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Can CO2 capture be a starter for geothermal energy?


Can CO2 capture be a starter for geothermal energy?29-01-2020 23:39
Daumic
☆☆☆☆☆
(2)
CO2 capture is actually seen as a necessary burden for fighting the climate change. But if we aggregate some technologies, CO2 capture can perhaps become the starter of deep geothermal energy. Geothermal heat is a renewable energy that has a great value because it is not sporadic contrary to wind or sun light but has high investment costs. CO2 capture in ultramafic rocks like peridotite can reduce these investment costs.

a) CO2 capture in ultramafic rocks works by chemical reaction between CO2 and MgO contained in rock. This reaction is exothermic (760 kJ / kg) and thus can produce hot water. The article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter permits to imagine the following process:

- two vertical wells to reach a deep layer of peridotite,
- horizontal drill between the vertical wells with a hydraulic fracturing,
- water circulating in the fractured zone reaches a high pH by dissolution of a little part of Mg2+ contained in the rock,
- this high pH water captures CO2 from air when it is pumped out of the outlet well,
- injection of this carbonated solution in the inlet well,
- a great part of the dissolved CO2 reacts with rock in the fractured zone to form solid carbonate ; water becomes again basic before reaching the outlet well for a new cycle of CO2 capture,
- the reaction between CO2 and MgO in peridotite gives a high temperature to the circulating water, temperature perhaps sufficient for urban heating.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105

b) Peridotite contains a high percentage of MgO but also a smaller percentage of FeO. As seen before in (a), the injected water reaches high temperature and high pH. High pH and high temperature make possible the oxidation of Fe2+ by water. This reaction produces hydrogen gas H2 (2). If we can produce hydrogen besides CO2 capture, the economical value of this gas can lighten the cost of wells and fracturing.

(2) https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/tel-00934238/

c) USGS and other geological administrations have produced maps where are located deposits of ultramafic rocks (3). These maps show that the CO2 capture and hydrogen production can be made in many countries.

(3) https://pubs.usgs.gov/ds/414/downloads/DS414_text_508.pdf

d) Hydraulic fracturing has benefited recently a major improvement: the refracking (4). This technique consists to fracturing a new zone using an ancient vertical well. The process has permitted the cost reduction of shale gas extraction. How can we apply this for CO2 capture? When the fractured zone is saturated with CO2, we can use the same vertical wells to fracture another zone of peridotite deeper than the saturated zone. Step by step, we can use the same wells to reach deeper and hotter rocks.

(4) https://petroleumconnection.com/refracking-great-expectations-for-the-second-time-around/

CO2 capture in peridotite can aggregate three productions:
- hot water for heating,
- hydrogen gas for industrial use or electric generation,
- very hot water for electric generation.

The economic value of these productions can facilitate CO2 capture and clean geothermal energy.
30-01-2020 00:17
IBdaMannProfile picture★★★★★
(7465)
Daumic wrote: CO2 capture is actually seen as a necessary burden for fighting the climate change.

You obviously didn't get the memo. Climate Change has been stopped. We fixed the problem. Now we don't need to worry about it.

Have you thought about how you are going to spend all that extra free time you are going to have now that you don't need to worry about Global Warming and Greenhosue Effect? ... or how you'll spend all that money that won't need to go towards carbon taxes to save the planet?

You should have seen the celebrations in Philadelphia the day that the news broke that Climate Change is gone forever. Man, they practically tore that city down.

Anyway, even if it's a little belated, enjoy the new world. You can be happy again.


.


A Spaghetti strainer with the faucet running, retains water- tmiddles

Clouds don't trap heat. Clouds block cold. - Spongy Iris

Printing dollars to pay debt doesn't increase the number of dollars. - keepit

If Venus were a black body it would have a much much lower temperature than what we found there.- tmiddles

Ah the "Valid Data" myth of ITN/IBD. - tmiddles

Ceist - I couldn't agree with you more. But when money and religion are involved, and there are people who value them above all else, then the lies begin. - trafn

You are completely misunderstanding their use of the word "accumulation"! - Climate Scientist.

The Stefan-Boltzman equation doesn't come up with the correct temperature if greenhouse gases are not considered - Hank

:*sigh* Not the "raw data" crap. - Leafsdude

IB STILL hasn't explained what Planck's Law means. Just more hand waving that it applies to everything and more asserting that the greenhouse effect 'violates' it.- Ceist
30-01-2020 03:17
HarveyH55
★★★★★
(2399)
Sounds a lot like a perpetual motion machine scheme. It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air. CO2 is a trace gas, only 0.04% of the total atmosphere, so you aren't going to capture a whole lot, quickly. Least not enough to power such a scheme, in any useful way. Haven't really looked at carbon capture in a couple years, there were 6 main technologies, only one looked to be going commercial, at the time. All were basically proof-of-concept, and basically set and forget. Don't remember water involved either. Basically, feel-good machines, to spend lots of tax dollars on, which don't really do much of anything useful for the investment made. Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water. Beer is full of CO2, but doesn't get unpleasantly acidic, and is mostly water.

As more places fall victim to the lure of quick cash, from the carbon-tax. And the push for energy from renewable sources. Energy is going to be more expensive, and less will be available to justify the silly high prices. High priced, energy wasting, feel-good projects won't be so popular, since there will be larger economic concerns.

