Geoengineering to Neutralize Ocean Acidification

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07-04-2025 20:28
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Im a BM wrote: So let me be one of the very few who actually reads one of your posts and responds to it. "Climate cannot change" Tell that to the climate. And try to convince people not to believe their own lying eyes as they see extreme weather events become more and more frequent. Climate has no ears. Climate is not weather. It has no 'events'. Define 'extreme weather event'. Hurricanes? No noted increase in their number or intensity in the data, as kept by the National Hurricane Center. Thunderstorms? Happen all the time. Tornadoes? Happen all the time. Im a BM wrote: "Carbon is not carbon dioxide" Perhaps you should read more. "Carbon footprint" is not a reference to carbon as an element. "Carbon neutral" is not either. Indeed, it is quite common to reference carbon dioxide as simply "carbon". Carbon is not carbon dioxide. Wash your boots to get rid of carbon footprint. Im a BM wrote: "Fossils aren't used as fuel. Fossils don't burn" Is it possible that you really don't know what the term "fossil fuel" means? Fossils aren't used as fuel. Fossils don't burn. Im a BM wrote: "An acid is not an alkaline. Ocean water is not acidic." Actually, NOTHING is "an alkaline". Alkaline is not a noun. I don't see what this is a response to. Is somebody claiming that ocean water is acidic? YOU use 'alkaline' as a noun, claiming it's some sort of chemical. Denying your own posts never works. Im a BM wrote: Too many stupid claims to respond to so I'll just select a few more. "Alkalinity is not a substance." Repeated multiple times. No, it is not. However, aqueous solutions are substances that almost always have some alkalinity. Paradox. Irrational. You cannot argue both sides of a paradox. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: "Oxidation is not reduction." Said repeatedly. A truly brilliant insight... to counter which claim? Was something said that could be interpreted to imply that oxidation IS reduction? Denying your own posts never works. Im a BM wrote: "Carbon is not organic." Repeatedly said. Most of the world's carbon is, in fact, inorganic. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: A chemistry textbook, if you knew how to read one, would explain to you that carbon in chemically oxidized form (carbon dioxide, bicarbonate ion, carbonate ion) is defined as "inorganic carbon". Carbon is not oxidized and has no oxidized form. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Carbonate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: On the other hand, while it is less than half the total carbon in the world, there is a whole lot of organic carbon out there. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: An organic chemistry textbook, Chemistry is not a textbook. Im a BM wrote: if you knew how to read one, would explain to you that carbon in chemically reduced form is defined as "organic carbon" Carbon is not organic. Carbon cannot be 'reduced'. Im a BM wrote: Are you sure that your company doesn't sell "organic carbon" analyzers? Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: "No such 'parameter' or quantity called 'alkalinity'." Alikalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Total alkalinity = acid neutralizing capacity from all contributing oxyanions. Hydroxide alkalinity = that tiny fraction of total alkalinity arising from hydroxide ions Bicarbonate alkalinity = usually the lion's share of total alkalinity, it is the acid neutralizing capacity arising from bicarbonate ions. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Hydroxide is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: It has been long known that other oxyanions such as phosphate, silicate, borate, and many other oxyanions contribute to acid neutralizing capacity. But they are so much less than 1% of the total that they are ignored. Phosphate is not a chemical. Silicate is not a chemical. Borate is not a chemical. oxyanion is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: On the other hand, water chemists now deeply regret that they didn't take organic alkalinity seriously enough. Water is not a chemist. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Organic oxyanions, such as citrate, turn out to be a significant contributor to total alkalinity in many waters. Citrate is not a chemical. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: "Alkalinity is not a substance. It has no weight." Actually, the oxyanions that contribute alkalinity ALL have some weight. Oxanion is not a chemical. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Alkalinity has no weight. Im a BM wrote: "An acid is not an alkaline." The same meaningless sentence as before. NOTHING is "an alkaline" You wrote it. Im a BM wrote: "Alkalinity is not a substance or a valid word" I guess you will have to rewrite the chemistry textbooks AND the dictionary, because they are under the impression that is IS a valid word. Chemistry is not a textbook. Chemistry is not a dictionary. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: I'm sure that there will be a very lengthy response to this, but this is the last time I will bother responding to or even reading another parrot poop post. Argument of the Stone fallacy. Bulverism fallacy. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
07-04-2025 20:33
