate change.

I am neither a dunce nor poor at economics.


That last comment of his pertains to my jabs at how economically illiterate Marxists are.

So, the question to all those believers in a global "Climate" ... who are forever screaming that "Climate is always changing!" ... how do you know when Climate has changed?

If the answer is that you really don't know, then the follow-on question is "Why do you believe that Climate is always changing?"


In the 50's when I was growing up it was hotter than hell all the time. For the last 10 or so years when we've been told it is burning how it has been warmer in Ketchikan, Alaska than in the San Francisco area.

Does this mean that the climate has varied in the bay area or does it mean that you can only use the mean global average to describe climate?
21-05-2019 18:39
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
Wake wrote:
IBdaMann wrote:
I normally ask this question on every board I frequent and on this board I seem to be overdue, and then I was nudged by a discussion on another board.

So there I was, taking jabs at warmizombies on ProBoards when one of them reponded in that ever-so-educated English that we have come to expect from warmizombies:

sigurdur wrote: I know, don't "believe" mankind has an effect on climate change.

I am neither a dunce nor poor at economics.


That last comment of his pertains to my jabs at how economically illiterate Marxists are.

So, the question to all those believers in a global "Climate" ... who are forever screaming that "Climate is always changing!" ... how do you know when Climate has changed?

If the answer is that you really don't know, then the follow-on question is "Why do you believe that Climate is always changing?"


In the 50's when I was growing up it was hotter than hell all the time.

A rather subjective opinion. Meaningless.
Wake wrote:
For the last 10 or so years when we've been told it is burning how it has been warmer in Ketchikan, Alaska than in the San Francisco area.

That is normal. Ketchikan can easily get warmer than San Francisco. So can Anchorage or even Fairbanks.
Wake wrote:
Does this mean that the climate has varied in the bay area or does it mean that you can only use the mean global average to describe climate?

There is no way to average a climate. Climate has no quantity.
Averaging temperatures is rather pointless. Temperature varies in all four cities.


The Parrot Killer
21-05-2019 21:39
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
Wake wrote: Does this mean that the climate has varied in the bay area or does it mean that you can only use the mean global average to describe climate?

You have to know what "Climate" is in order to describe it.

What is it?


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
22-05-2019 03:29
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Its simple.

climate noun
cli·​mate | \ ˈklī-mət
Definition of climate
1 : a region of the earth having specified climatic conditions
//His physician advised moving to a warmer climate.

2a : the average course or condition of the weather at a place usually over a period of years as exhibited by temperature, wind velocity, and precipitation
//a healthful climate
//a warm, humid climate
b : the prevailing set of conditions (as of temperature and humidity) indoors
//a climate-controlled office

3 : the prevailing influence or environmental conditions characterizing a group or period : atmosphere
//a climate of fear
//a climate of suspicion
//the cultural climate of the 1960s


I am sure for this discussion we can ignore 3.
22-05-2019 03:51
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
dehammer wrote:
Its simple.

climate noun
cli·​mate | \ ˈklī-mət
Definition of climate
1 : a region of the earth having specified climatic conditions
//His physician advised moving to a warmer climate.

2a : the average course or condition of the weather at a place usually over a period of years as exhibited by temperature, wind velocity, and precipitation
//a healthful climate
//a warm, humid climate
b : the prevailing set of conditions (as of temperature and humidity) indoors
//a climate-controlled office

3 : the prevailing influence or environmental conditions characterizing a group or period : atmosphere
//a climate of fear
//a climate of suspicion
//the cultural climate of the 1960s


I am sure for this discussion we can ignore 3.


Definition 1) is invalid. You can't define a word with itself. 'Climate' is defined as 'climatic conditions'. In other words, 'climate' is defined as 'climate'.

Definition 2) has no quantifiable value. Therefore you can't average it.

Definition 3) is unrelated to weather conditions.


The Parrot Killer
23-05-2019 03:53
dehammer
★★★☆☆
(431)
Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.
23-05-2019 10:53
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
dehammer wrote:
Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

There is no such thing as 'climate condition'.
dehammer wrote:
YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.

Scientists don't write dictionaries. Dictionaries don't even define words. They are not authoritative on any word. They do not own any word. Dictionaries even disagree with each other.

Science is defined through philosophy. Climate is defined by common use. It is subjective in nature. It has no quantity. There is nothing to average.

The definitions you gave have these problems. They are problems of logic. It is YOU that is trying to redefine them to something they aren't, and these definitions have problems in them already.


The Parrot Killer
23-05-2019 17:39
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
dehammer wrote: Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

What is the difference between two separate things that do not exist?

dehammer wrote: YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.

Actually, I define what is allowed and doable. I never let anyone, including scientists, do that for me. Ask my kids.

Now, having said that, I can't necessarily get them to do what they are supposed to do ... but I'm not going to allow them to tell me that their homework is "just not doable" or that housework is somehow "not allowed."