There were some rumors of a new, Norwegian carbon-capture process, but no details. Probably just the meds talking though.
01-02-2020 15:20
tmiddlesProfile picture★★★★★
(3375)
Daumic wrote:
...CO2 capture in ultramafic rocks....
Wow! Weird stuff. That it's exothermic is pretty cool. "The reaction is highly exothermic and rock temperatures can be raised by about 260 °C (500 °F),"
05-02-2020 23:28
Daumic
☆☆☆☆☆
(2)
HarveyH55 wrote:
It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air.
Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water.


As shown in the article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter, CO2 capture occurs naturally in Oman. The volume of CO2 removed from atmosphere each year is great. Furthermore, hydraulic fracturing multiplies the contact area between water and rock and by this way accelerates the carbonation of peridotite. Despite the little solubility of CO2 in water, a fractured peridotite can capture a great volume of CO2.

About the cost of CO2 capture, I hope that the heat and the hydrogen produced during the process of capture compensate this cost by their economic values.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105
06-02-2020 17:08
James___
★★★★★
(3172)
Daumic wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air.
Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water.


As shown in the article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter, CO2 capture occurs naturally in Oman. The volume of CO2 removed from atmosphere each year is great. Furthermore, hydraulic fracturing multiplies the contact area between water and rock and by this way accelerates the carbonation of peridotite. Despite the little solubility of CO2 in water, a fractured peridotite can capture a great volume of CO2.

About the cost of CO2 capture, I hope that the heat and the hydrogen produced during the process of capture compensate this cost by their economic values.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105



At the same time the IPCC states that removing CO2 from the atmosphere will hurt the ozone layer. They do not know why this is but does need to be understood. Then an actual solution could be pursued.
06-02-2020 19:58
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13295)
James___ wrote:
Daumic wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air.
Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water.


As shown in the article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter, CO2 capture occurs naturally in Oman. The volume of CO2 removed from atmosphere each year is great. Furthermore, hydraulic fracturing multiplies the contact area between water and rock and by this way accelerates the carbonation of peridotite. Despite the little solubility of CO2 in water, a fractured peridotite can capture a great volume of CO2.

About the cost of CO2 capture, I hope that the heat and the hydrogen produced during the process of capture compensate this cost by their economic values.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105



At the same time the IPCC states that removing CO2 from the atmosphere will hurt the ozone layer. They do not know why this is but does need to be understood. Then an actual solution could be pursued.

What's to understand? The IPCC is full of shit like usual. There is no problem to solve.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
06-02-2020 20:31
James___
★★★★★
(3172)
Into the Night wrote:
James___ wrote:
Daumic wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air.
Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water.


As shown in the article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter, CO2 capture occurs naturally in Oman. The volume of CO2 removed from atmosphere each year is great. Furthermore, hydraulic fracturing multiplies the contact area between water and rock and by this way accelerates the carbonation of peridotite. Despite the little solubility of CO2 in water, a fractured peridotite can capture a great volume of CO2.

About the cost of CO2 capture, I hope that the heat and the hydrogen produced during the process of capture compensate this cost by their economic values.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105



At the same time the IPCC states that removing CO2 from the atmosphere will hurt the ozone layer. They do not know why this is but does need to be understood. Then an actual solution could be pursued.

What's to understand? The IPCC is full of shit like usual. There is no problem to solve.



I'm one of those people that support innovation. There's no reason why we can't pursue cleaner air and a healthier environment is there?
Oh Hog (pork is good!), I'm back to being an environmentalist again.
06-02-2020 21:12
Into the NightProfile picture★★★★★
(13295)
James___ wrote:
Into the Night wrote:
James___ wrote:
Daumic wrote:
HarveyH55 wrote:
It'll take a lot of energy to do all that pumping, not to mention the need to build up pressure. Carbon capture, also requires a considerable amount of energy to move air.
Carbonic acid is kind of weak, and you can't concentrate it, by just 'forcing' more CO2 into the water.


As shown in the article "In situ carbonation of peridotite for CO2 storage" (1) of Peter B. Kelemen and Jürg Matter, CO2 capture occurs naturally in Oman. The volume of CO2 removed from atmosphere each year is great. Furthermore, hydraulic fracturing multiplies the contact area between water and rock and by this way accelerates the carbonation of peridotite. Despite the little solubility of CO2 in water, a fractured peridotite can capture a great volume of CO2.

About the cost of CO2 capture, I hope that the heat and the hydrogen produced during the process of capture compensate this cost by their economic values.

(1) https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2008/10/31/0805794105



At the same time the IPCC states that removing CO2 from the atmosphere will hurt the ozone layer. They do not know why this is but does need to be understood. Then an actual solution could be pursued.

What's to understand? The IPCC is full of shit like usual. There is no problem to solve.



I'm one of those people that support innovation. There's no reason why we can't pursue cleaner air and a healthier environment is there?

None. Indeed, this is a big part of my business.
James___ wrote:
Oh Hog (pork is good!), I'm back to being an environmentalist again.

Careful what names you take to yourself. Caring about waste and doing something about it is one thing, joining the Church of Green is quite another. Only one is being an environmentalist, the other hijacks the name and uses it to try to implement fascism.

Cleaning up polluted areas and reducing waste is good for business. It is good for big corporations too. It is good for everyone.

Of course, there are individuals, businesses, and big corporations that litter and don't seem to care about the money and resources they waste. To say that all individuals, all businesses, or all big corporations litter, however, is bigotry.


The Parrot Killer

Debunked in my sig. - tmiddles

Google keeps track of paranoid talk and i'm not on their list. I've been evaluated and certified. - keepit
Edited on 06-02-2020 21:13




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