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Im a BM wrote: Even under the best-case climate change mitigation scenarios, Climate cannot change. There is nothing to 'mitigate'. Im a BM wrote: atmospheric concentrations of carbon will only gradually decline. The next rain will wash it out of the air. Easy-peasy. Im a BM wrote: Even if we cease all fossil fuel combustion tomorrow, ocean "acidification" (i.e. depletion of alkalinity) would continue to get worse for decades to come. Fossils aren't used as fuel. You cannot acidify an alkaline. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Direct human intervention to perform environmental chemotherapy Buzzword fallacy. No such word. Im a BM wrote: and provide exogenous alkalinity to the sea by ourselves, dumping gigatons of lime or grinding up gigatons of rocks to transport and distribute to the sea is a non-starter. It is simply not humanly possible to provide the quantities required. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Lime is already in the sea. Im a BM wrote: Coastal wetlands are the major source of new alkalinity entering many marine ecosystems, as submarine groundwater discharge. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Under the low oxygen conditions of wetland soil, bacteria use sulfate as oxidant to oxidize organic carbon and acquire energy. Sulfate reduction by bacteria generates inorganic carbon alkalinity rather than carbon dioxide as the oxidized carbon product. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: If anyone is curious, there are three distinctly different geoengineering approaches that could be applied to increase the generation of alkalinity for the sea through oxidation of wetland sediment organic carbon via microbial sulfate reduction. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Sulfate is not a chemical. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
07-04-2025 20:42
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Im a BM wrote: A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Okay. Im a BM wrote: Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Carbon is not organic. Carbon is not carbon dioxide. Im a BM wrote: Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Carbon dioxide is not carbon. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. Sulfate is not a chemical. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Carbonate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Acidification is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Sulfate is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. You said the peat was below sea level. Now it's above it at the same time???? Paradox.Irrational. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate.[quote]Im a BM wrote: Nitrogen is not ammonia. Ammonium is not a chemical. Nitrogen is not organic. Nitrate is not a chemical. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
07-04-2025 21:15
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	The Scientific Genius of Into the Night *Something is not* something else.** Only a scientific genius would know to point that out. It explains everything. It is enough to make the entire argument. No other point need be made. Something is not something else. To the new viewer: When you see the red-orange parrot picture to the left, it is a quick warning to beware of parrot poop. It's all you'll ever find under the parrot. Once you've seen one pile of parrot poop, you've seen them all. Unless you need constant refresher science classes because you just can't grasp the concept that something is not something else. Something that is not a chemical is not a chemical. Science is not something that is not science. And there is no such thing as something that doesn't even exist. Gosh, you can learn a lot from parrot poop! Into the Night wrote: Im a BM wrote: A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Okay. Im a BM wrote: Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Carbon is not organic. Carbon is not carbon dioxide. Im a BM wrote: Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Carbon dioxide is not carbon. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. Sulfate is not a chemical. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Carbonate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Acidification is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Sulfate is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. You said the peat was below sea level. Now it's above it at the same time???? Paradox.Irrational. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate.[quote]Im a BM wrote: Nitrogen is not ammonia. Ammonium is not a chemical. Nitrogen is not organic. Nitrate is not a chemical.
08-04-2025 22:14
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
09-04-2025 00:50
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
09-04-2025 02:43
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Im a BM wrote: A cheap and simple way to help the sea. The sea doesn't need help. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Buzzword fallacies. Im a BM wrote: Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Carbon is not organic. Im a BM wrote: Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Im a BM wrote: Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. Sulfate is not a chemical. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Carbonate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Acidification is not a chemical. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
10-04-2025 00:08
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
10-04-2025 06:12
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Stop spamming.
10-04-2025 18:40
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
11-04-2025 12:05
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
RE: A cheap and simple way to help the sea14-04-2025 03:14
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
RE: The Origin of Photosynthesis20-04-2025 01:33
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark.
21-04-2025 06:55
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: The Origin of Photosynthesis Photosynthesis was not invented. sealover wrote: ...removed remaining spam... Stop your bullshitting. Stop spamming. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
24-04-2025 01:26
IBdaMann★★★★★ (15024)	sealover wrote: The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. How did you acquire your omniscience? I'm interested in verifying your story outside of belief a priori.