I make those determinations.

The one area, however, in which I run into roadblocks is physical/technological limitations, e.g. trying to get an average global temperature within a usable margin of error, etc..


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
23-05-2019 18:21
James___
★★★★☆
(1349)
dehammer wrote:
Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.



UBDamann and IBNotDaMann have been looking for a girlfriend. They're lonely and want to have a threesome, LOL (Lots Of Love) is what they want.
Scientists don't define what is possible.
The Sun orbits the Earth.
The Earth is flat.
Perpetual motion is impossible. The Moon perpetually orbits the Earth.
Powered flight is impossible.
The Sound Barrier cannot be broken.
The speed of light cannot be broken. Give it time.

While scientists were saying the Earth was flat, someone in Ancient Egypt used trigonometry to realize that the Earth was in fact round. They understood that math and observation agreed with each other.
When Galileo observed that Venus had phases, he was placed under house arrest by the Vatican. Apparently independent thought was not allowed, ie., such as UBDaMann and IBNotDaMann not supporting thoughts other than their own (´゚ 3∗ε ゚`).
Hopefully powered flight is obvious.
When chuck Yeager broke the speed of sound, many excuses were created such as things quit working when travelling faster than the speed of sound because sound would have to have been considered as what allowed work to be performed was that work was transmitted by sound waves. The argument wasn't considered in such a fashion/way.
One day they'll probably find that the light barrier is just that, another barrier to be broken.
23-05-2019 20:32
Into the Night
★★★★★
(8136)
James___ wrote:
dehammer wrote:
Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.



UBDamann and IBNotDaMann have been looking for a girlfriend. They're lonely and want to have a threesome, LOL (Lots Of Love) is what they want.
Scientists don't define what is possible.
The Sun orbits the Earth.
The Earth is flat.
Perpetual motion is impossible. The Moon perpetually orbits the Earth.
Powered flight is impossible.
The Sound Barrier cannot be broken.
The speed of light cannot be broken. Give it time.

While scientists were saying the Earth was flat, someone in Ancient Egypt used trigonometry to realize that the Earth was in fact round. They understood that math and observation agreed with each other.
When Galileo observed that Venus had phases, he was placed under house arrest by the Vatican. Apparently independent thought was not allowed, ie., such as UBDaMann and IBNotDaMann not supporting thoughts other than their own (´゚ 3∗ε ゚`).
Hopefully powered flight is obvious.
When chuck Yeager broke the speed of sound, many excuses were created such as things quit working when travelling faster than the speed of sound because sound would have to have been considered as what allowed work to be performed was that work was transmitted by sound waves. The argument wasn't considered in such a fashion/way.
One day they'll probably find that the light barrier is just that, another barrier to be broken.


It was Greece, not Egypt. Pythagoras first proposed it, Aristotle that gave a proof for it.

Eratosthenes measured fairly accurately the circumference of the Earth using shadows cast by sticks he planted vertically in different towns. No trigonometry was used by any of them to do this. He did this in Egypt, but he was a Greek that lived there at the time.

Trigonometry was developed by Hipparchus, in Greece. It was first used to calculate the movement of the zodiac through the night sky, several hundred years AFTER Pythagoras and even AFTER Eratosthenes.

Galileo observed the moons of Jupiter, not Venus. Venus has no moon. The Vatican is not science. It is the headquarters for a religion.

Powered flight is possible. No one ever said otherwise. A bird flies by powered flight. Any scientist that says birds are not powering their flight is an idiot. The question of whether man could build a machine that could do what birds do was the question. One of engineering, not science.

Science never had a theory stating the sound barrier was impassable. Some engineers thought that building an aircraft to exceed the speed of sound was impossible. Other engineers persevered and succeeded. Science was not involved. The difficulty was dealing with travel through the air that is compressing, rather than smoothly flowing over the flight surfaces. Since portions of the airflow was supersonic and portions were subsonic as you crossed the sound barrier, control flutter would destroy the aircraft. They brought flutter down to manageable level by using a delta wing. Chuck Yeager flew that aircraft, despite suffering a broken rib the previous day.

Aircraft are controlled by cables, pushrods, and torque rods. Modern jet aircraft have hydraulic assist (like power steering for airplanes), or electronic signals relaying control information to actuators. No sound waves control aircraft flight. No one ever built such an aircraft.

For mass to reach the speed of light, infinite energy must be used to do it. If you want to falsify Einstein, you will have to do better than just simply discard his theories. The harder you push the mass, the greater the mass seems to become. To get a mass to go at the speed of light, you have to push it infinitely hard. Observing a clock mounting on such a mass would show the clock is stopped. You can't give it time. It is no longer within the bounds of time as far as you can determine.

Things like warp drives in Star Trek and transporters are fictional devices used for the expediency of the plot.

If you are interested in dilithium crystals, though, you can buy them from Amazon.


The Parrot Killer
Edited on 23-05-2019 20:42
24-05-2019 04:40
James___
★★★★☆
(1349)
Into the Night wrote:
James___ wrote:
dehammer wrote:
Climate condition is not the same thing as a climate.

YOU can not define what is allowed and doable. Scientist do.



UBDamann and IBNotDaMann have been looking for a girlfriend. They're lonely and want to have a threesome, LOL (Lots Of Love) is what they want.
Scientists don't define what is possible.
The Sun orbits the Earth.
The Earth is flat.
Perpetual motion is impossible. The Moon perpetually orbits the Earth.
Powered flight is impossible.
The Sound Barrier cannot be broken.
The speed of light cannot be broken. Give it time.

While scientists were saying the Earth was flat, someone in Ancient Egypt used trigonometry to realize that the Earth was in fact round. They understood that math and observation agreed with each other.
When Galileo observed that Venus had phases, he was placed under house arrest by the Vatican. Apparently independent thought was not allowed, ie., such as UBDaMann and IBNotDaMann not supporting thoughts other than their own (´゚ 3∗ε ゚`).
Hopefully powered flight is obvious.
When chuck Yeager broke the speed of sound, many excuses were created such as things quit working when travelling faster than the speed of sound because sound would have to have been considered as what allowed work to be performed was that work was transmitted by sound waves. The argument wasn't considered in such a fashion/way.
One day they'll probably find that the light barrier is just that, another barrier to be broken.


It was Greece, not Egypt. Pythagoras first proposed it, Aristotle that gave a proof for it.

Eratosthenes measured fairly accurately the circumference of the Earth using shadows cast by sticks he planted vertically in different towns. No trigonometry was used by any of them to do this. He did this in Egypt, but he was a Greek that lived there at the time.

Trigonometry was developed by Hipparchus, in Greece. It was first used to calculate the movement of the zodiac through the night sky, several hundred years AFTER Pythagoras and even AFTER Eratosthenes.

Galileo observed the moons of Jupiter, not Venus. Venus has no moon. The Vatican is not science. It is the headquarters for a religion.

Powered flight is possible. No one ever said otherwise. A bird flies by powered flight. Any scientist that says birds are not powering their flight is an idiot. The question of whether man could build a machine that could do what birds do was the question. One of engineering, not science.

Science never had a theory stating the sound barrier was impassable. Some engineers thought that building an aircraft to exceed the speed of sound was impossible. Other engineers persevered and succeeded. Science was not involved. The difficulty was dealing with travel through the air that is compressing, rather than smoothly flowing over the flight surfaces. Since portions of the airflow was supersonic and portions were subsonic as you crossed the sound barrier, control flutter would destroy the aircraft. They brought flutter down to manageable level by using a delta wing. Chuck Yeager flew that aircraft, despite suffering a broken rib the previous day.

Aircraft are controlled by cables, pushrods, and torque rods. Modern jet aircraft have hydraulic assist (like power steering for airplanes), or electronic signals relaying control information to actuators. No sound waves control aircraft flight. No one ever built such an aircraft.

For mass to reach the speed of light, infinite energy must be used to do it. If you want to falsify Einstein, you will have to do better than just simply discard his theories. The harder you push the mass, the greater the mass seems to become. To get a mass to go at the speed of light, you have to push it infinitely hard. Observing a clock mounting on such a mass would show the clock is stopped. You can't give it time. It is no longer within the bounds of time as far as you can determine.

Things like warp drives in Star Trek and transporters are fictional devices used for the expediency of the plot.

If you are interested in dilithium crystals, though, you can buy them from Amazon.


Ditto, not parrot.
24-05-2019 20:03
IBdaMann
★★★★★
(3851)
James___ wrote: While scientists were saying the Earth was flat, someone in Ancient Egypt used trigonometry to realize that the Earth was in fact round. They understood that math and observation agreed with each other.

Wow, you must be right because your argument is what dead people understood ... at least that's what you're claiming ... and no one can ever cross-examine those dead people ... thus making your assertion completely unverifiable ... so you must be right.

So as long as there are people like you who "understand" that "math matches observation" then no scientist citing the Theory of Relativity is going to tell you that accelerating a mass beyond the speed of light is impossible! Just give it time!

How much time do you think you'll need, by the way?

James___ wrote: When chuck Yeager broke the speed of sound, many excuses were created such as things quit working when travelling faster than the speed of sound because sound would have to have been considered as what allowed work to be performed was that work was transmitted by sound waves.

After you finish chitting this out, please remember to flush.

James___ wrote: One day they'll probably find that the light barrier is just that, another barrier to be broken.

The current operating assumption that those stupid scientists will tell you is that the speed of light is the same for all observers.

... but I'm sure you "understand" otherwise, yes?


Global Warming: The preferred religion of the scientifically illiterate.

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist




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