24-04-2025 04:28
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	IBdaMann wrote: sealover wrote: The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. How did you acquire your omniscience? I'm interested in verifying your story outside of belief a priori. The kind of omniscience that would enable me to unilaterally declare, over and over and over again, that "There is no such thing as biogeochemistry." Some people just know EVERYTHING. Deal with it!
24-04-2025 06:47
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Im a BM wrote: IBdaMann wrote: sealover wrote: The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. How did you acquire your omniscience? I'm interested in verifying your story outside of belief a priori. The kind of omniscience that would enable me to unilaterally declare, over and over and over again, that "There is no such thing as biogeochemistry." Some people just know EVERYTHING. Deal with it! So you finally admit there is no such thing as 'biogeochemistry'. Good for you! The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
25-04-2025 07:22
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. -------------------------------------------------- The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark.
25-04-2025 17:53
Swan★★★★★ (7463)	sealover wrote: April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. -------------------------------------------------- The Origin of Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark. lol FACEBOOK IS THE LEGAL OWNER OF EVERYTHING THAT YOU POST THERE. Are you aware of this? IBdaMann claims that Gold is a molecule, and that the last ice age never happened because I was not there to see it. The only conclusion that can be drawn from this is that IBdaMann is clearly not using enough LSD. According to CDC/Government info, people who were vaccinated are now DYING at a higher rate than non-vaccinated people, which exposes the covid vaccines as the poison that they are, this is now fully confirmed by the terrorist CDC This place is quieter than the FBI commenting on the chink bank account information on Hunter Xiden's laptop I LOVE TRUMP BECAUSE HE PISSES OFF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT I CAN'T STAND. ULTRA MAGA "Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody, I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat." MOTHER THERESA OF CALCUTTA So why is helping to hide the murder of an American president patriotic? Sonia makes me so proud to be a dumb white boy Now be honest, was I correct or was I correct? LOL
25-04-2025 20:09
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. -------------------------------------------------- The Origin of ANOXYGENIC Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. It did NOT produce oxygen during photosynthesis. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark. lol FACEBOOK IS THE LEGAL OWNER OF EVERYTHING THAT YOU POST THERE. Are you aware of this? - Swan Perhaps that means it is free game for them to do as they please with it. Or for ANYONE to do as they please with it. I guess I wouldn't have citable copyrights. Ah, shucks! Has Facebook ever gotten a Nobel Prize before? The Origin of OXYGENIC Photosynthesis The following became the PROPERTY of Facebook, earlier today! Oxygenic photosynthesis, such as when cyanobacteria use solar energy to produce oxygen waste product, first evolved in just about the same place that ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis first evolved. And manganese was still part of the process. It was a microsite in the sea, very close to the coastline. Photo oxidized manganese(IV) flowed into the sea there. With no ozone to shield the surface of the continent(s), ultraviolet radiation bombarded the land above sea level. Manganese can photooxidize much more easily than other elements. And there was plenty of manganese(II) being dissolved from the rocks, without the help of any microorganisms. The sun's low end ultraviolet rays photo oxidized manganese on the land, and oxidized manganese flowed to the sea. ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis got it's ancestral beginning in this place. A hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing, chemoautotrophic bacteria went there because it was about the ONLY place to find any terminal electron acceptors that could be used to oxidize the hydrogen free lunch. Millions of years later, these coastal microsites became the reductant "deserts" of the sea. These were places where all the energy-rich REDUCTANTS, such as hydrogen and hydrogen sulfide, were depleted from the sea water. The presence of photo oxidized manganese(IV) made it possible for organisms to oxidize all the hydrogen, hydrogen sulfide, etc. With so much manganese(IV) around to oxidize them, there weren't any reductants left to use for anoxygenic photosythesis. These reductant "deserts", still rich in sunlight, created a new niche for a new kind of photosynthesis that did not depend on energy-rich reductants. The new mutant who could use the WEAKEST reductant of them all would get a shot at all that unclaimed sunlight. Someone had already evolved to feed in NITRITE, NO2-, as reductant for anoxygenic photosynthesis. Nitrite is an energy-poor, WEAK reductant. The photosystem that could use photo oxidation to oxidize nitrite had to generate a LOT of voltage, compared to those that use stronger reductants. One of his mutant offspring ramped up the voltage even higher. The new mutant photosystem could generate enough voltage in photo oxidation to tear WATER molecules apart as "reductant" for photosynthesis. Unlike his oldest ancestor, he no longer used hydrogen as reductant for photosynthesis. But he still kept manganese atoms around at his photosystem reaction center, for photo oxidation purposes. He couldn't grow very fast. He wasted a LOT of solar energy just to make oxygen as a WASTE product. But out in the reductant desert, he could be the slow growing KING. His faster growing competitors couldn't make any trouble for him without any of those high-energy reductants in the water. And he did it AT LEAST 3500 million years ago. LONG before oxygenic photosynthesis became the pathway used by the dominant community in the sea, it thrived in microsites of reductant "deserts". You're welcome! Edited on 25-04-2025 20:51
26-04-2025 02:24
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. You never posted any science, Robert. Good riddance of your spam. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan Edited on 26-04-2025 02:25
RE: Branner deleted the New Messiah threads!02-05-2025 00:43
Im a BM ★★★★★ (2496)	Into the Night wrote: sealover wrote: April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. You never posted any science, Robert. Good riddance of your spam. Good riddance to the New Messiah and his psychotic spam rampage. Branner actually deleted the ransom-demanded-to-release-hostage-divine-plan threads after all. I wonder why he decided to do so NOW? It wasn't the first time he saw a whole bunch of New Messiah threads. Maybe their quality diminished, so he no longer likes them as much as he used to? I'm not going to try to look inside that sausage maker to figure out how it works. New Messiah is finally gone. But so is everyone else!
02-05-2025 01:27
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. -------------------------------------------------- The Origin of ANOXYGENIC Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. It did NOT produce oxygen during photosynthesis. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark. lol FACEBOOK IS THE LEGAL OWNER OF EVERYTHING THAT YOU POST THERE. Are you aware of this? - Swan Perhaps that means it is free game for them to do as they please with it. Or for ANYONE to do as they please with it. I guess I wouldn't have citable copyrights. Ah, shucks! Has Facebook ever gotten a Nobel Prize before? The Origin of OXYGENIC Photosynthesis The following became the PROPERTY of Facebook, earlier today! Oxygenic photosynthesis, such as when cyanobacteria use solar energy to produce oxygen waste product, first evolved in just about the same place that ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis first evolved. And manganese was still part of the process. It was a microsite in the sea, very close to the coastline. Photo oxidized manganese(IV) flowed into the sea there. With no ozone to shield the surface of the continent(s), ultraviolet radiation bombarded the land above sea level. Manganese can photooxidize much more easily than other elements. And there was plenty of manganese(II) being dissolved from the rocks, without the help of any microorganisms. The sun's low end ultraviolet rays photo oxidized manganese on the land, and oxidized manganese flowed to the sea. ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis got it's ancestral beginning in this place. A hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing, chemoautotrophic bacteria went there because it was about the ONLY place to find any terminal electron acceptors that could be used to oxidize the hydrogen free lunch. Millions of years later, these coastal microsites became the reductant "deserts" of the sea. These were places where all the energy-rich REDUCTANTS, such as hydrogen and hydrogen sulfide, were depleted from the sea water. The presence of photo oxidized manganese(IV) made it possible for organisms to oxidize all the hydrogen, hydrogen sulfide, etc. With so much manganese(IV) around to oxidize them, there weren't any reductants left to use for anoxygenic photosythesis. These reductant "deserts", still rich in sunlight, created a new niche for a new kind of photosynthesis that did not depend on energy-rich reductants. The new mutant who could use the WEAKEST reductant of them all would get a shot at all that unclaimed sunlight. Someone had already evolved to feed in NITRITE, NO2-, as reductant for anoxygenic photosynthesis. Nitrite is an energy-poor, WEAK reductant. The photosystem that could use photo oxidation to oxidize nitrite had to generate a LOT of voltage, compared to those that use stronger reductants. One of his mutant offspring ramped up the voltage even higher. The new mutant photosystem could generate enough voltage in photo oxidation to tear WATER molecules apart as "reductant" for photosynthesis. Unlike his oldest ancestor, he no longer used hydrogen as reductant for photosynthesis. But he still kept manganese atoms around at his photosystem reaction center, for photo oxidation purposes. He couldn't grow very fast. He wasted a LOT of solar energy just to make oxygen as a WASTE product. But out in the reductant desert, he could be the slow growing KING. His faster growing competitors couldn't make any trouble for him without any of those high-energy reductants in the water. And he did it AT LEAST 3500 million years ago. LONG before oxygenic photosynthesis became the pathway used by the dominant community in the sea, it thrived in microsites of reductant "deserts". You're welcome!
05-05-2025 07:21
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: April 24, 2025 - I will not be posting any more new science essays at this website. The continuation will be at Facebook. Since April 19, the newest essays are all there. See the "Ecology and Evolutionary Biology" group, the "Speculative Evolution Enthusiasts" group, and "The Geologist" group, among others. My name at Facebook, and throughout most of the rest of the world, is Robert Northup. You're a liar, Robert. You're still here. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
06-07-2025 19:37
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	24390 "views" of this thread, as of July 6, 2025. More than 2200 new "views" in the past two months, during which time it was mostly buried way down where someone has to click "View older threads" just to see it. The press coverage of the horrific coral bleaching that occurred in 2024, in places such as the Great Barrier Reef continues to note that this relatively new problem is almost certainly due to anthropogenic global warming. BUT, I was delighted to see that just this week some "mainstream" news stories about the massive coral bleaching events of 2024 are also noting that ocean acidification is also a contributing factor. "Acidification" being the slightly diminished pH as carbonate alkalinity is depleted by pH buffering. When it gets too hot, the coral expels the symbiotic algae living within it. The coral may or may not eventually recover. When carbonate ion gets too depleted, because it is consumed to neutralize acid, forming bicarbonate ion, the coral has difficulty acquiring enough carbonate ion to form calcium carbonate shell. If "acidification" alone were the problem, the main harm would be much slower growth rates of corals, and diminished survival rates for larvae of shell-forming mollusks, etc. If global warming alone were the problem, the main harm would be sporadic "bleaching" events, from which many corals could recover. But the double whammy of both global warming and ocean acidification makes the corals especially at risk. I hope that this year (2025) we will not see too many new record-breaking coral "bleaching" events. I hope that some of that horrific loss from 2024 can eventually recover. My main pet topics at climate-debate.com were about applied biogeochemistry to address ocean acidification, to maximize carbon sequestration by agroecosystems, and to minimize emission of greenhouse gases such as nitrous oxide, methane, and carbon dioxide. But I am also an avid fan of paleobiogeochemistry... -------------------------------------------------- The Origin of ANOXYGENIC Photosynthesis The very first photosynthetic bacteria was the MUTANT offspring of a hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotrophic bacteria. It did NOT produce oxygen during photosynthesis. Before this mutant ever got personally involved with the use of solar energy, his ancestors went scrounging about for photooxidized manganese in the water. Oxidized manganese can be used as a terminal electron acceptor to oxidize hydrogen. Reduced hydrogen, H2, is an energy-rich reductant that was available in the sea water. Coupling manganese reduction to hydrogen oxidation was a good way to make a living. Oxidized hydrogen, H2O, is the innocuous waste product of this hydrogen oxidation for energy reaction. Back in those days, a bacteria could find plenty of energy-rich reductants. There just weren't many good terminal electron acceptors around. Photooxidation of elements like manganese by the sun's ultraviolet rays was almost the only source of any oxidants a bacteria could find. They could find the most photooxidized manganese by being close to the high light zone where it gets made. Indeed, there may have been fierce competition to be the first to get that photooxidized manganese as it was generated. There was plenty of hydrogen to oxidize. The oxidized manganese they acquired was only good for one time use. One (photo)oxidized atom of manganese couldn't be used to oxidize more than one molecule of hydrogen. And then along came a MUTANT. He took in oxidized manganese from the water. But unlike his ancestors, he kept the manganese inside the cell, even after it had been reduced. He was already up in the high light zone, fighting to have first dibs on photooxidized manganese. Now he had reduced manganese inside the cell, getting photooxidized by low end ultraviolet radiation. A terminal electron acceptor for hydrogen oxidation was being generated by INTRACELLULAR PHOTOOXIDATION. Photooxidize a manganese atom, and then reduce it by oxidizing hydrogen for metabolic energy. Photooxidize that same manganese atom again. Oxidize hydrogen again. Photoxodize manganese again. Repeat. This mutant hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing chemoautotroph could now just sit there and take in the sun while he sucked in the hydrogen. He didn't need to go out and find any photooxidized manganese in the water anymore. It wasn't red light emanating from a hot vent of hydrogen on the sea floor. It was low end ultraviolet light straight from the sun, near the sea water surface. He found a way to use a little bit of sunlight energy to help him take advantage of the hydrogen free lunch. He was the simplest kind of archaebacteria. The kind of organism most likely to actually remain viable after an interstellar journey. The kind of organism we would want to include in the payload on Tony's Ark. lol FACEBOOK IS THE LEGAL OWNER OF EVERYTHING THAT YOU POST THERE. Are you aware of this? - Swan Perhaps that means it is free game for them to do as they please with it. Or for ANYONE to do as they please with it. I guess I wouldn't have citable copyrights. Ah, shucks! Has Facebook ever gotten a Nobel Prize before? The Origin of OXYGENIC Photosynthesis The following became the PROPERTY of Facebook, earlier today! Oxygenic photosynthesis, such as when cyanobacteria use solar energy to produce oxygen waste product, first evolved in just about the same place that ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis first evolved. And manganese was still part of the process. It was a microsite in the sea, very close to the coastline. Photo oxidized manganese(IV) flowed into the sea there. With no ozone to shield the surface of the continent(s), ultraviolet radiation bombarded the land above sea level. Manganese can photooxidize much more easily than other elements. And there was plenty of manganese(II) being dissolved from the rocks, without the help of any microorganisms. The sun's low end ultraviolet rays photo oxidized manganese on the land, and oxidized manganese flowed to the sea. ANOXYGENIC photosynthesis got it's ancestral beginning in this place. A hydrogen-oxidizing, manganese-reducing, chemoautotrophic bacteria went there because it was about the ONLY place to find any terminal electron acceptors that could be used to oxidize the hydrogen free lunch. Millions of years later, these coastal microsites became the reductant "deserts" of the sea. These were places where all the energy-rich REDUCTANTS, such as hydrogen and hydrogen sulfide, were depleted from the sea water. The presence of photo oxidized manganese(IV) made it possible for organisms to oxidize all the hydrogen, hydrogen sulfide, etc. With so much manganese(IV) around to oxidize them, there weren't any reductants left to use for anoxygenic photosythesis. These reductant "deserts", still rich in sunlight, created a new niche for a new kind of photosynthesis that did not depend on energy-rich reductants. The new mutant who could use the WEAKEST reductant of them all would get a shot at all that unclaimed sunlight. Someone had already evolved to feed in NITRITE, NO2-, as reductant for anoxygenic photosynthesis. Nitrite is an energy-poor, WEAK reductant. The photosystem that could use photo oxidation to oxidize nitrite had to generate a LOT of voltage, compared to those that use stronger reductants. One of his mutant offspring ramped up the voltage even higher. The new mutant photosystem could generate enough voltage in photo oxidation to tear WATER molecules apart as "reductant" for photosynthesis. Unlike his oldest ancestor, he no longer used hydrogen as reductant for photosynthesis. But he still kept manganese atoms around at his photosystem reaction center, for photo oxidation purposes. He couldn't grow very fast. He wasted a LOT of solar energy just to make oxygen as a WASTE product. But out in the reductant desert, he could be the slow growing KING. His faster growing competitors couldn't make any trouble for him without any of those high-energy reductants in the water. And he did it AT LEAST 3500 million years ago. LONG before oxygenic photosynthesis became the pathway used by the dominant community in the sea, it thrived in microsites of reductant "deserts". You're welcome!
08-07-2025 03:55
IBdaMann★★★★★ (15024)	sealover wrote:BUT, I was delighted to see that just this week some "mainstream" news stories about the massive coral bleaching events of 2024 are also noting that ocean acidification is also a contributing factor. You are gullible in that way. No bleaching occurs. There is no bleach. Ask any chemist. sealover wrote: "Acidification" being the slightly diminished pH as carbonate alkalinity is depleted by pH buffering. ... except that no rational adult has any reason to believe that this is happening. The only ones who believe this could happen are momentarily forgetting that water evaporates ... or never learned. sealover wrote: When it gets too hot, the coral expels the symbiotic algae living within it. They are called "zooxanthellae" sealover wrote: The coral may or may not eventually recover. The corals always recover; they just need a little time for more zooxanthellae to take up shop. sealover wrote: When carbonate ion gets too depleted, The ocean never becomes depleted of carbonates. sealover wrote: the coral has difficulty acquiring enough carbonate ion to form calcium carbonate shell. Nope. Corals have it good. They live in an ocean of carbonates (pun intended). sealover wrote: If "acidification" alone were the problem There isn't any problem. You're babbling at this point. sealover wrote: the main harm would be There isn't any harm. The reason that those Dominican reefs have always been thriving is that there is no problem, there is no threat, and there is no harm. Why you deluded yourself into believing that thriving Dominican coral reefs had somehow died because of a nonexistent problem involving the ocean somehow becoming depleted of carbonates ... was absolutely stupid on your part. Tell me, what grown adult doesn't know that water evaporates and that the ocean is full of an abundance of carbonates? Who? Any thoughts? sealover wrote: If global warming alone were the problem, the main harm would be sporadic "bleaching" events, from which many corals could recover. Hmmmmm, let's see, all corals recover from having jettisoned their zooxanthellae and no coral reefs have died (they're all still thriving) ... it seems like you are trying to write some sort of science fiction thriller. Can I proof-read it? sealover wrote:But the double whammy of both global warming and ocean acidification makes the corals especially at risk. There are no whammy's, there is no Global Warming and there is no ocean acidification. Don't you think it's about time you hang it up? ... or at least talk to a chemist and get the straight scoop? sealover wrote:I hope that this year (2025) we will not see too many new record-breaking coral "bleaching" events. Stupid comment. Nobody tracks such a thing. Corals don't self-report expelling zooxanthellae. Nobody is monitoring all the world's individual corals. Corals recover fully from the natural process of expelling zooxanthellae. Remind me how the sky is falling? Seriously, talk to a chemist, and not one of those biogenie-types.
25-08-2025 04:21
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
28-08-2025 23:55
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Acidification is not chemical. You cannot acidify an alkaline. Iron isn't organic. [b]sealover wrote: A cheap and simple way to help the sea.[/b] Expensive machines to pump sea water into sea water doesn't accomplish anything. sealover wrote: Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The sea hasn't risen. Carbon is not organic. Carbon is not peat. sealover wrote: The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Pumping sea water into sea water does nothing. Sulfate is not a chemical. Sulfate cannot be reduced. Carbon is not organic. No such thing as 'terminal electron acceptor'. Oxygen is not an electron. Sulfate is not an energy. sealover wrote: Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Carbon is not oxygen. Carbon is not organic. Carbon is not carbon dioxide. sealover wrote: Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate is not a chemical. It cannot be reduced. Carbon is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. sealover wrote: Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. Carbon is not organic. Acidification is not a chemical. sealover wrote: The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Sulfate is not a chemical. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Go learn hydrodynamics. sealover wrote: Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. The sea hasn't risen. Go learn hydrodynamics. sealover wrote: That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. Alkalinity is not a chemical. sealover wrote: It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. Nitrogen is not organic. Nitrate is not a chemical. sealover wrote: It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Iron is not organic. Alkalinity is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Metal is not complex. There is no single 'seawater pH'. Illiteracy: singular used for plural. [quote]sealover wrote: Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Iron is not a salt. Iron is not organic. sealover wrote: Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Iron is not organic. Singular used for plural. Iron is not oxygen. sealover wrote: Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. Alkalinity is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Organometallic is not a chemical. Iron is not oxygen. sealover wrote: The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron. Carbonate is not a chemical. Nitrogen is not organic. Iron is not organic. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
29-08-2025 02:26
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
29-08-2025 20:21
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. ... Stop spamming. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan
18-09-2025 20:51
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
23-09-2025 23:37
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. A cheap and simple way to help the sea. Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
24-09-2025 20:54
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	Stop spamming.
23-10-2025 17:55
sealover ★★★★☆ (1902)	This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. [b]A cheap and simple way to help the sea.[/b] Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in inorganic salts (ferric chloride, etc.) are not soluble at sea water pH. Ferric iron ions in organometallic complexes (ferric citrate, etc.) are soluble at the higher pH. Ferrous iron ions in inorganic salts (ferrous sulfate, etc.) are soluble at sea water pH. However, they are readily oxidized to ferric iron in the presence of oxygen, by iron oxidizing bacteria. And that ferric iron is NOT soluble at sea water pH. Ferrous iron in submarine groundwater discharge is often chelated by organic alkalinity. Within the organometallic complex, the reactive sites on the ferrous iron are occluded from access for oxidation. They remain soluble, and stable, protected from oxidation. The fisheries near the wind turbine are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of carbonate ions to form calcium carbonate shell. They are benefitting from the increased bioavailability of nitrogen as fertilizer. And they especially benefit from no longer being so limited by the bioavailibility of iron.
30-10-2025 23:17
Into the Night★★★★★ (23165)	sealover wrote: This example uses a wind turbine to pump sea water. However, there can be advantages to accomplishing the same objective with sea wave powered pumps. Especially where there is little wind, the waves will never stop. Translating the energy of wave motion into pumping sea water requires fewer moving parts than a wind turbine, and may be economically and technologically a lot more feasible for moving sea water through buried organic matter to generate alkalinity to neutralize ocean acidification and supply the sea with iron. Stop spamming. Alkalinity is not a chemical. You can't acidify an alkaline. [b]sealover wrote: A cheap and simple way to help the sea.[/b] Your buzzwords do not help the sea. sealover wrote: Imagine a simple wind turbine standing in very shallow sea water off the coast of Southeast Asia. Just like the old Dutch wind turbines that enabled them to farm below sea level, this simple turbine drives a water pump. The turbine is standing over a recently submerged peatland. Now below sea level, an enormous reservoir of gigatons of organic carbon sits down below the wind turbine. Carbon is not organic. Peat is not carbon. sealover wrote: The wind turbine takes in sea water and drives it down a shallow tube into the sea floor. The boring cores acquired while they drilled to install the tube revealed the precise depth of a thick layer of pure peat, near the surface. Now the wind turbine drives sulfate-rich sea water down the tube into that submerged peat layer. Sulfate reducing bacteria were already in the water, and they exploit the abundance of organic carbon, using sulfate as terminal electron acceptor to oxidize it for metabolic energy. Combustion or aerobic respiration of organic carbon produces carbon dioxide as the inorganic carbon product of oxidation. Peat does not form underwater. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. There is no such thing as a terminal electron acceptor. sealover wrote: Anaerobic sulfate reduction oxidizes organic carbon, but the inorganic carbon product of that oxidation is ALKALINITY, not carbon dioxide. Sulfate reduction generates bicarbonate ions and carbonate ions as the inorganic carbon product of organic carbon oxidation. These help neutralize acidification. The wind turbine keeps driving more and more sea water down into the submerged peatland sediments. A continuous flow carries sulfate rich sea water further and further into the sediments. It contains PLENTY of sulfate to generate alkalinity. Sulfate is not a chemical. Carbon is not organic. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Bicarbonate is not a chemical. Carbonate is not a chemial. You can't acidify an alkaline. Peat bogs do not form under the sea. sealover wrote: Eventually, that flow of water comes back into the sea, further offshore than the wind turbine, through the same seeps that used to carry submarine groundwater discharge into the sea when the peatland was still above sea level. [quote]sealover wrote: That submarine groundwater discharge (SGD), or maybe now we should call it "submarine sea floor water discharge", is loaded with alkalinity. It also has a lot of nutrients that marine ecosystems need. It contains nitrogen, primarily as ammonium or dissolved organic nitrogen, and NOT much nitrate. It contains all the basic nutrient elements marine organisms need. This includes the elusive iron that so often limits the ability of plankton to feed the sea. Alkalinity is not a chemical. Ammonium is not a chemical. Nitrogen is not organic. Nitrate is not a chemical. Iron is not water. Iron is not plankton. sealover wrote: The iron in this solution now flowing into the sea is primarily in forms that remain soluble, despite the above neutral pH of sea water. Organic alkalinity, arising from the oxyanions of organic acids, comes with metal complexing power. The iron in the submarine groundwater discharge is held in stable organometallic complexes that do not precipitate at sea water pH. Alkalinity is not a chemical (or organic, or an acid). There is no such thing as 'complexing power'. Water is not iron. Metal is not organic. Sea water pH is not a chemical. Buzzword fallacies. The Parrot Killer Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit nuclear powered ships do not require nuclear fuel. - Swan While it is true that fossils do not burn it is also true that fossil fuels burn very well - Swan

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